Jump to content
JBond

Nagra Stories Sound-men won’t ever tell

Recommended Posts

Vienna   

BTW: My collector friend has been offered a Nagra I (yes!). If the deal gets along, I'll go with him to have a look at it, just to make sure it's not a re-engineered II.

Nobody knows exactly how many of these I's have been built, even Stefan K. remembered only vaguely, so this might be a hot item.

I myself own a pair of II's, I had to re-build the missing external VU meter (something a responsible collector would never do, I know :-) and restoring both of them to working order was fun.

One of my finest machines is a David Lang and I'm trying to get a comprehensive overview of all the specialists modifying Nagras for their purposes. Information is very much appreciated!

sorry, David LANE

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   
 
There's only One, Nagra I - but they made 25 of them.
 
Hi Vienna, welcome to Jwsound
 

I myself have not heard of other Nagra copies. I have seen the Russian copy SNST before with the amp a couple of times now.  In fact, a Russian Amp was on eBay a while back and was new sealed in plastic, at the time I had no interest in it. I have never seen a Russian copy SNST on eBay before, only in other collections. 

Your pictures you posted are great. 
 
It's good to hear you have a Nagra II with the plug in VU meter. You certainly did not devalue it because you repaired or replaced the meter. Are you a collector also? Or you just have these three machines?  Two Nagra II’s and a David Lane?
 
Your welcome to post and talk about your collection here.
I have read different amounts of the Nagra I’s that were made, most just speculation, but the least amount was 25 and that is probably a high number. 
The only one I have ever seen was is Nagra’s own collection and from a picture I have. 
 
jruH4Qb.jpg
 
 
Remember there is only one style Nagra I, many people call a Nagra II a Nagra I. 
The color is brown.
No meter.
No window in the top lid.
and most important the reel hub nut is off center. 
Missing any of the above it’s Not a Nagra I. Except maybe the color, who knows?
 
So it’s good that you will go with your friend to check it out. When you do, take some pictures of it and post them here. Not much information is known about them and it would be nice to have more information and pictures.
I would also love to see your restored Nagra II with the plug in meter.
Show and tell about your collection would be much appreciated. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

Very, very nice, you have a great (“small” as you say) collection, a lot of rare pieces and very well displayed, you know what to collect.  I wish more people would post their collections here.  If nothing else, I wouldn’t look like the only crazy person in the world.  

You did such an excellent job duplicating that meter it looks factory. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
dela   

Yes, it is a fine collection of machinery. And there is no need for apologizing for showing non-nagra things; I can see a lot of machines that are equally or more interesting than the Nagras (and that is not an easy thing for me to say). I still regret that I didn´t do more to get the Perfection PM6E offered on eBay last year; I can see that you have one... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

Vienna

What a great room for your collection, with such high ceilings. In looking at your pictures, you have a lot of top shelf recorders like the Very rare Sony M 4 wind up,  Stellavox SM5, that unique upright EMI windup, and of course the “working” 1st series VPR-5 since the camera is attached I assume it's working. A couple of very rare Maihak’s,  An unusual TapaK wind up, A Bota wind up,  and an excellent Minitape Reporter wind up, I also see some Johnny Walker in that group, what better place to share a couple of drinks between collectors viewing your museum. 

Very well thought out room. Then, must be on the other side of the room I take it the high-end Nagra’s and reels. 
 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vienna   

JB, dela, thanks for your kind words! In order for me to verify whether we're talking about the same Viennese collector I suggest you contact me by 'private mail'.

BTW: my other collection consists of vintage movie- and photo cameras, but methinks this forum's not the right place to post the pictures. If anyone's interested I'll send a link to my dropbox.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vienna   

JB,

using a rainy day I read all the 17+ pages of this topic, I saw that your VPR-5 is apparently still sitting there unused. If you want to make it work, I can get you in contact with the wizard who fixed a broken sensor in mine, he's got pre-recorded tapes and I'm reasonably sure that he also has some fitting reels.

Audio- and video input modules are readily available on eBay, and with any external 12V power supply it should work fine even without the '40h test phase'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

All 17 pages and you’re  still alive? Thats got to be a record. 

From what I have been told, the machine is complete but never finished. Supposedly it’s 40 man hrs to set it up to work? It has never been set up. I don’t know how true that is but that is what I have been told. I since have most of the modules. 

