Tim Paul Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 What's with guys that are afraid to boom? When they boom it's more like a pointer than running full stick over head. I'm on a show now that the lead audio (should be A2) barely booms, when he does he might as well just be using the pistol grip. Trust me, production knows it, he won't be back for second season, I will. Meanwhile I'm over talents head on a 9' stick. He will never put both arms up in the air, boom is always at an angle. Me, I boom with both arms straight up. Reality and multi-track has created some lazy bastards!!! I black list these guys but WTF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Sjostrom Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yeah I agree 100%. If there's any room for boom, go for it. There's no downside, except getting bigger muscles so we can do more work... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 If you want to boom for 4-5 hours straight while avoiding 2-3 cameras feel free. When I am being an equipment reality pack mule carrying 8 wires and my 788T last thing I wanna do is boom when not needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonG Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 I boomed the first couple of reality shows that I worked on, and I was always at constant battle with the two cameras plus jib. Most of the time I couldnt get anywhere close enough to make a difference anyways. Then I got on a show that was shot for the most part out in the desert, so boom shadow was a nightmare, and again it was three cams, one on a jib. For the most part the talent was just standing there talking, and then we would cut to a stunt or explosion, and then they would wrap out the segment. Lavs were totally fine, and since I was running cos-11s, the talent sounded great. Since then the shows that I have been on really havnt had any need for a boom, or make it impossible in some way or another. Every now and then I will use a boom to pick up sound effects or whats going on to give a more complete sonic picture of the action, but it is rare that I can get in anywhere near where I can capture usable dialogue. Believe me, having come from a background primarily in narrative film, I firmly believe that if you cant boom a shot, it is not a shot worth getting. But you cant always use the same tools for different jobs. Sometimes you can only use one or the other, and a lot of production companies these days (at least the ones Ive been working for) design their shows to be very wireless reliant. It is just another way of shooting a show quick and easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atheisticmystic Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 ...a lot of production companies these days (at least the ones Ive been working for) design their shows to be very wireless reliant. It is just another way of shooting a show quick and easy. I recently started working with a production company that flatly told me to keep the boom away until further notification. They're happy with the lav convention, and the sound. Best, Steven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Sjostrom Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 If you want to boom for 4-5 hours straight while avoiding 2-3 cameras feel free. When I am being an equipment reality pack mule carrying 8 wires and my 788T last thing I wanna do is boom when not needed. Okay, it depends on the shoot of course. I wouldn't boom in every situation, but if it helps, if it brings something extra to the table, I will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrider Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 I have worked on a reality show about a family with many children. Since we really couldn't wire all the members of the family (some five-year-olds say the cutest things) the plan was to wire the parents and boom the 19 kids. We use the right tools for the job we are on that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumrush Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 If you want to boom for 4-5 hours straight while avoiding 2-3 cameras feel free. When I am being an equipment reality pack mule carrying 8 wires and my 788T last thing I wanna do is boom when not needed. I agree. If all the mics sound great and have enough of them why sit there and boom and try to follow the conversation by the time you get to the other person you lost that sound. At the end production, dont care if you boom or not as long as you got great sound. Some people feel the need to show production that they love to boom. On most top shows audio sups dont always boom, everything is ISO. I dont have a problem booming but if i can throw an mic on them and dont have to stand there with both arms up for 2 hour it will work out better for the long run of the show. At the end if you have been booming the 2 hours and have everyone miced you really think the editor is going to use the boom track if all ISO are clean. As far as black listing thats on you people work differnt ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Ostroff Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Tim: There are definitely times booming can work and can't, won't end up being used. But man, I wouldn't turn my back on you if I were the other mixer for fear of getting stabbed in the back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Andrews Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 "He will never put both arms up in the air, boom is always at an angle." If you have both arms in the air, how do you mix? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Are you booming a person with a lav? That's what you would do on scripted fiction, but that's different. There are a lot of reality shows that only boom if it's absolutely needed (person not wearing a mic), otherwise you are in the way of multiple cameras. I' sometimes will keep the boom open for ambience. Yes, I have worked on shows that wanted and used that. A lot of cable reality shows are supposed to be in 5.1 now, so the post people love anything recorded on location. Lavs sound good enough for dialog as far as most shows are concerned. Agree or disagree, that has become pretty standard. What kit are you guys carrying? There are some reality shows where the "lead audio" carries the heavy 788 with 7 or 8 411 RXs and the additional mixers carry a 552 and flip freqs on a few receivers. It probably makes more sense for the additional mixers to do the booming and for the lead audio to monitor and mix what they have. If it's hectic reality, it's not easy to mix (not just monitor, but actually mix) 7 wireless mics and a boom for 12+ hours a day. It's also asking for possible injury. It's also completely possible your lead audio person isn't very good at their job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumrush Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Tim: There are definitely times booming can work and can't, won't end up being used. But man, I wouldn't turn my back on you if I were the other mixer for fear of getting stabbed in the back. I Agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 A lot of excellent points have been made. Throwing another mixer under the bus is a good way to get a bad reputation within the