orionflood Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 You hear all the time how actors and camera guys had to or are still living homeless in LA waiting for the big break. I've never heard of a sound guy living homeless. I'm a young guy still and want to go to LA to get the education and experience that comes with it. It'd be nice if I had some income while doing it too but don't expect it. I'm close to getting in the union but again that would be just to gain more education and meet other sound mixers. I have great credits in the midwest and could probably make 50k a year working here, but most veterans I know went to LA for some fragment of time and learned a good portion of their craft there from the old timers and being involved in that community. Don't worry I see no point in taking a 100 dollar a day gigs and cheapening the craft, but if I had to live out of a van to go to seminars put on by Coffey/Trew or learn how to work a fishers boom through unions seminars I would do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 The conundrum is staying alive, fed and sheltered while also making contacts and being available last minute. It's very tough. I'd advise a lot of strategic planning from wherever you are, including making and saving as much money as you can, and doing research to plan your move to LA. My son did this, using the web to find job leads and a cheap place to live before he moved to LA, as well as making some quick visits to get the lay of the land before he actually moved there. Have a plan--it may not be a great plan, but you need to have a plan. phil p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Toline Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Better to be a big fish in a small pond than a small fish in a big pond. $50k a year is not too shabby, stay where you are, increase your knowledge and client base. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason porter Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 excellent advice. I would love to live in my hometown (or any place where real estate/property taxes aren't through the roof) Consider your cost of living where you are VS where you want to live. Better to be a big fish in a small pond than a small fish in a big pond. $50k a year is not too shabby, stay where you are, increase your knowledge and client base. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gilbert Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Where would you charge your batteries? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryF Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Electric eels, I assume. Larry F Where would you charge your batteries? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 $50k out of LA is not a bad living. None of us are getting rich out here. Quality of life is an important factor. And who knows, your state could become the next Louisiana the moment you move out. Honestly, if you want to be a boom/utility guy and learn from an experienced mixer, move to where the work is. Quality shows in Los Angeles have their pick of experienced crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Toline Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Where would you charge your batteries? Same place all the hybrid cars charge theirs. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orionflood Posted April 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Hi Robert, I understand what you mean, but with the possibility of making union rates and then added equipment rentals at a great rate...I don't quite see where 50k is decent. Especially when at least according to the 2011 salary posting here almost 80 percent of the people were above 50k. Almost 9 percent above 200k... Philip thanks for the advice, I am trying to make a plan, but as you basically have to be in LA to join the union... Is there really a way to start getting jobs before one moves to an area in the field? I wish I could just search the web for job leads but to me at least this field doesn't seem to work this way Eric, I understand what you mean unfortunately all of a sudden there is no pond though. I can count all the production companies on one hand in my area and I can't call them everyday asking for work. I would like to think that cream rises to the top and if I hit my face to the grind stone I can make some headway in a city where there is endless work only competition standing in the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 " the possibility of making union rates and then added equipment rentals " whoa... you need to get the union gigs, and there is competition for them all... if you are utility/boom there is no gear rental, and on the "tier" / sideletter gigs the rates can get pretty low, not to mention paying not only the union dues, but also the initiation... and if you want to be a mixer, the "tier"/sideletter gigs still can get pretty low rates... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 I think that survey was very misleading. Nowhere near 9% of mixers are making over $200k. Perhaps 9% of jwsound members who chose to answer the survey make over $200k, but that's no way to judge income potential. I had my best year ever last year, and I didn't get there. I probably won't this year either. Even the over $50k number is skewed, if you consider cost of living and investment in equipment. I'm just saying, in this landscape, that you have it pretty good. But it is true, you COULD make a lot more money here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 The "survey" was grossly misleading and as Robert advises should not be used to judge even average income potential. I didn't even want to answer the questions because I know that even in my own career, as long and varied as it has been, I have seen my income fluctuate wildly during