mulluysavage Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 In a road race? Which lavs, which transmitters? Waterproof? Seems like a neoprene band would be deadly hot, but what else to use to stash the transmitter? I like mic bras for sports, but do runners hate them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_bollard Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I have mic'd runners in half marathon. B3s best mic option. The new WM Tx would be great as the UMs will sweat out. If you have wardrobe resources get a Lycra pouch sewn in the inside if the shirt otherwise there's not much option but to use neopax or similar. Not sure re mic bras. Generally negative feedback from those I mic up and they can slip, move etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundtrane Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 and you need to find ways to avoid heavy movement of the lav itself.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Kersten Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 Interested in this as well. I used a small audio ltd transmitter with a cos11 and didn't get the sounds I wanted. Luckily I did a afternoon recordings session before the race with one of the runners which gave beautiful sounds. Also had experience that they do not like it. Even someone put it off during the race (this was during a ultra run 120 kilometres). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Kersten Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 http://www.audioltd.com/studio-stage/minitx_micro-transmitter/ has also a remote so you can adjust it without bothering too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkautzsch Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 http://www.audioltd.com/studio-stage/minitx_micro-transmitter/ has also a remote so you can adjust it without bothering too much. NEEDS the remote to adjust anything, and the remote needs optical contact and has to be held within a few inches of the MTX's IR sensor. Not quite "without bothering too much". Actually more bothering than with a EN2 TXP's jog wheel when you know the menu. The easiest way is the Lectro acoustic remote (playing various tone sequences in front of the mic). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Kersten Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 Peter I'm sorry that I didn't make myself clear. I didn't mean the standard remote but I was talking about the Control X which can adjust settings within 20 cm distance. http://www.audioltd.com/studio-stage/control-x-controller/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Miramontes Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) Neopax waste belt and mic bra with RM11 insert. This system worked great for me on a bounty hunter reality show I did. The talent would be running, fighting, jumping, etc. and the mic would stay on. Oh yeah, forgot to mention that its best to bring some latex gloves or wet wipes to clean your hands after you remove the gear. Those things can get very sweaty very fast and it's super gross handling them afterwards. Edited March 12, 2014 by Michael Miramontes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg sextro Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I tried a mic bra on a runner on a recent commercial spot. It sadly kept falling down. I ended up with a cos-11 in a rycote over cover and a liberal amount of 3M. seemed to hold pretty well, but I would not trust that to hold either for a super long run. If you are lucky, the runner will have a pocket in his/her pants that's right on the waist-line on the back. It seems to be pretty common these days in runners clothing to have a pocket there for keys, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmfsnd Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 If your runner is ok wearing those iPod arm holders, I fit the transmitter in there, depending on the size. With proper taping and slack, you can minimize the cord noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Reineke Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 There was a recent post on here about mic'ing NBA basketball players. They run around a lot so this may be of interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 What kind of run? What distance? Is this real or fictional? After that, it depends on the runner. You'll need some specific answers about the runner. MicBra or similar... many runners wear a heart rate monitor that would go in that same spot. *IF* this is a real race, you might be able to vampire clip, or something, the mic to the HRM strap. In that sense, they are used to running with a band around their chest, so that's a win! Chest straps vary, but a lot of them are actually plastic in the front, maybe 6"-8" wide sensor and battery area. The elastic part is the sides and back. Google a polar HRM to see what I mean, though some brands are not so plastic (like my Garmin GPS+HRM). I've run a few marathons and a bunch of half marathons. If somebody wanted to put a mic on me on race day I would be hesitant. Most runners are very concerned with things being uncomfortable and rubbing. What might seem ok at first, can turn into raw open wounds when you are doing 26.2 miles. You see gross stuff on the side of the course. That's why experienced runners won't try new socks or shoes or even shirts on race day. It's not superstition, it's experience. If it's a more casual runner, they might have a fanny pack with tons of snacks and bandages and an iPod and whatever else. Some people fall in between and wear an iPod or iPhone (for performance tracking) on their arm in a band (but that would show a transmitter on camera). Some runners wear these little belts that have their preferred sports drink. Those belts sometimes have a little pouch that would fit a MM or WM transmitter (google FuelBelt, that's a popular brand). Many runners wear a fuel belt, but a competitive pro probably doesn't. If it's ultra marathon distances (100 miles), they usually have their own support crew, so they might not carry anything on them. For reference, the Philadelphia Marathon is the weekend before thanksgiving (chilly usually) and the top competitive runners are still wearing singlets and split shorts. Many of the women are wearing half shirts. No place to hide anything, if that matters. More casual runners may wear long sleeves or tights. Many people decide that on the morning of the race deepening on the weather. They also often peel layers as they go. *possibly* that brand transmitter that the NBA uses? they are designed to go into a basketball jersey and not bother the player, while being sweat proof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Miramontes Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 JohnPaul makes a lot of valid points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikewest Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Have not miked runners as such Did mike a woman in a bikini sliding down a water tube ding dialogue to camera. B3 and an MM400 Acoustics rendered it a good guide track mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan McL Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 John Garrett has recently worked with runners and had some good input... