RadoStefanov

OneUnit Lite and Compact 6 wireless/RF Distro/Recorder/battery 6 pounds development

143 posts in this topic

Some of you are familiar with my obsessive pursuit of smaller and liter setup.

I finally came up with a goal:

  1. Lite and Compact 6 wireless/RF Distro/Recorder/battery 6 pounds 
  2. Fits in the smaller Hotel/Motel safes.
  3. OneUnit no cables device 

My first challenge is finding and fabricating a common shell that will be liter but just as strong as the nomad shell.

Then I need to find a way to combine everything together but still be able to remove individual units for replacement.

 To Be Continued...

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I love sound devices and they are great company but their stuff are too big and heavy for my liking.

Also there are other people that came up with this design... 

then I sugest an old Nagra IV for some perspective

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I love sound devices and they are great company but their stuff are too big and heavy for my liking.

Also there are other people that came up with this design... 

But.... it works.....  LOL

 

  Let me re phrase this this way....

 

  I would take 3 extra pounds gladly, knowing that this gear is going to be trouble free, get me through my day and not leave me explaining to clients why I had dependability issues...

 

  If that means I do not have Zaxcom, no clip...and have to adjust manually... with no recorder back-up in the transmitters... than so be it...  

 

Light weight, without confidence in the gear I am using, is a feeling I personally don't care for...

 

I do however commend you Rado on your constant flow of thinking out of the box... Your a mover and shaker for sure... keep it up....  we may one day be using your gear...  ::)

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I love Sound Devices also and this is a fine setup, 688 + CL-6 + SL-6, but this set (pictured below) is much larger, much heavier, doesn't integrate Zaxcom wireless, has far less capability than Rado is trying to achieve.

 

post-1-0-34927600-1430052280_thumb.jpg

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I would take 3 extra pounds gladly, knowing that this gear is going to be trouble free, get me through my day and not leave me explaining to clients why I had dependability issues...

Not quite sure what your issue is but there are plenty sound mixers, including myself, who are successfully running Zaxcom kits "trouble free" with no "dependability issues".

And from what I have been reading here, Facebook and out online forums it appears that other recorders on the market have been experiencing way more "dependability issues" lately.

So by no means am I saying that you should try or even use zaxcom products - but please don't go on continously bashing gear that you don't even use.

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Guys, let's have people free to give there opinion. It is a free forum and should not have constant wars going on. Some people like Zaxcom, others like Sound Devices. Buy what you want, end of discussion.

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Guys, let's have people free to give there opinion. It is a free forum and should not have constant wars going on. Some people like Zaxcom, others like Sound Devices. Buy what you want, end of discussion.

+1

There are some people who approach their gear as a religion. They consider equipment they don't personally use to be heresy.

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I'm curious as to why you have two hotel safes in your office? Lol

Very curious to see how you achieve it. I know you'll come up with something.

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Not quite sure what your issue is but there are plenty sound mixers, including myself, who are successfully running Zaxcom kits "trouble free" with no "dependability issues".

And from what I have been reading here, Facebook and out online forums it appears that other recorders on the market have been experiencing way more "dependability issues" lately.

So by no means am I saying that you should try or even use zaxcom products - but please don't go on continously bashing gear that you don't even use.

No issue Jack, only opinion.... pretty simple...

 

  My post is in regard to how I view the relationship of weight savings and my perceived view of that gears workability in the field,  it's service dept,,  quality control and overall dependability..  Verses  weight savings...  

  I don't use it for a variety of reasons I have stated..

  I read constant complaints regarding these issues and have for years.... I have also spoken to quite a few people who echo these sediments in person..   I don't read the constant drumbeat from other companies...  

Nobody is bashing, it's an opinion on weight verses dependable gear... Nothing wrong with that.

I feel it is a valid point...

