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Eric Burge

RastOrder Cart: SU-01V

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Sorry the cart is not configured yet, but you'll get the idea. Probably won't get it well dialed until this fall at which time I'll post a follow-up. Note the break-down feature and groovy roller-skate wheels on the top mod allowing me to roll it into my truck.

I mounted the 01V and traveler so you can better see utility and scale. All (most?) of my electronics will stay on the top mod and all power stuff except distro will live below. 2-3U drawer will go under bottom mod full shelf. Still leaves room in the bottom mod for all my power needs.

Still planning to keep a chase cart handy for larger jobs, but this will be a big upgrade for me.

EB

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Not exactly sure how this post attachment thing works, but I suspect my pics are too big at 640/480. Oops. No time now, but will down-resolve in the future.

EB

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FSBELLA   

EB,

ok, I remember this cart from down under. cool to see Dave Diamond on his site.

my buddy just spent $4- $4500 on his custom chinda su cart. there both pretty trick.

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Will you be recording w/ a laptop or?  How dop the two halves

connect to each other?  Love the skate wheels on the top half to it can roll too.

Philip Perkins

Yes, Philip, I'm sending the O1V96 out through the MOTU to a Powerbook running BoomRecorder for multi-tracking (ADAT X8, AES X2 S/PDIF X2). Running additional AES X4 to a 744T for mix backup and for real-time dailies mirror to D-RAM, since the 2.10 fix. Thus far, I've only used the 744 as 2-track in this scheme, but maybe that will change. I'm still waiting for a SD firmware update to allow selectable clocking from incoming AES or other input, or not at all. (Supposedly, 7 Series now default clocks to 1st detected WC. Easy to create unintentional WC loop if using as master, which I am. Much discussion about this on Jeff's board under "recording direct to computer") Current lack of menu selection for this is kind of messing with my maximizing work flow options. I've talked with Jon T about this a number of times and hear it's definitely on the To-Do list. Darts anyone? Inside joke for some... ;~}

I'll admit that this particular cart design..as currently seen in the above photos...is (maybe?) lacking slightly in terms of optimizing this style of lap-top master recording, but everybody has a different palette and I already have some ideas as to how I can trick it out. I'll need to play with it for a while first though to get a better feel for the new vertical layout. Rob and I discussed this very issue extensively and I'm satisfied in knowing that a number of options do exist; it's just a matter of figuring what works best for me.

We also discussed incorporating a slide-out shelf for laptop use, but there are numerous trade-offs in doing this. According to Rob, this approach currently works well for his RM carts designed to hold road cases (as seen in pics on his site), but it isn't so robust as he'd like to see when transposed onto the general SU architecture. I also don't like the idea of expanding the cart width more than necessary for times when I may be forced to move a number of times through narrow doorways. IMO, one of the great features of this cart is with its ability to minimize regular breakdown necessity. Why would I want to incorporate the opposite into it?

OTOH, I've seen some pretty cool swinging and sliding shelf designs or home-brew mods that various folks have done for laptop-based BR, PT, and MC systems. I'm still watching and learning. For what I'm doing now, it will certainly work as is and very well at that, but it may warrant some mods in the future. (Can all things all-ways be better?) Therein lies the fun and adventure farther down the trail.

I now plan to park my PB on the top 1/2 shelf, but I have other ideas for that space later on. If I park it on the full shelf, the screen will hide meters and control access for rack-mount gear. A Mac Mini may solve this, but I don't know that much about them, and I remember reading something about Billy S having recent problems with his Mini. My PowerBook is working well for me so far so I'm not in a hurry to change. I will be (finally) upgrading to a MacBook Pro pretty soon though, but the footprint will be the same. OTOH, I can use the Apple remote to stop and start, which would be very convenient.

I'm also hoping Take V will develop a good MMC for BR soon. Then I could easily monitor the laptop screen on the top 1/2 shelf, but have the convenience to stop and start from the 01V.

Listening, Take???

EB

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takev   

MMC? you mean MIDI Control Surface support?

When I change Boom Recorder to Leopard only application this may become possible in a way I like it.

BTW, I just bought Final Cut Studio 2 yesterday and played a bit with Soundtrack Pro. It includes a pretty good foley library now, they definitely tried to make soundtrack pro much more useful for film. I haven't tried BWF files yet, but it says it does support automatic reconforming.

Cheers,

    Take

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MMC? you mean MIDI Control Surface support?

When I change Boom Recorder to Leopard only application this may become possible in a way I like it.

