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Fostex FR-2 timecode fps problem


Izen Ears

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  Hello boarders, I've run into a wacky problem with my FR-2 timecode out.  It's only the timecode out.  I've got it set for 30 ND fps and this is what is being recorded onto the sound file, but the timecode out is outputting 29.97.  This has been confirmed with a lab (they were able to tell what the slate was jammed at) as well as when I try andn jam my PD6 to the FR-2.  Anyone else have this problem?  Totally sucks because now I can't use that deck for film job backup!  Thanks,

  Dan Izen

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  Thank you for the replies!  You are correct, I had a .1% pull up turned on for a sample rate of 48.048k.  This is what the editors requested and on several projects was deemed correct later by post.  The told me they can easily account for the sample rate whatever it is, 48,k or 48.048k, but the editors told me when they went to my source files they had to perform a .1% pull up in order to maintain sync.  It added a step to their process which I never want to do willfully.

  Another thing - when I use the PD6 with the .1% pull up, it outputs normal 30 ND fps to the slate, so why is the FR-2 timecode output different?  I don't want to change the pull up midway through the project, so perhaps I can record the backup deck (FR-2) at a different sample rate than the primary deck.  But that sucks, I want them both at the exact same settings...

  Dan Izen

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  Thank you for the replies!  You are correct, I had a .1% pull up turned on for a sample rate of 48.048k.  This is what the editors requested and on several projects was deemed correct later by post.  The told me they can easily account for the sample rate whatever it is, 48,k or 48.048k, but the editors told me when they went to my source files they had to perform a .1% pull up in order to maintain sync.  It added a step to their process which I never want to do willfully.

  Another thing - when I use the PD6 with the .1% pull up, it outputs normal 30 ND fps to the slate, so why is the FR-2 timecode output different?  I don't want to change the pull up midway through the project, so perhaps I can record the backup deck (FR-2) at a different sample rate than the primary deck.  But that sucks, I want them both at the exact same settings...

  Dan Izen

It is confusing but there are 2 ways to record 30 FPS code.  One at 48k and one at 48048 but marked at 48K  If you set the machine to 48k sample rate and 29.97 FPS Time Code then set the pull up switch to +.1%.  This causes the TC output to pull up .1% to 30 FPS ND and the Sample rate to 48048.   The file's metadata indicates 48k (not 48048) and 29.97 fps Frame Rate.  This causes the file to playback at a pulled down rate.

The second way to record 30FPS is to set the machine to 30 FPS ND time code and 48k sample rate.  No Pull up or pull down set.  The output is also 30FPS but the file is marked as 30fps and 48k which is accurate.  These files must be slowed down in telecine or when imported into a workstation to remain in sync.  So both Fostex machines can record 48o48 the same way you just have to follow the same procedures on each machine.  Fostex is different from Sound Devices in the way they achieve 48048.  SD machines  do not always lock the sample rate and time code to the same clock unless you use the "F" mode.  They don't have the "pull up .1%" switch settings but achieved the same result using a different menu setting. (48048 F mode)

---Courtney

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  Boy, that's pretty bizarre considering the PD6 doesn't seem to have the same issues - I set it for what I want and it outputs exactly that.

  I am still a little confused about why the lab and editors always say 30ND fps is correct, but actually 29.97/48k with a +.1% pull up is better.  On the past three 35mm films I've mixed, the lab said it didn't matter what the pull up was, but the editors told me straight up 48k had to be bumped up to 48.048k in order to be synced.  Plus the PD6 has no issues with recording at 30ND fps, 48k with the pull up.  It's just the FR-2 that's wacky.  (Unless the PD6 is in fact doing the "fake" 30ND/48.048k in the metadata but actually doing a 29.97/48k with a pull up?)

  Anyhow I'm going to continue using the PD6 at 30fps/48k with a pull up, and I'll use the FR-2 at 30fps/48k no pull up.

  Thank you so much for the info Courtney, you certainly know your stuff!  And here I thought I had some problem with the timecode card on the FR-2.

  Dan Izen

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