 

 If I am on a motorcycle forum and I state I prefer the Kawasaki Concourse over the Yamaha FJR, for the same reasons, nobody there cares... It's open opinion.... Yamaha does not care, they know in the real world this is how it goes...  Some people are on board, some not...  You don't have to own one to have these opinions.. But we discuss the same things, weight, handling, dependability and overall feeling regarding the product.  Few people are offended.. They just post back their opinions and the forum moves on...   Loyal users OK, I get it... but don't be so offended guys... It's just a web forum.. not a war, a fight, an abomination... 

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Rado, I am very interested and what you will be doing. I feel we have been working toward the same goal in a different way with different tools but exactly for those reasons, I think we have both benefited from what the other did and the same goes for every other person on this forum. I have inspired myself from so many ideas I saw here.

So whether it is a Zaxcom, sound devices, Sonosax or Radio shack rig you get, I am more interested in the approach then the gear. After all a wireless receiver or a mixer pretty much are the same. What features, color or button one as doesn't the fact that I am after creative approach and ideas. I don't care if it records or it's a slot receiver, if it's digital or analog. I'm interested in the package ( bag, dc, audio signal routing, weight and size ). The rest is a matter of preference, comfort and opinion.

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So about a while ago, I had the idea of wiring all my wireless receivers directly into my recorder ( all analog ) by fitting my recorder with a multipin connector installed directly on the chassis. That connector would wire itself directly into the back of the recorder connector by soldering in parallel to it. Then I was going to make a box that would include my slot receiver ( in individual slot a la Octopack ), with DC and RF distro included. The box would attach directly on the recorder over the connector and would then be linked together. The way I was going to wire things was as follow:

Receiver out into a 3way selector switch:

Position 1: signal of receiver to XLR

Position 2: signal of receiver to TA3

Position 3: signal of receiver going to a external DB25 in order to send signal to an external mixer.

But then, PSC came out with there unit and then Sojnd Devices came out with SL6.

I think the idea is still viable.

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Staying back on topic, I'm interested to see where this goes. Even if I don't go "Full Rado", it gives me ideas. I drilled my Nomad case after Rado and Jose did it, and I'm super happy with the results.

Hypothetically if you did something fun like pulled the Nomad shell and replaced it with carbon fiber, wouldn't there be potential RF (and grounding) issues?

I do totally agree that looking at a Nomad and RX12, there seems like a perfect project for Dr Frankenstein to combine 6 channels of receivers to guts of a Nomad with digital signal connections and all powered off an Inspired Energy / AudioRoot type of battery. In one "box".

PERSONALLY my plan is to have a Nomad bag built with 6 channels of receivers, then a Maxx for smaller jobs with one or two QRXs. The idea of my Nomad rig always having those receivers is fine. I can add SRb receivers if I need some Lectrosonics channels too. They are wonderfully small and could fit into the bag for this dream rig. If you jump on a cart, the single unit jumps on a shelf and is built for external RF connections already. I saw people doing that years ago. The Velcro'd an Octopack to the top of a Fusion or 788T and popped the whole block in and out of a bag. Made me jealous every time I had to repatch between a Venue on the cart and 411s in the bag.

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I love Sound Devices also and this is a fine setup, 688 + CL-6 + SL-6, but this set (pictured below) is much larger, much heavier, doesn't integrate Zaxcom wireless, has far less capability than Rado is trying to achieve.

 

attachicon.gif688 with a CL-6 and SL-6.jpg

 

to be fair about the size/weight - if you are comparing them apples to apples the photo shouldn't have the cl6 attached to compare the two - just the sl6.

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Great thread, thanks for the inspiration everyone. My brain is working OT to get closer to this type of bag setup.

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And they should be seen side by side- the SD unit is significantly wider that the Zax unit (plus the side mounted connections)

to be fair about the size/weight - if you are comparing them apples to apples the photo shouldn't have the cl6 attached to compare the two - just the sl6.

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I've been working on similar goals myself.

