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Zoom F8


Michael Panfeld

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From experience: Electrolytic Capacitors come in various voltage capabilities.  16V is a common value, above that the physical size of the part is significantly larger, so it's difficult to go on the safe side. Running 17V or 18V to a capacitor rated at 16V won't kill it straight away, but will degrade it over time, and it will fail at some unknown time in the future.  At failure, you might get a short or an open, if it's a short the PCB traces might get burned up.

Basically, you're gambling with an expensive out-of-warranty repair in the future.

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for those without a regulated supply [i have a Remote Audio BDS for example] an option is to buy a dc-dc step-down transformer, ensure that the output voltage is set to less than 16v, and wire it into your supply to the zoom. 

They can be purchased for $6 dollars or so, and one can build them into a box for about the same again. 

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hmm, just had an idea that one could also use a diode for that:

the IDX NP style battery for example starts at around 16.8V when fully charged. 

http://www.idxtek.com/sites/default/files/product/datasheet/NP-L7S_Manu_E_0412.pdf

if one uses a common zener diode with a voltage drop of 0.7V one would get down to 16.1V when fully charged and the discharge voltage of 13V would drop to around 12V which is still high enough.

from my rusty math i would expect you loose about 5% efficiency, but a power regulator would likely loose more then that. and as a benefit with the right diode one would have a reverse voltage protection (although i'd hope the F8 has already one built in ; )

 

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5 hours ago, chrismedr said:

from my rusty math i would expect you loose about 5% efficiency, but a power regulator would likely loose more then that. and as a benefit with the right diode one would have a reverse voltage protection (although i'd hope the F8 has already one built in ; )

I've no doubt you are correct, and it would certainly be more elegant..but the current draw on the one I use must be negligible, as even with a voltage display I can't really see an efficiency loss of more than 5% in real world usage.

That's by no means extensively tested, just my feeling about usage times I'm accustomed to.

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  • 2 weeks later...
7 hours ago, Monson Douglas said:

Regarding the 2.0 firmware update.  Have seen multiple sources saying it would include putting the L/R mix to the top of the poly file.  Mine still remains on the bottom just as in the original firmware.  Did that not happen?

Look at the SD Card recording options, which lets you choose what you record to each SD card. There should be options for L/R + 8 inputs

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9 hours ago, Jose Frias said:

Look at the SD Card recording options, which lets you choose what you record to each SD card. There should be options for L/R + 8 inputs

Just updated firmware for a second time to be sure.  When importing into audacity I see that the L/R is indeed first on the list.  (haven't used L/R option for a couple weeks)  I never thought to check because the F8 mix screen still shows them on the bottom, and in the menu option under record it has it ordered as, "tracks 1-8 + L/R". Guess I was hoping for the visual fix on the recorder as well.  Thanks Jose.

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Have any F8 users had much luck with using the Control App? I attempted to use it on a shoot last week but gave up very quickly. Seems like a really good idea, but in a real world situation I wasn't able to do enough with it. It doesn't have the option to create new folders, for example. To do this I have to first disable bluetooth on the F8, go into finder and create the folder, then start bluetooth again to reconnect the iPad. A lot of button presses which could be fixed by allowing the option to create folders on the App. Hopefully we'll see this in an update.

Another bit of feedback is the lack of take reset options. I prefer making user defined scene names, but there is no option to reset the take number after editing the user scene name. Seeing this option in the next firmware (and perhaps also a button shortcut to reset take number?) would be a godsend.

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On 11. 12. 2015 at 2:59 AM, hiro nakamura said:

Hi guys, 

just to let you f8 owners know that something went wrong with audio files from a zoom f8 recorder last night.  the post house reported: last audio file in both main sd card and mirror card having same problem which the audio file only repeatedly loop the first 5 second of the recording for 15 mins long, however, it's a 3 mins piece to camera. 

SD Cards are golden color 32G (will provide more info ) 

Zoom F8 is in its latest firmware, updated before out for recording. 

Recording both cards at the same time. The mixer told me that during the recording, the machine took a while to stop recording. So he took time to listen the playbacks. Only the last file, he didn't. 

Will make full report to zoom official once I get the audio file and the spec of the sd card.  

