shock mount for CMC6MK41

[noni]

For now I am using sennheiser MZS 40 and it's not so good. I can hear a lot of hands on a boom. Please any ideas.

Thanks a lot

Novica

[Alan H. Chang]

I personally use the K-Tek KSSM (Short Mount) for both of my 641's.  I've tried the PSC Universal Shock Mounts as well and like it a lot.  Handling noises are non-existent.  It's a godsend to have a very skilled boom operator as well.

[Jeff Wexler]

I don't think this POLL was posted properly --- no choices seem to be visible. In any case, I think the new Invision mounts from Rycote are the best at this time.

Check out:  http://www.rycote.com/products/invision/

Rycote has extensive documentation to help in deciding which is the right suspension for your mic. I think it will take some real world experimentation to actually determine which model is the best. It looks like the INV-6 or INV-7 will be right for a full size CMC6 (or 5) with the MK41 capsule.

General image below:

[noni]

Thank you Allen , and Jeff . I am using rycote for cmit 5u and mkh 416 and 60, and that is working great, so I will give it a try to new one. Or my be k-tek.

Thanks a lot guys.

Novica Jankov from Belgrade , Serbia

[noni]

My mistake , sorry Alan.

Novica

[Bartek]

I was VERY impressed with the cinela mount.

[Jeff Wexler]

I was VERY impressed with the cinela mount.

I liked that mount also, looked at it again when we were in France, never bought one because it seemed too fragile and was way too expensive. I have one of the Invision mounts now for my Sennhesier 8040 and I will be getting others for my Schoeps (both short Schoeps and long mic). Prior to finding the new Invision mount (which really uses a different principle both in manufacturing and function) we have used original Randy McDonald mount (later built and sold as the PSC mount), K-Tek suspension mount, and a few others. I think the Invision will replace most of these although we will continue to use the K-Tek suspension I am sure because Don really likes that one.

-  Jeff Wexler

[soundwiz]

slightly offtopic, but still wanted to know

do you need the CUT-1 and CUT-2 filter with these shock mounts?when using the CMC6MKH41

i have used the mic  without these filters and on different shock mounts but had too much handling noise

[jason porter]

I have used mine (without the low cut) with the PSC and an old mount from Lightwave with no handling noise (well, as little as can be expected...)

At this point, I think the PSC and the Invision are the best (and least expensive) choices.

[Jeff Wexler]

slightly offtopic, but still wanted to know

do you need the CUT-1 and CUT-2 filter with these shock mounts?when using the CMC6MKH41

i have used the mic  without these filters and on different shock mounts but had too much handling noise

Not off topic at all --- the performance of the microphone is tied to all these factors. Regarding the CUT-1, there are lots of opinions on this ranging from those who say the CUT-1 must always be in place whenever using a Schoeps microphone (especially if it is going to be moving) to those who say it is unnecessary. In my experience (we almost never use the CUT-1), whether you need the CUT-1 or not will be more a function of the equalization and high pass you have on the input preamp. As everyone may know, the Cooper boards have very good high pass, two stages and a very steep slope. This is important: when the spec for any high pass or low frequency roll off states "100hz/12 db per octave" this refers not only to the turnover frequency midpoint (at what frequency attenuation begins) but also how steep and rapid is the attenuation. Many mixers do not have adequate high pass so that even the best possible shockmount will not be able to deal with all the low frequency energy. In these situations, you will have handling noise but with proper high pass and the proper shockmount, you will not.

The bottom line is: the CUT-1 is a valuable tool and there are some very good reasons to attenuate low frequency after the capsule before it reaches the amp, but this is not vital if you have proper high pass and shockmount. One reason we do not use the CUT-1 is that it makes the mic longer and heavier, and as I said, not really necessary in my book.

-  Jeff Wexler

[John Blankenship]

--I believe the Invision 7 is the model that's designed for both the Schoeps 641 and Sennheiser 416, 60, etc.  I bought two of them but haven't used them on location yet.  I find they are too "saggy" for a fully tricked out Schopes (CMC6, CUT 1, GVC swivel, and capsule).

When I have time I want to try it with just the body and capsule -- my guess is, it'll work pretty well in that configuration.  They feel nice with a CMIT Schoeps, but are also a bit "saggy" with a 416 in place.  JMHO.

Rycote plans to sell the lyres separately, along with some small spacers to use them with Rycote mounts inside a zep.  Those aren't shipping yet.

--Regarding hi-pass filters:  I like the CUT 1 because it is so steep.  With really steep filters, phase issues can come into play, but I haven't noticed any problems with the CUT 1.  The Schoeps Cut 1 is 70hZ with a 24dB/Octave slope.  I believe the Sound Devices mixers use a second order filter (12dB/Octave).  I'm not sure what the slope is on the Cooper or Sonosax but look forward to finding out.

--I agree that a survey with one mount vs everything else is not an extremely worthwhile approach.

JB

[Geluidloopt]

I'm personally using the cinela Osix 2 mount for my Schoeps and i must say i'm very happy with it, after always having boomed with a rycote suspension.  It is much quieter, handling wise, and the price is not that bad here in europe... although more fragile.

in regards to the cut1, i've never used or felt the need for one; especially with the cinela mount, the highpass on my SD 442 seems to be fine.

Marijn

[Jeff Wexler]

--I agree that a survey with one mount vs everything else is not an extremely worthwhile approach.

JB

I am going to take this poll down because it was never posted properly in the first place. I put the Invision name in really just to try and discover why there were no other choices put up. Someone can repost a poll if they want to and provide some proper choices, or we can just carry on with this thread --- individual posts regarding what shockmounts we use.

