Camera Return: Snake vs. Separate Cable

[WJJZ1069]

Quick question here because of some advice I overheard.

 

I do a lot of 1 and 2 Camera interviews for broadcast, and normally I use a 10 pin snake connection to a 664. I listen to return coming back through the snake, but a much more experienced sound man suggested I start listening to return through a separate 3.5mm extension cable going directly to the camera. His reasoning was that the mixer could have setting where the return isn't true.

 

Does anyone else do this? Anything to add to the reasoning or is it overkill?

[RJBerto]

I don't know about the 664 specifically, but most mixers I've had experience with, the 10 pin, or however many pin, connector will inject the signal into the return signal path... same as a direct connection to the return in jack. The manual may contain this info, or a quick call to sound devices to confirm.

 

 

[soundpod]

If you set up the mixer correctly, I don't understand his reasoning. Headphone amps on cameras generally sound terrible. So I usually listen straight off the mixer with occasional checks to the return, easy to switch if it's through the snake, not easy if it is on its own cable from the camera.

[Nate C]

I do exactly the same as Soundpod mentioned above. Put the tails on the camera and it is only one cable to quickly teether  or un-teether as need arises. Sometimes convenience is more important then the quality of sound monitored from the camera.

 

[engaudio]

 

His reasoning was that the mixer could have setting where the return isn't true.

 

Huh? I don't get it, as long as you set your levels correctly it's "true".

How would an dedicated return h/phone cable be any different ?

 

 

 

[Pat Slater]

If in doubt disconnect the snake while monitoring return.

[chrismedr]

How would an dedicated return h/phone cable be any different ?

you won't get those awful distortions of your mixers headphone amps  ; )

 

[ninjafreddan]

I do a lot of 1 and 2 Camera interviews for broadcast, and normally I use a 10 pin snake connection to a 664. I listen to return coming back through the snake, but a much more experienced sound man suggested I start listening to return through a separate 3.5mm extension cable going directly to the camera. His reasoning was that the mixer could have setting where the return isn't true.

 

Does anyone else do this? Anything to add to the reasoning or is it overkill?

I'd say it's overkill and unnecessary. It's not like you're listening to the headphone or camera outputs for the sake of fidelity. Your mixer will always sound better. You're listening through the camera to control that the levels aren't breaking up and that cables aren't crackling. In a run and gun situation, you're also controlling that the camera man hasn't set the input levels to AUTO or adjusted the levels manually, while shooting some stock footage while you and the rest of the team were having lunch.

Now I'm using a wireless camera link 99% or the time - what a relief(!!!) - but when I was still on a coiled cable and the audio was only recorded in the camera, I listened to the camera return 99.5% of the time - even when it had quite a bit of latency - because it was my responsibility to capture the sound. I've had crackling cables, levels that got messed with etc - and always been able to remedy the problems within a minute just because I was listening to the camera return all the time.

When available, always use the 5-pin output from the camera because it generally sounds better.

I have a custom made coiled snake cable with a tail that easily can be unlocked with one hand - costed me about $500 back in the days but it was worth it. You have to make it as comfortable as possible when working with EFP.

 

Cheers

Fred

 

[WJJZ1069]

Thanks everyone, this is good to get advice of many different people. It does confirm some of the thoughts I had.

And also thank you, Ninjafreddan. I'll look at the 5 pin return. I'm always having to listen to the F800 return with its noisy amps.

[ninjafreddan]

And also thank you, Ninjafreddan. I'll look at the 5 pin return. I'm always having to listen to the F800 return with its noisy amps.

Yeah, the 5-pin most likely sounds better with less noise and distortion. Let me know how it sounds, okay.

I haven't worked with the F800 but it looks like a really nice broadcast camera.

Off topic. Depending on the quality and length of your snake cable, you might wanna try sending four audio channels via AES/EBU from the SD664. It's not kosher, but it works for me. I've done it with my SD664 and a SD552. Don't try it with a SD788 because any digital cable connected to a 788 turns into a broadband antenna raising the radio noise floor about 10dB or more - interfering with wireless receivers in close proximity.

 

Cheers

Fred