The first VPR-5 I bought from Nagra and unfortunately sold, came with the beautiful battery pack, reels and tape.  I was able to charge that battery and run the machine for as long as I wanted in play, rewind and fast forward. It was nice just to see it work and hear the jet like sounds it makes. 

I was able to make a couple of reels for my current machine by cutting down two larger reels on my lathe, that is good for now, but still looking for the correct 5.5 plastic reels, battery, and charger.

This current machine when I use a power supply will power up and play for a few seconds then shuts down. It does not rewind or fast forward like the other one did.
 
Earlier this year in March, I  was lucky enough to buy two complete Ampex VPR-3 machines,  500.00 for the pair. Just had to pick them up.
One works just fine with no problems. They both came out of a (PBS) Public Broadcast Station out of New York state,  WCNY TV. 
WCNY moved into a new building with all new equipment,  so this machine and many others items were sold off. The machine has some real history to it. I believe they had 6 or 8 of them, all controlled by the controller shown on top the machine in the picture. I bought VTR number 12 and 13.
 
I also received some posters and photos of the TV station and employees, even a couple of monogrammed WCNY coffee cups.  That flip time slate shown on top of the machine with a matching
picture showing the slate in use. There are a  number of different times on the slate, I guess its used for for showing how much time is left before going live.  Also a few 1 inch tapes with original WCNY PBS TV programing.  All that makes it better then getting some VPR 3 machine out of a warehouse without any information of its life history.
Why buy it?
Well the price was right, and I thought it would be nice to contrast the two VPR machines. The VPR-3 was the top of the line at the time. Some say the most advanced reel to reel video recorder machine ever. 
And on the other hand the portable VPR-5  the first  portable C video tape machine of its size .
But it  was short lived due to
Sony Betamax cassette being developed around the same time.
That VPR-3 ’s jog shuttle can whip that tape around so fast, stop on a dime and go back and forth frame by frame with such ease.  Someday I'll make a video of it.  My wife says its big and ugly, but I like it. 
 
 
HEwdMcG.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.ACYBqvb.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.
RbJWXqX.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vienna   

Depressing to think that my phone records four times the quality of my VPR-5 ... you were right in assuming that my Ampex Nagra works fine with the Sony BVP300 and with the Ikegami HL-79, too. We did ENG for TV with both cameras, recording on the much cheaper Sony BVU-110 with reasonable quality. For EFP (Electronic Field Production) we had the 'portable' (ha!) Bosch 1" B-standard.

Today, independent movies are shot with the iPhone. But I'm still listening to music on tape and vinyl and still feeling mainstream, as more and more albums are again published on vinyl.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The VPR3 might have been advanced, but it was also very cantankerous compared to the Sony 1" Type C decks (BVH 1000 and on).  The video company I worked for rarely had all of its VPRs working at the same time, but the Sonys generally rolled on and on.  In the field, (yes we took 1" machines into the field all the time) the Sony machines were by far the faves--the Ampex machines did not last for us on location at all.  When the VPR5 became available, there was talk about getting a few, which the facility's chief engineer nixed: by then the eng staff were pretty down on Ampex, didn't know anything about Nagra and the machine looked to be complex to service.  And then there was the expense, and the advent of Betacam...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vienna   

Philip,

I have the same experience, our boss would never have sent us to an ENG shooting with a recorder priced as high as the VPR-5.

Instead we used High-Band for some time (following 16mm film) and then, no, not Betacam, but MII. I won't speculate about this decision ...

Retired now I could afford to buy a non-working VPR-5, found a young genius who helped me repair it. I can now fully understand that I would't have been able to shoot news with the Ampex Nagra in, let's say, Beirut or any other crisis area and come back with useable content. Which we could and did with the BVU-110.

But really, this is not a story to be told in the Nagra forum, sorry dear colleagues, I promise never to do it again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

A  Nagra VPR-5 is listed on Ebay right now for $8,000.00.  With the amount of tapes, batteries, gang chargers etc. this VPR--5 saw some use. Someone tried to get some of their $45,000.00 dollar investment back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

 

Hmm ..... I wonder... how true to life my picture really is?  It was the top of the line spy recorder of the day.

This info just out today.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/08/30/watergate-cia-withheld-data-on-double-agent.html

fAh1WLb.jpgPhotos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   
On August 29, 2016 at 11:36 AM, New Nagra Fan said:

Does anyone know a good market for a Nagra JBR and PS01? We received one of each as part of an electronics clean-out for a government agency.

Thanks!