My smaller bag setup currently features a Maxx with 2 QRXs, an Audioroot distro and an Inspired Energy battery that powers the entire thing for a whole day. The entire setup weighs a little under 4 lbs, 1 lb being the battery alone.

post-8621-14300604923232.jpg

It's an all in one unit, inspired from Rado's original design. Currently, it's being cased into an Orca OR-30 bag, I'm contemplating on building a custom bag that's lighter and more functional to my needs.

My Nomad bag is still being reworked too, but I'm not too far off from your goals, Rado. Thanks again for the inspiration.

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I personally think that there are a couple of things to address when going this route:

1- I believe that a DC distro is not necessary and can be easily replaced by a simple network of paralleled cables. ferrites filter can be added in case of issues. That way we can eliminate a unit. Of course the best would be for a recorder unit to have a built in battery slot and DC distro in it.

2- one has to decide on RF distro or not.

3- internal wiring is the way of the futur in my mind. Having mfg copy there inputs on a multipin connector that is recessed and protected is the way to go and make a unit that is easy to use with many different product.

4- using a single block design In order to eliminate the need for a bag that holds everything together but instead is a simple sleeve to protect against dust and rain.

5- using the frame of this single block design to anchor attach point for an harness and/or belt.

6- have the bag/sleeve easily opened on the side/bottom so that it can be laid on a cart and easily interfaced with mixers/Comtek base etc...

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There is a interesting point here that has been overlooked. Rado uses a MicplexerII. This unit has a 35MHz wide bandpass and is tunable to all US frequency blocks. This feature is in my opinion a must. Multi-couplers that pass everything from 2 way UHF radios in the 500MHz region, powerful out of block TV stations and cell phones above 700MHz are non-starters for any professional sound bag. Without a narrow front end it is very easy to have unintentional mixing (Intermodulation) in the multi-coulper amp that feeds more than one receiver. 

 

Using a wide band amp in front of any wireless receiver adds to the possibility of interference and is not an acceptable risk to production in my opinion.

 

If a point is to be made that it would be good to use a block 21 receiver and a block 26 receiver at the same time, I would suggest that there is no optimal whip antenna that would work well for that situation. While this is not critical it is not desirable.

 

Glenn

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Of course the best would be for a recorder unit to have a built in battery slot and DC distro in it.

This to me would be the more ideal solution. Maybe not so much for it to have a battery slot, but having a dc distro in the recorder to power the other components of your "bag". The recorder would of course give you all the pertinent battery telemetry.

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If I add an FP8 to my Nomad, there's space under it that could house the battery. It would be easy enough to make some sort of slot to keep it tight and in place. Not quite internal, but nearly similar results.

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I have the same goals of a smaller lighter bag, and tighter integration between components is the way to go. It's a bit of a double edged sword. Cable mess and multiple connections are a common point of failure, but if all of the components are actually in one device, then a minor failure shuts down the entire system. A certain amount of modularity is required to keep the system flexible, stable, and streamlined. A chassis that incorporates the brains of the nomad and rx12 with slots for the qrx212 receivers would be along the lines of what I'm thinking.

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You go Rado.  Totally interested in what you are trying to do, Zax stuff or not.  You are a player building his own instrument, that you will take out and "play" every day and that your livelihood and rep will depend on.  In my opinion this is what "real" soundies do, in bags, on carts, in sound trucks whatever: they build up their own rigs to suit their style and client's needs.  Post your progress profusely, please.  You too, Pascal and Jose.

 

phil p

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Its not just smaller and lighter, its keeping the bag "slender", from jutting out from the body. Torque is force times the length of the lever arm. Wearing a 664 with (2) rows of (3) 411s stacked on top of each other creates more torque on the back than a 664 with (1) row of (6), despite the weight being the same. To me, the 664 with a dashboard of SRb's is my back-healthy dream bag.

I'm eager to follow Rado's quest...shave inches of that lever arm length and keep your invention closer to your body.

best,

steven

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