-  Jeff Wexler

[noni]

I want to thank you all for your post's about this topic  , I will need to mack a choice what shock mount I will take. This was very helpful.

Thank you guys

Best

Novica Jankov

[John Blankenship]

For most of my suspensions I've been using the K-Tek K-SUS "suspenders" in place of the standard elastic bands.  They're extremely durable and cushion better than most bands.  They stretch well and I've used them even on the thick body of a Rode NT-4 stereo mic.  They will work with many different mounts (Rycote, AT, LTM, PSC, K-Tek, etc.)  With a really small diameter mic I sometimes add a rubber O-ring to prevent slippage.

http://www.ktekbooms.com/products.php?id=46

The new InVision will have a place in my kit but, based on initial testing, probably only for really lightweight mics.

JB, cas

[John Blankenship]

I just used the InVision INV-7 suspension for a day of running and gunning at the Indy 500 track.  It performed fine.  I was a tad concerned that with a 416 the Invision might be too flexible but, in this application it worked well.

Even without the additional spacers that are due out soon, the lyres mount fine onto a standard Rycote bar inside a zep, which is how I used it (along with a Windjammer cover).  In my case I was wielding a Sennheiser 416. 

With this rig, there was slightly less handling noise than a K-TEK model K-SM (http://www.ktekbooms.com/products.php?id=47) mount and it was probably on a par with what I would have had with the Rycote hoops and K-Tek model K-SUS (http://www.ktekbooms.com/products.php?id=46) "suspenders."

Earlier, someone was asking about using the InVision products with an Oktava.  The combination works well.  Note that, even though the INV-7 is listed as being primarily for longer mics, the mounting bracket allows two different narrower spacings.  The middle spacing is fine for an Oktava.

JB

[noni]

HI John,

This is very good info about INV-7.

Thanks

Novica Jankov

[Derek H]

Anybody try using the Invison 7 along with a Rycote softie windscreen?  I'm considering this configuration for my 416 (to replace the standard pistol grip doughnut) but I'm afraid it will be too saggy and sloppy with the weight of the 416+softie.   

[RPSharman]

I am VERY late jumping into this thread.

I am looking for new mounts.  Just not happy with the PSC mounts any more, with so many other good options out there now.  I have MKH50s.  I am quite content with the inexpensive Rode mounts I use for my 416s, because no modification is required to the windscreen, and frankly I hardly ever use them outside the zepp.  The Cinela are cool, but just too pricey I think.  I am thinking of Ktek or Rycote.  There are so many choices for the Ktek.  Which one is best?

Also, after testing my recent purchase of the 8040 with the Rycote Invision, I found the Sennheiser mount to be quieter.  But Jeff writes here that he uses the Rycote for the same mic.  Just curious what sort of testing you did, Jeff, and perhaps I made the wrong choice.  Although I do like that the Sennheiser mount fits in the cut-out in the case!

Robert

[Eric Toline]

I am VERY late jumping into this thread.

I am looking for new mounts.  Just not happy with the PSC mounts any more, with so many other good options out there now.  I have MKH50s.  I am quite content with the inexpensive Rode mounts I use for my 416s, because no modification is required to the windscreen, and frankly I hardly ever use them outside the zepp.  The Cinela are cool, but just too pricey I think.  I am thinking of Ktek or Rycote.  There are so many choices for the Ktek.  Which one is best?

Also, after testing my recent purchase of the 8040 with the Rycote Invision, I found the Sennheiser mount to be quieter.  But Jeff writes here that he uses the Rycote for the same mic.  Just curious what sort of testing you did, Jeff, and perhaps I made the wrong choice.  Although I do like that the Sennheiser mount fits in the cut-out in the case!

Robert

If you're going to get the Rycote Invision mount for your MKH 50 make sure get the MKH 50 slab sided clips. The round clips wont hold the 50 secrure enough. I've got a couple of Ktek mounts and Rycote Invision mounts. The Invisions are among the least sensitive to handling noise I've used.

Eric

[soundtrane]

Have used the invision with the MKH50 for very good results...

-vin

[Matt McGowin]

I used it a few times when I boomed for Marcus Ricaud and used his boom. I liked the invision. I have not tried it with the cut-1 attached.

I use a Rycote pistol grip and softie with the sennheiser 60. I also use the Audio-Technica AT8415 mount with windscreen indoors.

Matthew

[studiomprd]

broken record, here:

for excellent discussion of shock mount topics in general, and K-Tek specifically, give them a call, yes a telephone call!

Really!!

Brenda knows her stuff, but if you talk to Manfred, who really loves to talk this stuff, you will be much the better for the time spent, and you will certainly know which K-Tek products you are interested in!

[Bob Marts]

Not long after the PSC universal mounts came out, I made a hybrid version using my old Rycote mounts and the PSC O-rings secured by small cable ties.

This arrangement works very well for me and it accommodates the foam windscreens which actually keep the mic centered better in the mount. I can also use the same mounts in a zeppelin. Works for a Schoeps, too.

Bob

[jonathan chiles]

More support for Rycote Invision 7 for Schoeps CMC5/6 and capsule.

I actually found that the standard lyres were a bit stiff for me (bearing in mind I dont use a cut-1or GVC very often) and Simon at Rycote very kindly sent me a softer set of lyres that they were trying out during the development phase. I use these now and find that the handling noise is reduced even further as the mic can "travel" more in the suspension. I have the low cut on my 442 at the lowest position (-12dB slope starting about 80hZ)

I have been using the Invision 10 for my MKH50 as well with a softie and it is way, way better than the Ktek KSSm I was using

One thing I noticed with the Invisions is working in hot direct sun, the compound softens up a bit and your mount gets "saggier"

Jon Chiles