How about posting a couple of pictures of what you have , on this thread, not to sell, but to see what it is and the condition they are in after government use.  Jwsound has a separate forum for buying and selling in another section.  Anybody interested in or looking for Nagra on the internet will be directed here at Jwsound, just as you were.

Pictures would be great, thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was going through some piles of old documents (having just cleared the Cretaceous layer I am entering the Jurassic: when will I ever reach the Cambrian?) I found this.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/40718050/Nagra.pdf

It might be of some interest?

Apologies for repetition of the first SN page - my mind wandered as I was scanning and I really couldn't be bothered to re-scan.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

 

Thanks Nick for posting that review, I never saw that before, its pretty detailed and complete. 

 

 

A quote from Nagra 

Quote

 

The information you have found Nagra Kudelski Group historical milestones) is inaccurate ! (We will ask NAGRAVISION to correct it)

Please refer to OUR web site www.nagraaudio.com for the accurate dates and information.

 

 

 

 

 

Hmm over thirty days and never corrected. 

Seems to me, the SN history statement  which you can find here,  http://www.nagraaudio.com/about-us/product-history/  is highly inaccurate since it explains nothing and all four (4) SN write ups  say the exact same thing. 1960. 1970, 1972 and 1973 all say the exact same thing, if you click on Key features , all the same.

Choice number 2

Whereas the other one, Historical Milestones in Nagras history,   https://www.nagra.com/group/history 

You would think they would have to make sure they have accurate information in writing their complete milestones in history year by year from day one. I'm sure that complete Milestone history draft was ran across the board of directors before going public.  They would of had to get the boards approval for that list, I would think, or some committee within the board. It wasn't some web site manager approving it or copy and paste, like the other timeline Nagra says is correct.

Which do you believe?  Historical Milestones or Nagra History page that shows 4 generic descriptions. 

So I guess for now it remains 1965 as the first year the Nagra SN came out, and came out secretly.  Not 1960 as was written for years and years and not 1970 as the first year the Nagra SN came out, as Nagra Audio says it is. 

Maybe someday, someone will read this post and would remember using a Nagra SN recorder before 1970, that would solve the mystery. 

Inaccurate ! If anything is inaccurate in that timeline, I would think it would be "Worldwide expansion from 1974" should be Worldwide expansion from 1970.   Since I have SN pamphlets dated 1971 and 1973,  the 1974 date I think is wrong. The world knew about the SN   by 1970, 1971.

Its messed up, Nagra is caught up in miss information, and I don't think they know how or want to correct it at this point. 

I 'm probably the only one that ever asked for clarification of the Nagra SN timeline before. 

u9eyw9P.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

An appropriate answer,

Sorry to you guys that get an email each time I post but I had to make some corrections to this. 
Then for some reason it posted 5 copies, so I had to delete it again.  
 
You read this before,  Now it has a new twist at the end. 
 
 I asked these 4 questions to Nagra Audio and  M Kudelski back on July 31st
as plain as I could ask the questions and numbered.  I wanted these answers. 
 
Questions
 
#  1  From what I understand and assume,  your father Mr Kudelski made the SN prototype around 1960.
        That prototype model that you have was never produced and was just the prototype. Is that correct? 
 
#  2  Was the second Nagra SN  developed from the prototype and looked like mine in these pictures? 
 
Per the statement on your web site  (Nagra Kudelski Group Historical Milestones)   The year 1965 the first Nagra SN’s  were sold “secretly” to the US government. 
 
#  3   Is this plain no name Nagra SN considered one of the first production Models Nagra delivered in 1965 ? 
 
#  4   The serial number 811  40  - does this mean it’s #40 out of 811 originally ordered by the US government?
This is my guess.  Do I have it right?  Or what does the serial number 811  40 mean?
 
 
4DR29I9.jpg
 
After not hearing from them for 5 days, I sent another email asking if they received my last email since I also sent large pictures with it and  I didn’t know if it got thru.
 
Nagra Audio replied.
 
Dear Sir,
We received your previous Email with thanks.
Please bear a few days so that we can prepare an appropriate answer.
 
An appropriate answer, I liked that answer, I thought finally I will get some answers.
 
The Next day M. Kudelski replied.
She referred the answers to someone named John,  because she didn’t know the answers. 
My questions shown again in BLUE,   Nagras answers below in RED
 
Hello,
Regarding to your questions, I asked John, I transmit you his answers

The information you have found Nagra Kudelski Group historical milestones) is inaccurate ! (We will ask NAGRAVISION to correct it)

Please refer to OUR web site www.nagraaudio.com for the accurate dates and information.

