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Sonosax SX-R4+

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47 minutes ago, Soundmind said:

Not helping us who do not invest in transmitter with recording capabilities. Any alternative solution? 

Always run a backup recorder. Even in the bag, even if it's 16bit, or even compressed.  So you have at least something. 

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This is where recording on the transmitter gives you peace of mind. I never worry.

Where do you record the wired boom? What about in a concert recording situation with 6 wired mics?

It was a mistake firmware update. I am sure Sonosax working for a stable one. Nothing hardware failure so far.

If the firmware doesn't work it is a hardware failure. Even though a failure that can be fixed by a software update.

That's what firmware is there for, it controls the hardware.

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8 hours ago, Soundmind said:

Not helping us who do not invest in transmitter with recording capabilities. Any alternative solution? 

Backup recorder. Or zaxcom recorder with MARF and setup to monitor recording tracks. At least for me. I 100% trust MARF. If you heard it in the headphones it is on the card.

 

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1 hour ago, RadoStefanov said:

Backup recorder. Or zaxcom recorder with MARF and setup to monitor recording tracks. At least for me. I 100% trust MARF. If you heard it in the headphones it is on the card.

 

Although even with MARF it's only playing what goes in...

There was a marantz recorder which had an option to actually play back what was on the card (although with a delay), like tape monitoring.

It's a case that I did a week's worth of work on the v2.3 firmware and *hopefully* haven't had issues with the files (listened to a load of random recordings, which were fine and had no complaints back yet). I've found the UDF recordings on this to be pretty robust, with card speed errors it's recorded up to that point, however it's a problem if it's just recording garbage...

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Derek H   

As far as I know when you set your Nomad or Maxx to monitor a card track you're really just routing whatever is routed to that track to your headphone.  

It does not read the track off the recording media in real-time. If it did there would be a noticeable delay.

That said, I also trust the MARF system.

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1 hour ago, Derek H said:

As far as I know when you set your Nomad or Maxx to monitor a card track you're really just routing whatever is routed to that track to your headphone.  

It does not read the track off the recording media in real-time. If it did there would be a noticeable delay.

That said, I also trust the MARF system.

When file based recording was first introduced to our world (the original Zaxcom Deva I) there was lots of discussion about confidence monitoring, are we going to be able to do the equivalent to "listening off tape" to have confidence that we have a bonafide recording. The Deva (which was the only file based recorder at that time) did not do this. Later, when other companies started building file based recorders, I believe Sound Devices did provide monitoring the recording actually off the disk while recording, but the processing power and latency made it almost a useless feature. I had already done four movies with the Deva before any of the other recorders were even available and had learned that confidence in the integrity of the recording did NOT require any "listening off tape" or monitoring a data stream off the disk. Confidence was assured by an incredibly robust and reliable "recording" method, verified by checksum verification, read after write routines, etc., things which provided confidence without having to actually hear it. In today's world, I don't think ANY of the recorders provide this sort of confidence monitoring --- I could be wrong about this but for me, the confidence has come from my confidence and experience with the recorders I am using.

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VAS   

Now, back to the topic.

Any news when the AoIP will be available and what protocol will be (AVB / Dante / Ravenna)? Currently, AD8+ and R4+ plays via AES.

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2 hours ago, VAS said:

Now, back to the topic.

Any news when the AoIP will be available and what protocol will be (AVB / Dante / Ravenna)? Currently, AD8+ and R4+ plays via AES.

Last I heard was around the end of the year...

1 hour ago, Tong0615 said:

I asked once if there's a plan to implement SuperSlot with SX-R4+ in some way, the answer is no...

Unless there's been a change of mind?

 

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For those with corrupt recordings, have you tried loading them as raw data in Audacity?  I've recovered corrupted audio file this way before, where a small error in the header caused only noise to play back when the actually audio was there.

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13 hours ago, Richard Thomas said:

Although even with MARF it's only playing what goes in...

There was a marantz recorder which had an option to actually play back what was on the card (although with a delay), like tape monitoring.

It's a case that I did a week's worth of work on the v2.3 firmware and *hopefully* haven't had issues with the files (listened to a load of random recordings, which were fine and had no complaints back yet). I've found the UDF recordings on this to be pretty robust, with card speed errors it's recorded up to that point, however it's a problem if it's just recording garbage...

Or 744T, which can monitor off-disk while recording (with a big delay).  The early 7xx recorders all did this, they dropped it with the 788.

 

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8 hours ago, Derek H said:

As far as I know when you set your Nomad or Maxx to monitor a card track you're really just routing whatever is routed to that track to your headphone.  

It does not read the track off the recording media in real-time. If it did there would be a noticeable delay.

That said, I also trust the MARF system.

what I mean is if I see the red light and it sounds good I know it is on the card....

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6 hours ago, Soundmind said:

Operators of SX-R4+: 

 

1) What is your favoured monitoring mode? C or LR?

 

2) Has anyone tried shooting direct to camera via the XLR 5 option card? 