many periods of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orionflood Posted April 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 Thats what I like to hear Robert haha...although I don't do it for the money I do want to do it for the people and the atmosphere at least I COULD not have to live in a van that has solar panels on the roof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfisk Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 L.A. has a very high cost of living, as does the whole state of california unless you live way out in the desert. I moved there right after college to "pay my dues", but got out of there when the recession hit. I don't see how people do it...moving to L.A. not knowing anybody and then making a career for themselves. On the post side of things, it takes an average of 5 years from the time you start to the time you start getting "real" gigs, and even then, if you aren't staff somewhere they are few and far between. There are just so many people competing for the same jobs. When I left L.A. I went to work at a game studio in Vegas. I had the same salary as I did in L.A., but my dollar went A LOT farther there. Instead of a tiny apartment, I was able to rent a big house for the same money. Then I moved back to California, and I'm in north San Diego county. I'm making more money than I was at the game studio, but the cost of living is so high that the lifestyle isn't much better, if at all, other than being able to take the kids to the beach. Housing is much higher, food is way higher, gas is higher (at NAB I noticed gas is about 30 to 40 cents cheaper per gallon in Vegas than where I live), the taxes are through the roof. Those are all things to consider when making the move. Now, I have a wife and 4 sons, so it is different for me than someone who is single. I can't live out of a van, but honestly, that's not the way I would want to live, especially with gear. Where will you shower? Where will you eat? You won't have an address. If you do decide to make the move, make sure you have an escape plan in case you need to split town. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Visser Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Just move to the West Village / Soho area of Manhattan, and you will never complain about the cost of living of anywhere else again (in the US) as it makes even Hawaii seem cheap by comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Ragon Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Where would you charge your batteries? Jon.. Use the Hand Crank, USB charger.. http://www.dealextreme.com/p/dynamo-hand-crank-usb-cell-phone-emergency-charger-24036?item=1 Cost.. 3 bucks, and can make your own power for cell phones, iPods, etc.. -Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Futterman Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Just move to the West Village / Soho area of Manhattan, and you will never complain about the cost of living of anywhere else again (in the US) as it makes even Hawaii seem cheap by comparison. +1. That's why I live in Brooklyn <grin> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Ragon Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Just thowing this out there.. But, I've always thought about buying one of those 40 foot Diesel Pushers, and just park it inside of a leased warehouse in downtown. Seams like a cheap way to have your home with you, and you can move it on set when you pick up gigs. Plus, if the gig is outside of California, you just drive to where the work is. -Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Tirrell Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 L.A. has a very high cost of living, as does the whole state of california unless you live way out in the desert. I moved there right after college to "pay my dues", but got out of there when the recession hit. I don't see how people do it...moving to L.A. not knowing anybody and then making a career for themselves. On the post side of things, it takes an average of 5 years from the time you start to the time you start getting "real" gigs, and even then, if you aren't staff somewhere they are few and far between. There are just so many people competing for the same jobs. When I left L.A. I went to work at a game studio in Vegas. I had the same salary as I did in L.A., but my dollar went A LOT farther there. Instead of a tiny apartment, I was able to rent a big house for the same money. Then I moved back to California, and I'm in north San Diego county. I'm making more money than I was at the game studio, but the cost of living is so high that the lifestyle isn't much better, if at all, other than being able to take the kids to the beach. Housing is much higher, food is way higher, gas is higher (at NAB I noticed gas is about 30 to 40 cents cheaper per gallon in Vegas than where I live), the taxes are through the roof. Those are all things to consider when making the move. Now, I have a wife and 4 sons, so it is different for me than someone who is single. I can't live out of a van, but honestly, that's not the way I would want to live, especially with gear. Where will you shower? Where will you eat? You won't have an address. If you do decide to make the move, make sure you have an escape plan in case you need to split town. Pretty much why I ignored a move up to New York, and I have family in the city that could have helped. I spent about 3 years working in Connecticut and when I moved to Dallas my cost of living dropped by half. Without that I would have not been able to freelance. So I will say to you that in my opinion the move to the big city is becoming less and less important these days. Remember that that 50 K you are making where you are already established is not going to be made in LA your first year there. And even if you did to