sound mixing community. I've had it done to me (in a totally different way than this), and it was by someone who I brought onto the project. I would recommend a derelict from the gutter before I'd ever give that guy's phone number out again. Other sound mixers can be the source of some of your best referrals. Is it your place to be judging another worker's every move or should you be putting your energy toward learning the production's needs and doing your job to the best of your ability? Do you consider it your place to judge another sound person's work? It's possible this other mixer isn't up to par, but that shouldn't be your call unless you're the one doing the hiring. So, the question is, "What's YOUR job?" Employing the methods that make production run smoothly, and capturing the elements that post needs, and can use to create an efficient final product, is the order of the day for most reality-type projects. The needs of the production come first. Also, as Johnpaul mentioned, there are times that, with everyone wired, a "boom in the air" rather than closely following each participant, can capture the slight additional amount of ambiance that post needs to "flavor" the location. How well do you know how post is being handled on this particular production? I say all this as someone who is definitely not in the lazy column. If anything, I sometimes try too hard, so if I think I can get a better track by also booming overhead I'm likely to do so, however, the bottom line is still what the production needs and calls for. So, the question is, does the O.P. really know what he's talking about, or is he just making assumptions of what a sound mixer should be doing? Maybe Job One should be learning his craft rather than judging someone else's work. In any case, throwing someone under the bus (black listing -- what's that about?!), is bad form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headpooch Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Eight pricy wirelesses strapped to a sweaty pack mule, and a Schoeps at the end in a long pole ... doesn't really matter. It's still whip cream on top of a shit pie. Such is the current state of our noble profession. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Tirrell Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 There are many reasons and techniques for booming, not. And an experienced mixer or boom op will use discretion to decide which is giving him/her the best option given the situation. That is not always booming overhead. Additionally I know of more than one case of somebody who was too aggressive with the boom and pissed off the dp, slowed down the shoot or caused things to be unusable because of shadow and was not called back. For what its worth I always try to run the boom if I can reasonably without casting shadows getting in the way etc. But many times that constitutes ambiance and not just a backup mic. Also as has already pointed out if he is swinging a boom with both arms extended he can not ride the faders which is what he is being paid to do. I think in this case it is best not to judge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Breitenbach Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 It's true most Reality mixers are absolutely embarrassing when they boom, with their shotguns 7 feet away from the action and pointed over the "talent's" heads. It's always annoyed me tremendously. I can only assume that the reason they imagine they're doing an acceptable job is because their HP volume is so loud they're able to make out some dialogue. Reality TV generally doesn't require much booming, but when you need to boom you should do it right and get in there with it. I like to boom properly and I rarely bother camera people, they're usually happy to be working with an audio guy who is nice but still gives a shit. Now, telling someone they can't boom is like telling someone they can't drive - you won't make any friends that way. Keep a level head even if you don't approve, and just don't hire those people when you're Sup'ing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean McCormick Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 I did a 20 week Discovery gig this Summer in various auto garages and always 2 cameras, weaving around cars and under lifts, often crazy wide. After about 2 weeks my boom pole stopped even being taken out of my van. The A cam (Panny 3200) had an MKH60 with a proper softie on it (routed to Ch3, my hops to CH1-2), so post was getting plenty of usable nat sound. I also do narrative stuff and far prefer the sound of a well-placed CMIT, but when in Rome..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chriskellett Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 What's with guys that are afraid to boom? When they boom it's more like a pointer than running full stick over head. I'm on a show now that the lead audio (should be A2) barely booms, when he does he might as well just be using the pistol grip. Trust me, production knows it, he won't be back for second season, I will. Meanwhile I'm over talents head on a 9' stick. He will never put both arms up in the air, boom is always at an angle. Me, I boom with both arms straight up. Reality and multi-track has created some lazy bastards!!! I black list these guys but WTF? Well, I guess when it is "your show" next year you can make the rules but it sounds like you are currently working under someone, which means they get to set the tone and style of the audio department for now. If your not happy with it you can always leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srgtfury Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Eight pricy wirelesses strapped to a sweaty pack mule, and a Schoeps at the end in a long pole ... doesn't really matter. It's still whip cream on top of a shit pie. Such is the current state of our noble profession. Hey Top Dog, Well said...Well taken. You did not mention what seems to be the proclivity, of multiple persons on set, to sling loads of that pile at the SP, occasionally at whim and fancy... Thank you very much Fury Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Quinn Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Is this you Tim and some of your fine booming PS if this is not the above Tim Paul many apologies to Tim in the picture and his goat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 That boom is in the danger zone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gilbert Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Is this you Tim and some of your fine booming PS if this is not the above Tim Paul many apologies to Tim in the picture and his goat One hand on his stick, arms bent, amateur! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 And the goat didn't know his lines well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Miramontes Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 If you have both arms in the air, how do you mix? +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VASI Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 If you have positive mood the animal they don't have reason to "attack". Keep calm and everything ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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