 
#  1  From what I understand and assume,  your father Mr Kudelski made the SN prototype around 1960.
        That prototype model that you have was never produced and was just the prototype. Is that correct? 
 

#1)   The prototype we have was the original unit designed in 1960 yet never produced. The first “official” SN was not developed until 10 years later circa 1970, and the first units we actually sold in 1971.

 

#  2  Was the second Nagra SN  developed from the prototype and looked like mine in these pictures? 
 
Per the statement on your web site  (Nagra Kudelski Group Historical Milestones)   The year 1965 the first Nagra SN’s  were sold “secretly” to the US government. 
 

#2) Your SN is a relatively early machine and was built in the first year of manufacturing. It is NOT a prototype, but a production model.

#  3   Is this plain no name Nagra SN considered one of the first production Models Nagra delivered in 1965 ? 

 

#3) Early SN machines did NOT have any printing on the deck plates. It was introduced in the early ‘70s but we do not have an accurate date or serial number for this. Various different versions were created over the years.

 

#  4   The serial number 811  40  - does this mean it’s #40 out of 811 originally ordered by the US government?
This is my guess.  Do I have it right?  Or what does the serial number 811  40 mean?
 

#4) The SN serial numbers were consecutive, and our records start at # 75 which was probably the first model actually sold. The number following the serial number corresponds to a technical evolution level and is referred to as the “Indice #”. We do not have records defining all the different indices, but they were due to the change in the thickness of the deck plate (from 1 to 3 mm) and the changes made to the motors etc.

All we can certify, is that the SN you have is number 811 and it was manufactured in June 1972 and is an SN-S model. The first slow speed SN was number 83 and manufacturer in September of the previous year (1971).

 
The next day after receiving the answers above, I wrote one more email asking for clarification. I wrote it as simple as I could. 
 
 Sorry to bother you again. I have just one more question I need to clarify. And I won’t keep bothering you. You said the 1965 date is wrong.

If the Prototype made in 1960 was never produced and the first SN was made in 1970 

                       1960………………………………………………..…………1970 

Are you saying there was NO secret recorder sold in between these dates?  If there was, did it look like? The plain SN I have? The prototype, or a different machine altogether.

Thank you 
That was back on Aug 5th and never received an answer. 
 
So about the answers I did received.
  
First look at his  # 2 answer,  he states that my SN was built in the “FIRST” year of manufacturing.  but then in the last sentence of #4 he says mine was manufactured in June of 1972
 
His answer to # 3,  he states we do not have accurate date or serial numbers for this. 
 
In his answer to # 4,  he states the number 40 was the “technical evolution number” which clearly made no sense to me. So are they telling me in 811 units made they had 40 changes in production at this point? 
 
Looking at the answers now Its almost like 4 different people answered the 4 questions.
 
But in any case I believed Nagra that my no name plain SN is consecutive serial number 811  with a 40th technical evolution level 
 
So yesterday on ebay a Nagra SN from Germany was listed.  It’s a plain no name Nagra SN like mine but with a Serial number of 811  29   What!  
 
Nagras explanation now did not make any sense to me. And now seeing another serial number 811 this one with a 29th technical evolution  They both can’t be the eight hundred and eleventh Nagra SN made. Nagra says their serial numbers are consecutive.  Something must not have been translated correctly, they say in answer 3 that they don’t have records back then. Did they just make it up?  
 
 
 
Here is the link to the auction.
 
 
 
 
The sellers title
 Offering a NAGRA SNN KUDELSKI MINIATURE RECORDER (SER.NR .: 811 29) 
 
In one of the pictures you can see part of the serial number with a series of holes drilled in it for some later model SN adaptor to fit.
After emailing the seller last night, I confirmed the serial number by asking him for a picture of it. 
 
The serial numbers on the early SN’s were stamped on the underside of the top lid, the underside of the deck, the outside of the deck on the right side and the inside of the bottom cover.
 
He sent me the picture of the inside top cover shown below. Usually and probably always the case in every serial number it’s the last of the serial number that changes with each unit, Not the first digits . 
 