BTW, I just bought Final Cut Studio 2 yesterday and played a bit with Soundtrack Pro. It includes a pretty good foley library now, they definitely tried to make soundtrack pro much more useful for film. I haven't tried BWF files yet, but it says it does support automatic reconforming.

Cheers,

    Take

Take, you're the man!

Yes, I've always heard it as MMC, MIDI Machine Control. Same I guess. I did see FCS2 & Soundtrack Pro at NAB, but didn't get to spend time with it. Big mobs and I run...

EB

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I forget whose it was, but there was a pretty trick cart shown here in the "images" section a short while ago that had TWO swing out shelves for 2 laptops @ once, and the base cart was similar to yours.  You couldn't go thru a doorway with the shelves deployed, but they swung back over the cart proper for moving.

Philip Perkins

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Laptops/notebooks & keyboards – I put a laptop shelf in Skeets SU cart way back      http://www.rastorder.com.au/product_susound.htm  & last year I remade it. Weight was always an issue, but that was his decision as to what he was putting in the top module of cart. Otherwise it worked well; he also uses a mouse on the full shelf in front of him.

Shoehorning an O1V into the SU was no mean feat, when Eric first asked about a laptop shelf I was still a bit shell-shocked.

There are two basic problems compounded by the O1V – weight and vertical height. As it was I made enough vertical height to allow standard XLR connectors into the top rear of the O1V without Eric having to replace them with right angle ones.

A sideways sliding laptop shelf first of all needs to have very long sliders (18 inches) to go out far enough to fit the width of the laptop – I need to source ones that weigh a quarter of the ones I use for the mixer sliding shelf. ?????

There also needs to be room for that shelf – below the main full shelf & above the mixer on the sliding mixer shelf.

That could be achieved by utilising a modified SU video top module. By having the extra 2” under the full shelf, and reducing the top half shelf height. This is a trade-off, but in my opinion is better than going to

a full size video top module. Because the cart would be too big – Video Assist people don’t have much choice as most of them want to put a military style computer housing on the top full shelf.

Originally that half shelf space was designed for DATS & monitors, however recorders are getting smaller & LCD monitors can be mounted off the side. 

The other option I now see I can do is to put a keyboard sliding shelf – sliding forward – under the full shelf, and above the mixer on the mixer sliding shelf. The keyboard could then be pulled out over the mixer only when needed & pushed back in when not.

This would work well as the width is there & weight would not be such an issue.

It could be that providing Eric puts right angle connectors into the rear of the O1V there may be vertical room for one on his cart. – Something to think about Eric, as you are paddling down the river.

I would appreciate any constructive comments.

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Laptops/notebooks & keyboards – I put a laptop shelf in Skeets SU cart way back      http://www.rastorder.com.au/product_susound.htm  & last year I remade it. Weight was always an issue, but that was his decision as to what he was putting in the top module of cart. Otherwise it worked well; he also uses a mouse on the full shelf in front of him.

Thanks for posting the link above. I took the liberty to modify the link because there was a trailing space (probably just a typo) after the underscore that follows "product". Removing that space made it a good link.

Regards,  Jeff Wexler

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G'day Mr. Stalder

Don't start thinking too creatively or my cart will be obsolete before I even configure it!

OTOH, you are a smart man. I just took a look at the clearance and, sure enough, the over mixer sliding shelf will work quite well. You beat me to it, but still, g'd on ya, mate. I was going to start looking at similar options after I return from AK.

RA XLRs would probably be necessary, but no biggie to make up a bunch either. Soldering has replaced my tying flies for several years now as my winter-time outlet and I was starting to run out of cable needs. X12 redundancy on every possible configuration was getting a little OTT :))

OK, get to work, Rob. I'll contact you OG and discuss details. Narrower (width, not thickness)  gliders may help to maximize clearance, but maybe not necessary either.

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I would appreciate any constructive comments.

Nice work.  I like the idea of a pull-out shelf for the laptop, but putting it right under the mixer might be a bad layout as the screen, opened up in "record" mode, might block access to the mixer.  Or maybe I'm just not imagining it correctly.

I have a swing-out tray for my laptop which works pretty well.  It fits neatly under the mixer when not in use and swings to the right of the mixer when in use.  The only sort of problem with it is that is it not stable enough a mechanism to attach the laptop to the tray and leave it there full time.  I'm trying to figure out a secure way to attach my computer to it that has some sort of a "quick release" mechanism for something more elegant than my current setup (gaffer's tape!)