1) usually leave it on LR and change panning between doing a split mix and mono mix. I find it slightly annoying that the default setting is to have all tracks going to headphones, rather than the first 2 (which I use for mix). I usually solo with PFL rather than using the headphone menu

2) Yes, but you can't send mix tracks without it being on v2.3 firmware. I have a cable made with returns going to the line ins

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8 hours ago, Richard Thomas said:

1) usually leave it on LR and change panning between doing a split mix and mono mix. I find it slightly annoying that the default setting is to have all tracks going to headphones, rather than the first 2 (which I use for mix). I usually solo with PFL rather than using the headphone menu

2) Yes, but you can't send mix tracks without it being on v2.3 firmware. I have a cable made with returns going to the line ins

1) The headphone/ mix matrix can be mistaken for each other because they look they same. Took me a while to remind myself "read the name at the top". 

2) Oh yes, only v2.3 allowed the enabling of the option card. Guess I'll wait for the time being. I intend to use the Remote Audio return box to free channels for when it is operations are ready.

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17 hours ago, Soundmind said:

1) The headphone/ mix matrix can be mistaken for each other because they look they same. Took me a while to remind myself "read the name at the top". 

2) Oh yes, only v2.3 allowed the enabling of the option card. Guess I'll wait for the time being. I intend to use the Remote Audio return box to free channels for when it is operations are ready.

I tend not to use the headphone matrix as it requires more button presses and I keep changing the routing and you have to deselect the current routing when solo is engaged.  I'd like it if there were solo shortcuts for individual AES3 tracks, rather than in pairs (my radio mics go in on there so they're all used individually)

The option card will work on v2.2, but there was a bug where the mix tracks wouldn't be sent to it which was fixed in v2.3

 

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tarasov   

I pre-ordered an R4+ what seems like years ago, attracted to the boasts of amazing features and quality in one small package, as well as the connectivity option via Dante protocol (I use a Yamaha 01v96i and bought an mLan Dante card in anticipation of the R4+ arrival). After paying up-front, and without inspection of a physical unit, one arrived many months later after the actual 'release' date. Within days of testing it, there was 1), an intermittent 'popping' noise in the monitor chain (went 'to tape'  as well),  and  2),  a crackle and buzz when WiFi was engaged. This, in addition to no battery door  and one of the rubber legs missing.  I brought this up with my local dealer as well as Sonosax, and the unit was replaced (still no battery door or Dante option though). I check in with this thread now and then to see what's happening but all feels quite disheartening. No follow-up from Sonosax re my previous issues or things Dante. That said,  anyone want to buy a barely used R4+ and an mLan Dante card? 

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That said,  anyone want to buy a barely used R4+ and an mLan Dante card? 

You sure know how to advertise for it ;)

I have been somewhat discouraged from buying this recorder thanks to this thread, too.
Although, mostly that was because of features rather than build, but now that seems to be another reason.
Sonosax to me was always the gold standard in mixers. If you could afford an SX-ST then you had made it. I was always longing for the day when I could afford one - and justify its purchase. That day came and went, because I lost trust and with the R4 I just don't know what it has to offer me. It seems like my trusty 788T is still on par or even superiour to the R4. I read a lot about work-arounds and ergonomics which are so simple on the 788.

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I think people are going with R4+ because they love the sound of it.

Now if you want a mature recorder don't buy one when it's not yet on the market. Wait for the other ones to make the beta tester (Richard and Jürg made a great job on this). I do this for all camera I buy/rent, and I think it also applys to sound equipment.

I love to be a beta tester with cameras (I'm a RED fan ;-) so I know when things are ready for production and what to do or not before a production day. Upgrading a FW the day it is released is, for example, not a thing to do before a production day.

Know your tools. Invest time in knowing it. And then let it sing.

Pat

Ps: None is forced to buy a company name product.

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4 hours ago, Constantin said:

Sonosax to me was always the gold standard in mixers....

It seems like my trusty 788T is still on par or even superiour to the R4. I read a lot about work-arounds and ergonomics which are so simple on the 788.

The "gold standard" I've always read about is how amazing the mic preamps sounded. I thought "Sure, what big difference can there be with my 788T/664/633?" Wow, they really sounds different. 

We all know Sonosax makes great sounding mixers. Their strategy of releasing the R4+ and slowly implementing firmware updates to fulfil it's full potential was something I anticipated and eagerly await. It is an unusual way of selling a product compared to the other brands, one that has drawn lots of flak, but how I long for the day, and I hope it is soon, where we will have the last laugh.  

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I'm just going to put it down that I'm not a beta tester, I'm just a user who's been keen to get the machine to do what I need it to and (I'm not sure if it's because I've been using it slightly differently) have had a fair bit of feedback back to Sonosax with bug reports etc which has meant I've had a few firmware versions early with bug fixes.

I'm aware that Sonosax are not a big company and there have been various setbacks with both the software and hardware development with this machine.  I was a bit disappointed at release too, and it wasn't until v2.0 firmware and with the xlr output board that it really did what I needed on a day to day basis. Actually there's still a bug on the output board routing after v2.3 was pulled (this was the reason I had v2.3 early).

Having said this, I've been using this machine since October last year and have done a lot of recordings with it. I'm pleased with the speed that I heard about this v2.3 issue and although it scared the hell out of me (having made 7 days of recordings on it), I've also heard of sh*t happening with recorders made by other professional manufacturers...

 

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