The next unit should have a serial number of 811  30  then 31 ………38……..40 etc. ending up at 811 811 Just like the Nagra II’s and the Nagra III’s do and every other Nagra item ever made does.
I don’t buy the technical evolution level 
 
Odo99Ah.jpg
 
I zoomed in on the serial number on the right side, too bad the numbers got messed up, Its still a very early 
a very early Nagra SN. That you don't see to offen for sale.
 
1COW7zS.jpg
 
The ebay seller states his is a SNN, there are no marking on the recorder so how does he know that ? I asked he said Nagra told him it was a SNN.  The Ebay seller said he had a conversation with Nagra about it if you read the end of the description. 
 
Of course more miss information from Nagra unless the seller got it backwards, Red was the earlier silkscreen on the SN
Black silkscreen came on the later model SN’s
 
Nagras explanation now does not make any sense to me, after seeing another serial # 811? Its very hard to believe the second numbers are the technical evolution level 
 
The only thing I can think of is, mine is the 811th SNS and the one for sale on Ebay is the 811th SNN with a earlier different technical evolution level .  But that makes no sense at all because you don’t have a running count of the units, are they saying there are two of every number?  811  More Miss information, I think.
 
These plain no name Nagras are as scarce as can be, yet the only two ever to go up for sale recently are both the same exact consecutive serial number 811?  One a SNS the other a SNN. 
 
That would be a pretty big coincidence both marked 811 show up. One from Italy a private seller  and one from Germany an Ebay seller.
Unless, eight hundred and eleven of them had the serial number 811 on them, followed by a second running number. Even that would be rare for two to show up.
 
If another early Nagra SN turns up with a serial number of 811 followed by a lower number, my first guess is correct. These were a series of recorders with a grand total of 811 in that series of no name plain recorders.
 
It Could be posable  this is where the Famous Nicknamed Black Series came from? Since no names or markings were on them, especially the SN-S's. The first SN covert recorders.  Seems like nobody knows for sure as admitted from Nagra in answer  # 3
 
Something is messed up here. There is more to this story.

NAGRA the legend lives on… the mysteries continue... 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   

Thank you Rachel, I appreciate your comment very much, but I know nobody really reads it. They just click on to see, What the hell is he trying to say now.

I figure if I go on about it, someday, somebody will chime in and say listen! You fool! You have it all wrong, this is what happen, I know, because I was there.
 
That is one reason why I post, for more information, and it doesn’t hurt to pick up a rare no name Nagra recorder along the way either.
 
It’s beginning to look like if anybody searches for Nagra pictures on line they will end up here at Jwsound, sooner or later someone is going to tell me what they know.
I believe there are people, agencies, etc. right now that know or can find out the answer.
 
But sadly, more and more I’m beginning to think the early Nagra SN story may just have been a myth all along. More hype than reality.  I can’t say for sure just yet.
So why can’t Nagra clear up whats all over the internet?
 
Think about it, If you were the worlds leading manufacture in covert related equipment .
Would you put an end to the famous SN story, now myth that has been around since the sixties? 
Like I said before, do a search of Stefan Kudelski and the SN recorder is front and center in just about every article. Is it true or not should be determined.
 
 
 
I did find a confirmation of “1974” as the year the SNST came out.  Not 1977 as Nagras timeline suggests.
 
This is the time line I come up with now.
1965 Nagra Plain SN secret black series, (not sure if this is true or not at this point). But is still on Nagra’s site in spite of telling me its incorrect.
 
1971 Nagra Plain SN sold world wide
1973 Nagra first Red "Silkscreen" version SN
1974 Nagra first SNST stereo 2 channel covert recorder sold secretly for 10 years, solely to the US government.  It also coincides with the date the JBR was released 10 years later in 1984 the next secret recorder.
 
That 1974 date, instead of the 1977 date, makes more sense since the US had two channel recorders beginning in the early sixties.
Based on the 1977 date why it would take Nagra either 12  or 6  years to add another channel was always hard to believe why it took so long. 
Depending whether or not you believe the 1965 date or the 1971 date for the first SN.  
 
 But this information seems to fall on the side of Nagra when they say the first SN was out in 1971 and the first SNST out 3 years later in 1974,
I doubt very much it would have taken them more then three years to develop the secret 2 channel SNST for the US Government.
 
I can say with certainly the 1960 Nagra prototype was just a prototype and was not sold thru out the sixties.  What I can’t determined is what Nagra says is true, the SN was NOT around until 1971. Or sold secretly starting in1965. One or the other.
 