Another unrelated issue I can see with your cart is the front wheels.  While I understand the weight benefits of small casters, they certainly make going over broken-up roads like we have here in NYC a hassle (not to mention piles of five-wire feeder cable strewn everyhwere).  It may not be an issue for some, but for me, after trying it both ways for years, the extra weight that comes with a pneumatic tire is totally worth it. 

nvt

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Nice work.  I like the idea of a pull-out shelf for the laptop, but putting it right under the mixer might be a bad layout as the screen, opened up in "record" mode, might block access to the mixer.  Or maybe I'm just not imagining it correctly.

I have a swing-out tray for my laptop which works pretty well.  It fits neatly under the mixer when not in use and swings to the right of the mixer when in use.  The only sort of problem with it is that is it not stable enough a mechanism to attach the laptop to the tray and leave it there full time.  I'm trying to figure out a secure way to attach my computer to it that has some sort of a "quick release" mechanism for something more elegant than my current setup (gaffer's tape!)

Another unrelated issue I can see with your cart is the front wheels.  While I understand the weight benefits of small casters, they certainly make going over broken-up roads like we have here in NYC a hassle (not to mention piles of five-wire feeder cable strewn everyhwere).  It may not be an issue for some, but for me, after trying it both ways for years, the extra weight that comes with a pneumatic tire is totally worth it. 

nvt

When I had a cart of this general config (no where near as hip, the old "Skyline/3-G Welding" type) the idea was to get over cables etc by leaning the cart back off its small wheels and going over in two-wheel, on the pneumatics only.  It worked pretty well, but everything does have to be bolted down pretty well.  It was a little goosey w/a top-heavy cart, but most folks have their battery on the bottom and that seemed to counter a fairly heavy recorder (Nagra) on the top.  My Magliner horizontal cart finally has "fatties" all around, and takes bumps a lot easier now, although the mod added a lot of weight to the whole deal.

Philip Perkins

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Nice work.  I like the idea of a pull-out shelf for the laptop, but putting it right under the mixer might be a bad layout   Or maybe I'm just not imagining it correctly.

While I understand the weight benefits of small casters,

Found an old picture which shows configuration. Sliding shelf out the side for laptop - does mean you have to lean forward & to side to get at it, but you could have mouse on fixed shelf above mixer. Also means sliders have to be at least 18 inches to get width of laptop out & these are heavy... I am still looking at lighter options.

Something else I could do, (as mentioned earlier) is put a keyboard shelf under fixed shelf above mixer, (full width but short F to B). This would be lighter and you could pull it in & out as needed.

Question Could you use a separate keyboard with any laptop??

By the way I have spent many hours trying to devise a swing out laptop shelf - I've about given up.

Your second point - small castor wheels - I am very consious of weight. I use 3inch castors, maybe I will go to 4 inch, but they are considerably heavier & steal another 1 1/2 inches of vertical real estate. I would also have to do a bit of re-jigging to make sure the overall height didn't increase.

What I have done is set the handles down a bit (anyone can try this), it means you can still balance the cart tipped over just a little. Once off the castors the 20 inch wheels will go over almost anything.

Rob

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Your second point - small castor wheels - I am very consious of weight. I use 3inch castors, maybe I will go to 4 inch, but they are considerably heavier & steal another 1 1/2 inches of vertical real estate. I would also have to do a bit of re-jigging to make sure the overall height didn't increase.

What I have done is set the handles down a bit (anyone can try this), it means you can still balance the cart tipped over just a little. Once off the castors the 20 inch wheels will go over almost anything.

It's a tradeoff -- weight vs. maneuverability.  Personally I choose maneuverability because I spend a *lot* more time pushing the cart around on rough ground (all day sometimes) than I do lifting it up stairs etc (usually only once or twice a month if that), but that's just me.

The problem with having to tip it is that it requires more physical exertion (especially if the cart is already heavy with gear etc) and balance.  It's fine for just quickly going over one feeder cable, but if you have to push the cart down three pot-hole laden streets or broken sidewalks, or grass or a dirt path or cobblestone streets, keeping it in "tipped" position over all that rough ground can get tiresome pretty quick.  On top of that, there's always loose things placed on shelves, cables someone forgot to tie, etc etc that have a bad habit of falling off when you tip the cart.  And finally, the hard casters really don't go over *any* obstacles very easily -- it requires constant tipping and leveling unless you're on a smooth surface.  With a pneumatic wheel, you can simply push the thing while it's level and the wheels do all the work for you.  I've spent years doing it both ways and personally much prefer the latter.

.02 nvt  

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