Hiro 

 

 

 

Hello, have you already found out what´s wrong?

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I had issues with some SD cards but the F8 has built in testing so its best to test prior to field use to ensure the cards will work properly. From what I noticed it really has nothing to do with the speed or capacity of the card. Some cards pass, some cards don't, however they all seemed consistent with repeated testing. Oddly enough the cheapest off the shelf cards from local brick and mortar stores (sandisk, toshiba, pny) all test fine while some other faster and more expensive cards just refuse to pass.

 

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I had issues with some SD cards but the F8 has built in testing so its best to test prior to field use to ensure the cards will work properly. From what I noticed it really has nothing to do with the speed or capacity of the card. Some cards pass, some cards don't, however they all seemed consistent with repeated testing. Oddly enough the cheapest off the shelf cards from local brick and mortar stores (sandisk, toshiba, pny) all test fine while some other faster and more expensive cards just refuse to pass.

 

Is not just speed, it's compatibility of the card itself (seems the "standards" are not absolute when cards are made).

That also goes for recorders from Zaxcom, Sound Devices, Fostex etc.

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5 hours ago, johnpaul215 said:

Is not just speed, it's compatibility of the card itself (seems the "standards" are not absolute when cards are made).

That also goes for recorders from Zaxcom, Sound Devices, Fostex etc.

Yeah, thank goodness Zoom had the foresight to put testing software into the F8. I certainly don't fault the F8 or the SD cards for the issue. Its just the nature of these types of machines which hopefully will prevent on-set disasters with the sound department. I am contemplating starting a thread for supported/unsupported cards based on F8 users tests.

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On 1/29/2016 at 9:00 PM, TJD said:

Have any F8 users had much luck with using the Control App? I attempted to use it on a shoot last week but gave up very quickly. Seems like a really good idea, but in a real world situation I wasn't able to do enough with it. It doesn't have the option to create new folders, for example. To do this I have to first disable bluetooth on the F8, go into finder and create the folder, then start bluetooth again to reconnect the iPad. A lot of button presses which could be fixed by allowing the option to create folders on the App. Hopefully we'll see this in an update.

Another bit of feedback is the lack of take reset options. I prefer making user defined scene names, but there is no option to reset the take number after editing the user scene name. Seeing this option in the next firmware (and perhaps also a button shortcut to reset take number?) would be a godsend.

The Control App is certainly lacking but I find it useful for its faders. It really needs to be able to do everything you can do in the unit because having to disconnect to do something in the unit is very bad!

Take reset works great on the unit itself. After changing a scene name and pressing enter the 'reset take' prompt appears. All good! Unfortunately the same doesn't happen using the app.

I used the F8 on a shoot with Boom+4lavs the other day. Didn't use the app but used mix mode on the unit. Worked out ok but it would be better if the trim was controlled by the rotary dial and the fader by the channel knob. Also, it'd be nice if the knob didn't have to meet the old value to start controlling the fade or trim value.

Oh, and of course, check out the thing I'm working on: www.facebook.com/mixercage

Hope you dig it!

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I quite like the mixer cage idea. I've been thinking of similar but a little lighter. My motivation was to make a stable platform that could swing down to allow convenient use of RMs with Front (as opposed to top) displays - in my case g2000s. A bit like a heavier hinged matt box flag that the RMs are attached to. Ideally the thing would attach directly to the mixer / recorder, have a bit of room for a battery and some accessories and would have a light fabric dust / rain cover. 

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7 hours ago, bralleput said:

Daniel, sorry but I don't 'get' the 'cage'...What is wrong with the (many) bags that are around?

 

Ever since Bash first posted (the thread below)        ( ... As well as any of Jeff W's builds!) -

I've always wanted to play with the "80/20" concepts of super-small-size, super-simple, rack-builds -

a la:

Again ... Albeit, obviously ... On a way-smaller, simpler, scale.

As Daniel has now done.  (Please note: I'm already aware, that -  Daniel's may not be actual '80/20'- AFAIK.)

Nice job, Daniel.

( As Crew C. has stated, before: "Viva La Difference!" )

 

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8 hours ago, bralleput said:

Daniel, sorry but I don't 'get' the 'cage'...What is wrong with the (many) bags that are around?