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek H Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 I would try a B6 with waterproof cap inserted into the collar of the shirt if possible. Meaning the collar of most shirts is sewn so that it's basically a cloth tube circling your neck. Cut a small hole in the back inside part and feed a B6 in until it's around the front side. Movement should be minimal in that location. Secure the exposed cable with tape so that it doesn't get pulled out. Like Johnpaul said hiding the transmitter in a camera-acceptable runners pack of some sort would be my 1st choice. Neopax would be second. I would think that unless the shirt was quite tight a sewn in pocket would not work because the transmitter would be swinging around and banging into the body. Waterproof transmitter or no-lube condom on a regular pack. Do a test first! With the actual runner if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulluysavage Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Thank you everyone. Do people like the sound of a B3 under clothing? For Countryman I only own and have used b6 which I don't like the sound of under clothing only hidden in plain sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulluysavage Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Also, do the caps really keep the lav waterproof? This is a marathon. Lots of sweat. I would use my COS-11s, but would they get destroyed by sweat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulluysavage Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 What kind of run? What distance? Is this real or fictional? After that, it depends on the runner. You'll need some specific answers about the runner. MicBra or similar... many runners wear a heart rate monitor that would go in that same spot. *IF* this is a real race, you might be able to vampire clip, or something, the mic to the HRM strap. In that sense, they are used to running with a band around their chest, so that's a win! Chest straps vary, but a lot of them are actually plastic in the front, maybe 6"-8" wide sensor and battery area. The elastic part is the sides and back. Google a polar HRM to see what I mean, though some brands are not so plastic (like my Garmin GPS+HRM). I've run a few marathons and a bunch of half marathons. If somebody wanted to put a mic on me on race day I would be hesitant. Most runners are very concerned with things being uncomfortable and rubbing. What might seem ok at first, can turn into raw open wounds when you are doing 26.2 miles. You see gross stuff on the side of the course. That's why experienced runners won't try new socks or shoes or even shirts on race day. It's not superstition, it's experience. If it's a more casual runner, they might have a fanny pack with tons of snacks and bandages and an iPod and whatever else. Some people fall in between and wear an iPod or iPhone (for performance tracking) on their arm in a band (but that would show a transmitter on camera). Some runners wear these little belts that have their preferred sports drink. Those belts sometimes have a little pouch that would fit a MM or WM transmitter (google FuelBelt, that's a popular brand). Many runners wear a fuel belt, but a competitive pro probably doesn't. If it's ultra marathon distances (100 miles), they usually have their own support crew, so they might not carry anything on them. For reference, the Philadelphia Marathon is the weekend before thanksgiving (chilly usually) and the top competitive runners are still wearing singlets and split shorts. Many of the women are wearing half shirts. No place to hide anything, if that matters. More casual runners may wear long sleeves or tights. Many people decide that on the morning of the race deepening on the weather. They also often peel layers as they go. *possibly* that brand transmitter that the NBA uses? they are designed to go into a basketball jersey and not bother the player, while being sweat proof. This is the Boston Marathon, April 21. Yeah, Looks like there is one top competitor we are following, and production acknowledges that them accepting wearing a mic is highly unlikely. They told me the other subjects are more casual and may have sport belts. I am hoping for this. I doubt the pocket plan will work. What is that brand transmitter the NBA uses? Now I am looking at simply SD recorder packs and not transmitters at all, as while we will have many crews on the sidelines, there will be no follow cart... and the tech producer thinks jamming and running an SD recorder is the best idea, and I think so too. Anyone have recommendations on these? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Feeley Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 I've mic'd runners during training runs and also used to run competitively myself. JohnPaul gives great advice. > What is that brand transmitter the NBA uses? Q5X http://www.q5x.com/products/wireless-transmitters/qt-1000-playermic/ > Anyone have recommendations on [small SD recorders]? Maybe a Zoom H1 with some cheap lav connected through the 3.5mm mic input? Don't know for sure, but it's fairly small and light and cheap. A Google search on these terms looks fruitful: zoom h1 lav mic But for Boston, getting even the non-elite runners to wear a lav & transmitter will be tricky. To get into the Boston Marathon, runners need meet a decent qualifying time in a previous marathon. Like around 3:30 for 50yr old men, 4:00 for 50yr old women. Or thereabouts. Key point: this ain't no stroll in the park. So even the more casual runners at Boston are at least serious hobbyists. And, as JohnPaul says, may not want to add anything to their bodies or make any changes on race day. Perhaps if you could get them to try it a week or a month before the race on a casual run, maybe a few runners might perhaps be willing to consider having a transmitter or recorder on their body during the race. And then they might take it off after five miles. If a runner wears a visor, you could perhaps lav that, and run the cable down their back (probably outside the layer of clothing closest to their skin) and into a recorder or TX. But the visor might get discarded, camera might not like it anyway, and... Good luck and let us know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek H Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Zaxcom ZFR 200 would be the smallest recorder I would think. Not sure if anyone rents them though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Oh. Miking runners! I'd added an "L" in my head and thought it was a strange topic of conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDirckze Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Oh. Miking runners! I'd added an "l" in my head and thought it was a strange topic of conversation. Glad to see I wasn't the only one... Definitely a job for Zaxcom ZFR-200 and Countryman B3. I've just bought this combination as I've been doing more and more jobs that need a solution like this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Feeley Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 A ZFR-200 could be great. I recommended a cheap Zoom because I think it's a little lighter and because I'd be less upset when the runner tears it off and tosses it to the curb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 mulluy: " I would use my COS-11s, but would they get destroyed by sweat? " lav mic's are expendables... that is part of the biz... they would certainly gety a good workout. and be certain production has proper insurance, and understands that there is a significant probability of losses... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.