davidm Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I was asked to setup an Epic to jam sync to external timecode from a slate today. The timecode source menu was switched to external and the incoming timecode was verified by a green highlighted "TC" element in the main display. The timecode appeared to auto jam correctly as the Epic timecode numbers continued to count correctly after the external timecode was disconnected. What seems odd is that the manual says the camera can be placed in "Jam Sync mode" and there is a "SYNC" (Jam Sync) element on the main display but there is no description of how this actually works or under what conditions the "SYNC" element would be highlighted. Firmware 2.0.5 (current version) Can any Epic experts out there shed share some knowledge on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 The manual isn't great. Page 159: A SMPTE timecode input signal provides a frame accurate time stamp for each frame of recorded video. External TC must be chosen in the Project > Timecode menu. When SMPTE timecode is detected it will align the internal TC at every :00 frame crossing to the external time. They really should provide a "step 1, step 2, step 3" approach. But what you did was correct. If you're recording dual-system sound, I would follow that by downloading the R3D file to a laptop, copying over the sound file, and make sure everything syncs up and stays in sync for a few minutes, verifying the workflow. They also comment earlier in the manual: The timecode counter always updates at the same frame rate as the recording, irrespective of whether the camera is operating in normal or Vari-Speed recording mode. This ensures that a valid SMPTE timecode is created without count jumps that would affect clip playback during editing. If operating in Jam Sync mode referenced to an external timecode source, the clip’s master time reference point is the first frame of the recorded clip. Note that the visible timecode in the viewfinder and on monitors is typically a second off from actual recorded timecode, at least until it goes into record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidm Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Thanks Marc. I suspected a poorly written manual. It's a mute Epic / 5D shoot. The editor asked for a timecode slate on any 5D vision filmed at the same time as Epic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 We sent the Epic trilevel sync and TC, and after the usual new-camera-menu-patrol found the settings and got it to take the incoming feeds. Post said the sync to my files was fine. One note--while the scratch audio I sent to the camera sounded clean through headphones on the camera while rolling, the resulting files had a strange electronic interference in them.... phil p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisH Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Argh yes I'm not sure which is worse for audio the red or the 5d considering their price difference this is ridiculous. Either way both cameras are barely even worthy of a scratch track. I believe we all owe thanks to zaxcom for making the erx1tcd so we have a one piece solution to these crappy cameras. I say stick to film or if you must use the Alexa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Gilchrist Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Argh yes I'm not sure which is worse for audio the red or the 5d considering their price difference this is ridiculous. Either way both cameras are barely even worthy of a scratch track. I believe we all owe thanks to zaxcom for making the erx1tcd so we have a one piece solution to these crappy cameras. I say stick to film or if you must use the Alexa. Some Red owner swear by the Red's sound capabilities despite my experience on well over 300 hours of doc interviews done with the camera and the only guy I've worked for using the 5d/7d platform that wanted a feed to the camera said it was useful well less than a quarter of the time. That said, I have little input as regards the camera platform chosen for a job so I need to be prepared for any eventuality. Best regards, Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Argh yes I'm not sure which is worse for audio the red or the 5d considering their price difference this is ridiculous. Sorta/kinda good news: the brand new Canon EOS-5D Mark III has a headphone jack for the first time. Somebody is listening (literally). The bad news is, the old Mark II will still be available and they're going to cut the price on it, so the cheapskates will run out and buy this for $1200 and try to shoot projects on it. Do a search on "sound problems" on the RedUser.net forum, and you'll be overwhelmed with messages. The camera makes beautiful pictures, but there are some issues that have yet to be resolved. At least now, you can turn off the limiter in the camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameronlenart Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Currently working with the Epic am I'm being pinged by post for the timcode being way out. The question I have was asked by OP, The TC Symbol on the EPIC's LCD is highlighted but SYNC is not highlighted. I'm feeding it timcode from a Deneke GR-2. Are there any menu options I should be selecting on the Epic to highlight the SYNC symbol? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 If you have it set up right then both "sync" and "TC" should be green. The most likely culprit is not sending the camera what it has been set to receive. Sync should be in external. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameronlenart Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The camera is set to external sync, the TC on bottom right of LCD is correct, TC is green but Sync is not green. I'm supplying TC out of the GR-2 via BNC to the red 4 pin lemo, the GR-2 is in JC (jam continuos mode). I'm not sure what to try next to get the 'sync' to go green. Is the 'sync' symbol reserved for framerate sync not timcode sync? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The camera is set to external sync, the TC on bottom right of LCD is correct, TC is green but Sync is not green. I'm supplying TC out of the GR-2 via BNC to the red 4 pin lemo, the GR-2 is in JC (jam continuos mode). I'm not sure what to try next to get the 'sync' to go green. Is the 'sync' symbol reserved for framerate sync not timcode sync? If the camera is set to external sync, are you feeding it Genlock? This is what the camera expects to see in this mode. You can't get genlock from a GR-2, but you can get it from an SB-T. The manual says (page 38): SYNC Green - A genlock signal compatible with the current project and monitor rates has been locked to and the sensor timing is also locked to it. I've been able to get Red Epics and Red Ones to stay in precise sync all day long just feeding them external TC and running them in that mode, without genlock. I do rejam after lunch break, so typically I can get 5-6 hours continuous without a problem. You do need to keep an eye on the camera after they do a battery change or a speed change, because sometimes when it comes back, the timecode reverts to 00:00:00:00. The latest software builds over the last year have not had this problem very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I work Epics all the time. Due to issues w/ sync when changing batteries, shutting down and rebooting etc we found it just easier to feed it both genlock (trilevel) and TC. Most of these shoots were actually 2 Epics--using Lockits on both kept them in sync with each other. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameronlenart Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Thanks for your replies, I appreciate the help. I'm trying to achieve what you mentioned, feed the camera TC from my GR-2 without genlock. When I said I had it set on 'external sync' I meant that it was in 'external timcode' mode. How do I ensure the camera is not expecting to see a genlock signal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 Manual at this link: https://www.red.com/downloads/4f56854e6261f95a570006a5 Timecode jamming discussed on page 37: TC Green - Analog time code is being used to jam the time of day time code. TC will revert to gray if the signal is no longer detected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 " I'm being pinged by post for the timcode being way out. " why are you being pinged ?? I'm sure your TC is fine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominiquegreffard Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Have you tried another cable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 This could be a PBUC Problem: problem between User and Camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Orusa Posted March 3, 2013 Report Share Posted March 3, 2013 I just finished a shoot using an ERX2TCD on Red Epic. Mono audio scratch track to the Ch1 Mic jack and TC going into the brain's Sync Lemo 4 pin connector. Worked like a charm, saving post hours of manually syncing. The green TC light illuminated and that is all - no SYNC light. Project -> Timecode -> External Brain. Mark O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted March 3, 2013 Report Share Posted March 3, 2013 Just for elaborate a bit, on the Epic (thus, the Scarlet, too), with the letters "TC": Grayed Out = no time code is being received. Red = time code is being received but the camera is not jamming to it. Green = time code is being received and the camera is jamming to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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