Hey, I think K-TEK and ORCA have made incredible bags in the last couple years. The Petrol and Porta-Brace offerings that were the only ones available before that are terrible in comparison (except that extremely simple Porta-Brace sleeve bag. That thing was cool!).

But I've had my own ideas in mind for some years and since about March of last year I decided to design it right and try to make it work. Here's the description I've been using on why I wanted to go this direction:

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Regarding my suggestion of a DC-DC converter I've just come across this from Mr Wexler in another thread [I can't work out how to quote directly from another thread using this forum software, but it's this one.

http://jwsoundgroup.net/index.php?/topic/12538-simon-b-and-stuarts-new-minirackcart-build/&page=2

Whilst I have heard no noise from my setup, Jeff obviously has a world more experience than me in these matters, and I thought it useful to add to this thread.

Quote

 

On 20 July 2012 at 11:20 PM, Jeff Wexler said:

Mechanically and aesthetically your power distribution is beautiful! Power regulation is important, I agree, but use of a DC to DC converter for your main power distribution could cause problems of its own. Most of the devices we use have their own power supplies internally, often with DC to DC converters, and each of these devices interact with each other (and now will interact with your "master power" regulator). This interaction frequently causes noise for audio components. I understand your concern for over-voltage and such but there are other ways of addressing this. What I have done (and your probably already know this) is to use a very high quality low-noise regulated DC power supply (connected to mains) that floats across the LiFe battery. This supplies a constant regulated 13.8 volts dc to the gear. So, when connected to mains, the gear never sees more than 13.8 vdc (and each piece of equipment is good with that) and when on battery alone the gear will see only less, not more, than the 13.8 vdc. This has worked very well for me for the last 15 years or more.

 

 

 

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On 1/29/2016 at 11:00 PM, TJD said:

Have any F8 users had much luck with using the Control App? I attempted to use it on a shoot last week but gave up very quickly. Seems like a really good idea, but in a real world situation I wasn't able to do enough with it. It doesn't have the option to create new folders, for example. To do this I have to first disable bluetooth on the F8, go into finder and create the folder, then start bluetooth again to reconnect the iPad. A lot of button presses which could be fixed by allowing the option to create folders on the App. Hopefully we'll see this in an update.

Another bit of feedback is the lack of take reset options. I prefer making user defined scene names, but there is no option to reset the take number after editing the user scene name. Seeing this option in the next firmware (and perhaps also a button shortcut to reset take number?) would be a godsend.

Although the F8 App is lacking some controls, I have found that by creating ten folders (01, 02, etc.) at the beginning of my day, I can just change the name of the folder, via the app, as the day progresses. I am currently using the F8 as a backup to my SD633, but have found the app to be very helpful when recording in remote situations using a Sanken CUB01 boundary microphone. On several documentary shoots, there have been instances when I have set up the F8 near a meeting scenario (thanks to a short Sanken cord) and can make my adjustments without disturbing the scene. Obviously, this is the case on a shoot with a small footprint, but in general, it has been pretty handy.

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I've just bought two cards included in the list of recommended cards on the Zoom website (kingston SD4/32GB).

Running the "quick" card test in my recorder the result was positive but running the "full" test the result was negative.

Has anyone else experienced the same problem with the same or another recommended card?

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 24 June 2015 at 0:51 AM, The Immoral Mr Teas said:

It's a little upsetting that the TRS deals only with line in and the XLR with mic in. Despite the obvious impedances quoted it might be workable to switch off phantom and use an XLR as line in ... 

This looks like an amazing little machine and by all accounts sounds very good too. The issue of no mixing interface to me seems null - it is a recorder, not a mixer. In fact it seems like a great bonus feature that you have iOS Bluetooth mixing capabilities, something that other more pricey recorders such as the 744T don't have. Also the digital limiters and HPF don't worry me much as I would be putting a mixer such as my 552 in front of it which deals with any front end filtering and input limiting. 

My one concern is what The Immoral Mr Teas mentioned above, that the line input are only on the TRS input. If outputting from my 552 direct outs to the F8 inputs at line level (as I would to a 744T for example) I certainly would prefer to be able to plug into the XLRs. This would almost be a deal breaker for me. 

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