keep your current standard of living you would need it to be more like 75-100k (using cost of living calculator with Daton, OH as your midwestern city) Now if you decide that it is what you want to do you better have all of your debt paid off, a nest egg to support yourself for 6 mos to a year, and thorough research with contacts and the like. Yes I am a bit overly conservative but when I made the move here to Dallas I was NOT ready and paid for it many times over. In my case it was lack of capital and lack of research due to an expedited move. In my case my wife had to support me at times for the first 2 years (the fortunate thing about a 50 % drop in the cost of living.) However that student loan was always there and when I got slow we simply did not have enough sitting in the bank without relying on here income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelo Waldron Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 I've never heard of a sound guy living homeless. I thought Senator Michaels was homeless..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Not homeless... but he does cultivate "the look" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 I've met a lot of people over the years in traveling crews that said they would love to live anywhere but LA or NYC, but didn't see how they could do it and still make over $XXXXXX/year. I've also met people that say they want to live there for X number of years to build experience and a resume, get out, and then go back to their preferred town and be in a great position. To be real, the cost of living in LA and NYC probably eats up a lot of the extra income. Yes, there is a lot more work, and most importantly there is a lot of great jobs to strive for, but you can still make a good living elsewhere. If you want to live in one of those places, then go for it. You only live once, so you can give it a whirl, and if you hate it, leave. It's easier to walk away if you are homeless and don't have a lease! I'm not in NY or LA, and I am not currently in the union. I still do pretty well. If you subtract what I spend on gear, that number becomes less impressive. That's a personal problem though. To me the most important thing is to enjoy what you do. I might not like every specific job, or all the people I end up on jobs with, but as a freelancer I know it will all change soon enough. I really love my job, so all the hardships of it are easily worth it. This line of work is too much of a grind to stay with it if you don't enjoy it. You can make a great living, but that's probably very possible in many fields if you don't bat an eyelash at working 60+ hours a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orionflood Posted April 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Richard a leased warehouse? I know nothing about that...wouldn't that be more expensive? I have thought about living out of a Toyota Dolphin for quite some time now. You can do that on the street in LA and not get pestered. Do it near a 24hr fitness and take showers etc. then you are all good. Depends if I ever wanted a gf but we all know that isn't possible in LA...finding a solid woman...please Thanks John Paul for the advice. I think the only other type of job that gives a person the same high would be an EMT of some sort. Where physical fitness is also important. I love this site too I check it more times than I probably should...most likely as much as the Zaxcom Nomad page on Trew. I want to work more more more...and I want to buy more more more gear...all before I get old and tired...no offense senator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDirckze Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Not homeless... but he does cultivate "the look" Hobo-chic? --- I am here: http://tapatalk.com/map.php?wu32ai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Tirrell Posted April 27, 2012 Report Share Posted April 27, 2012 Richard a leased warehouse? I know nothing about that...wouldn't that be more expensive? I have thought about living out of a Toyota Dolphin for quite some time now. You can do that on the street in LA and not get pestered. Do it near a 24hr fitness and take showers etc. then you are all good. Depends if I ever wanted a gf but we all know that isn't possible in LA...finding a solid woman...please Thanks John Paul for the advice. I think the only other type of job that gives a person the same high would be an EMT of some sort. Where physical fitness is also important. I love this site too I check it more times than I probably should...most likely as much as the Zaxcom Nomad page on Trew. I want to work more more more...and I want to buy more more more gear...all before I get old and tired...no offense senator. If you do do this I will warn you that you will essentially be leaving a van full of 10-30k worth of sound gear on the curbside for anybody that wants it. Since this is LA we are talking about even when you are in it it is not like you will be able to legally keep a gun to deter or shoot anybody that wants to simply walk in and clean you out. A better option might be a low rent weekly pay motel or rental unit. I am assuming they exist out there as well, but I know there are places here in dallas that will rent a room for weekly or monthly stays, usually targeted at people on seasonal jobs or just moving to town. The advantage is that you pay about at or less than the cheap apartments in the area without having to sign a lease. The disadvantage is they are usually converted motels overlooking a major highway. If you are lucky you might even find one with internet. That said if I was to be divorced or cleaned out by some disaster today that is probably what I would do while I rebuilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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