That date 1965 fits in with my collection of US covert recorders, since sometime after 1966 names on the recorders and manufacturers names on the recorders starting appearing on my same style covert recorders, same units, now only with names.
I contribute this to,
 When sales of these recorders to the government stopped or slowed down,
It allowed these manufacturers to finally sell to others, police departments , private investigators etc.
So the names started showing up on these recorders when the government started using something else, like another no name recorder, the Nagra SN?  Maybe if you go with the 1965 date.
 
This statement or one of many like it, bugs me.
The letters 'SN' stand for Série Noir (Black Series) as the recorder was originally ordered by US President John F. Kennedy for use by the American secret services  These statements are all over the internet, I don’t believe the statement as being true, And frankly, I don’t like being mislead 50 or more years after the fact, if that is the case that it’s not true.  Its either true or it's not.
 
Remember this 
Sorry to bother you again. I have just one more question I need to clarify. And I won’t keep bothering you. You said the 1965 date is wrong.
If the Prototype made in 1960 was never produced and the first SN was made in 1970 
                       1960………………………………………………..…………1970 
Are you saying there was NO secret recorder sold in between these dates?  If there was, did it look like? The plain SN I have? The prototype, or a different machine altogether.

Thank you 
ZIP………nothing
 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JBond   
The Early Nagra SN serial number line up.  
 
The Ebay Nagra SN serial number 811  29.  It could be number 29 in this series of 811 units. But maybe not.

Why is the 811 stamped nice and neat and the number 29 is not. Because it’s the end number that is always changing with each unit?


UwLfcGi.jpg

Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.



The Ebay sellers Nagra SN shown with the switch installed over the serial number 811  29 You will notice every one below except my no name Nagra has the cutout and switch installed. Someone modified this very early Nagra SN to be like all the others

ebxtUDT.jpg
My plain no name SN serial number 811  40    Could it be its number 40 in this series of 811 units.  

4DR29I9.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.
My 1973 SN recorder serial number shown here the 1,541 Nagra SN made.
You can also clearly see here on this very early SN has RED silkscreen. Whereas all the later ones shown have the Black Silkscreen. Nagra told the Ebay seller written in an email that the silkscreen started with black and ended up red. Well, according to my stack of SN’s shown below that is not true, is it. 
It started with RED first, as shown below, then went to BLACK, there are some later ones that were also red, but most are black. 
 At this point I’m not sure the current people at Nagra really know anything about a 50 year old Nagra SN
 
You can see starting with this one and with all of the later models shown they all have those three holes for some switch or plug. Believe it or not I don’t even know what that is for. I could look in the manual but that is upstairs right now. 
 
I would say the serial numbers changed once the silkscreening was added to the Nagra SN. 
Starting with serial number 812  without any technical evolution level numbers. 
That 812 serial number continued on to 1541 shown below and right up to the last SN made all consecutive numbers like anything else Nagra ever made.  
Thus separating the initial 811 ordered by the US Government, the so called Nagra Black covert series from the rest of the SN recorders. 
After all,  Nagra and many others said over the years the Nagra SN was commissioned by the US secret Service right, Commissioned by the US Government, etc.
Well, this is how I interpret this. If I’m wrong oh well someone give me some additional credible information. 
 
I can assure you, it’s the last numbers here in the picture below that change with every unit made.  Not the first ones. On this recorder below the 15 didn’t change the 41 did.
 
qgQQzud.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.
 This next one S for Slow speed, the 5,726 Nagra SN made, It does not meant it’s the 5,726 SNS made.  Its all SN’s total to date.  Also note the BLACK silkscreen.  
 I can assure you, it’s the last numbers here that change with every new unit made. 
 
DhzpwGf.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.
 
The latest Nagra SN that I have,  the 7,171 Nagra SN made.  Now where the serial number was on the earlier SN’s,  a sticker designating what model it is.  The serial number is moved to the rear side and on a separate plate as shown below, I can assure you, it’s the last numbers here that change with every new unit made.
 
4QwJnH7.jpg
cUjz3eM.jpg
Photos marked with RJW are copyrighted.  Any use other than private with or without the RJW watermark is strictly forbidden, without written permission from the owner.Not to throw a monkey wrench in the mix but look at this serial number. What the hell do you make of that? Red silkscreen and a number of 23 thousand.  
 
NbQ7Z0l.jpg
 
Look how proud this guy is , could the letters on his building be any larger? The letters remind me of the
Nagra III deck plate 
RbAZgFj.jpg
 
 
 
 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×