RPSharman

G3 system as "Comtek" IEM

52 posts in this topic

You've got to use them at low squelch. It's not diversity so on high squelch the RF will be very ropey. Also I recommend using a dipole antenna with the G3 Tx. Lo squelch will help if set on receivers.


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You are correct Constantin.
Pilot tone is actually set to inactive on the IEM just like my brain was set to inactive when I typed my earlier response. I shouldn't respond until I've had my morning coffee intake.
Cheers Nate. 

That's a shame, I had hoped you found something there. I frequently move from cart (half-rack unit with pilot) to bag (pocket tx without pilot) and would have to switch off pilot on all receivers. So instead I leave pilot off all the time. Would've been nice to have a solution here

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RP, In the beginning of this, you indicated that you tried different receivers and that many other people, including scripty, haven't complained. You could just do what I do, have the scripty and director swap. And if the scripty doesn't have a problem, then either the scripty is deaf, the problem is with the human, or the scripty wants the director shipped off to the loony bin. 

I have had someone tell me their ERX sounded odd, or whatever, and I have handed them my Nomad headpones, and they still heard the noise. We then started handing my Nomad HP to different people and not one other person could hear a problem. We had some laughs over that. But it was the end of "I hear a noise in my ERX".

Sincerely, Martin 

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18 hours ago, Nate C said:

You are correct Constantin.

Pilot tone is actually set to inactive on the IEM just like my brain was set to inactive when I typed my earlier response. I shouldn't respond until I've had my morning coffee intake.

Cheers Nate. 

 

19 hours ago, Constantin said:


Interesting. Technically, this shouldn't be possible, so I'm curious how you did it. The receiver needs a stereo pilot which obviously the sk300 can't provide... So how did you do that? I'd much prefer to have pilot always onof possible

Page 24 of my SK100 manual reads that pilot tone exists on the Tx body pack.

It should be able to be on, correct? I know older body packs did not have that function, but mine seems to. I think the EK300 receiver has it too.

The manual reads that pilot tone on the receiver should be inactive in mono mode. I suppose the EK100 transmitter has pilot tone for use when being used for a wireless mic, but not functional for IEM as it's not Stereo?

I'll try it off tomorrow, with low squelch (5), and see how it sounds.

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The pilot tones between the SK100 and the EK300 are not compatible, therefore you must turn off the pilot tone on the EK300 in order for it to receive the signal from the SK100.

Tom

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1 minute ago, TomBoisseau said:

The pilot tones between the SK100 and the EK300 are not compatible, therefore you must turn off the pilot tone on the EK300 in order for it to receive the signal from the SK100.

Tom

I just whipped the g3 system out in a hurry to see if I could make it work. I definitely had a signal. It just wasn't very desirable. Perhaps pilot tone was off already. The system was bought used from someone who had used it as a hop, so I expect it had been set up correctly.

Anyway, I'm going to start from scratch tomorrow and see what develops.

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Are you using the 100 series SK transmitter? The G3's line level plug wiring config is a little different from the G2 as well. As Constantin stated, mismatched  Tx> Rx companders (or lack there of) can sound pretty awful, for instance using ListenTech receivers with a Comtek Tx.

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Besides all the settings and pilot tones, the things might as well be broken. It does happen

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When I'm back in the UK I'll check side by side the sma modified transmitter and the stock one. 

I'm confident nothing is "broken" as they came from a working environment, but you never know. I am assuming user error, as I've never really worked with G3s. 

12 minutes ago, Constantin said:

Besides all the settings and pilot tones, the things might as well be broken. It does happen

Hope to see you in Cologne soon!

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Ok. Turned off pilot tones. Found clean channel. Set sensitivity to -9 (788T tone output at -4 so the AF peak just came on). It produced a good listening level at '3' on the receiver. Squelch at 5  

Sounds better than 216, but not by much. There's still a fair amount of hiss that comes along with the program audio.

I feel like it's set up correctly. 

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Robert,

I use pretty much the same settings you are. I think Rick maybe correct in that the "TX hop cable" for the G3 is wired differently. Line level signals connect to the ring on the 3.5 TRS, no connection to the tip.

Mark

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17 minutes ago, mark kirchner said:

Robert,

I use pretty much the same settings you are. I think Rick maybe correct in that the "TX hop cable" for the G3 is wired differently. Line level signals connect to the ring on the 3.5 TRS, no connection to the tip.

Mark

I'll check wiring diagram, but I think if I were going mic in from a solid line out, I'd be overloading. 

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I have made quite a few G3 SK100 input cables.  It may sound crazy, but they should be wired like this:

G3 TRANSMITTER
Signal "+" to RING (yes, Ring!) of TRS Mini to G3 Transmitter
Signal ground to Both TIP and SLEEVE of TRS Mini to G3 transmitter

Tom

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Hope to see you in Cologne soon!

Really? That'd be awesome!

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28 minutes ago, Constantin said:


Really? That'd be awesome!

I ought to know tomorrow if I'm still going to Berlin on this show. I wasn't, then I was, and now I'm not sure. If I go, I'll probably overnight in Cologne, heading in or heading out, or both. 

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9 hours ago, TomBoisseau said:

I have made quite a few G3 SK100 input cables.  It may sound crazy, but they should be wired like this:

G3 TRANSMITTER
Signal "+" to RING (yes, Ring!) of TRS Mini to G3 Transmitter
Signal ground to Both TIP and SLEEVE of TRS Mini to G3 transmitter

Tom

I think Tom's wiring is correct. My unbalanced hop cable was made by Eric Toline with no connection to the tip on the TX 3.5mm TRS. Works perfectly. I have had 3.5mm locking connectors that "look perfect" that sounded poorly.

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Yes, the tip must be grounded (to the shield) on the G3 for line level. (the ring terminal being hot). On the G2 100 series body pack Tx, it was not necessary to ground the tip terminal. The Listentech LT-700 series bodypack transmitters use the same config for line level as the G2. Both the Sennheiser and ListenTech are nominal -10dB line (or there abouts).

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-9 on the transmitter sensitivity seems very high for a line level connection. Mine is usually around -45 with a line level cable. 

 

The meter is deceptive. -20 tone barely registers at about 1/5 of the meter. But normal dialog seems to fully modulate the transmitter. 

 

 

 

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So...

Ring goes to pin 2. Tip and sleeve go to 1, 3, and ground. 

I set tone out of 788T to -4 as a "highest point" reference. Set the transmitter sensitivity to the highest value before the clipping light illuminated (-9). So that way my highest program audio would not clip the transmitter. 

This results in comfortable listening to program level audio at the receiver end with volume dial at numerical value of 3. 

No pilot tone. Receiver on focus.

What's left? It's still hissy. Not "tape hiss" as if gain structure is wrong. RF-type AM radio hiss. Hiss pumps with program audio too, which is weird. The program audio itself is nice, if the hiss could be ignored.

The next thing is to visit someone with the same setup. Perhaps it's just how they sound, or this Tx or Rx really is broken.   

I did tell director, "I've switched you to the same receiver you had on your other show. Is this better?" - He listened and said it was "fantastic". So there you go :-(

 

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If anyone is looking at picking up a sennheiser ew300 IEM System before may 1 sennheiser is running a promo on the 2 systems they offer. One with the single receiver and one with 2 receivers. I believe pricing is $799 and $999. 

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if all this doesn't work out this is what i would do: tell them that having a 'director quality hop' is going to require a slight bit of bulk. then maybe tell them the rental price and or use a spare transmitter/receiver combo in your kit. two ideas come to mind: 1) from my kit, send him a feed from a cameralink (stereo broadcast quality hop) and put an rx200 receiver into my SD mixpre, or some other 'mixpre' box with a nice headphone amp and a stereo input. power all that stuff with a half size inspired energy or full size IE battery, pouch it and hand it over. i've noticed that some of those headphones require a really nice headphone amp to get them going. 

the other option, which i just learned about (late bloomer), is number 2: rent or buy a 2040 audio ltd. rx/tx kit. feed the mono mix there and hand over the receiver with a lemo plug connecting to headphones. the system sounds fantastic. expensive to buy but easy to rent....

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Robert, after many years of using G3 systems for foldback, i switched to Wisycom IEM. I have the dual 250mW Tx and 4 x Wisycom bodypacks which are diversity receivers which are for my boom ops and utility most of the time.

I also have a number of G3 Rx for the rest of the crowd. 

This system works perfectly. Range is incredible even at 100 mW. For antennas I use the Wisycom ground planes... 

For portable, I use a G3 Tx. 

Wisycom Rx are definitely much better sounding than anything else, even when driven by a G3 Tx. The range is incredible even with the G3 Tx. 

If you really want a high quality Rx reception, this is the way to go. 

my 2 cents... :)

-vin

 

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On one of my first ever projects I used a wired link from my cart to the monitor where there was a headphone amp with 4 or 5 outs. Took a bit of getting used to on the part of the director and scripty, and it isn't for everyone, like those directors who like to be on set, but the sound quality of this simple setup is better than any wireless system.

 

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I think the majority of UK mixers use Sennheiser evolution for comms. 

I go out of 788t at -4 into a SK500 G2 TX with sensitivity set at -20, best sounding IEM system i've heard with zero hiss.

Use a line level cable:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sennheiser-Line-Input-CL2-XLR-Replacement-Cable-Transmitter-SK-100-300-50-/151210700656?var=&hash=item2334dc2f70:m:m5X8fFDgo8tbHpG6lWP--xw

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9 hours ago, soundtrane said:

Robert, after many years of using G3 systems for foldback, i switched to Wisycom IEM. I have the dual 250mW Tx and 4 x Wisycom bodypacks which are diversity receivers which are for my boom ops and utility most of the time.

I also have a number of G3 Rx for the rest of the crowd. 

This system works perfectly. Range is incredible even at 100 mW. For antennas I use the Wisycom ground planes... 

For portable, I use a G3 Tx. 

Wisycom Rx are definitely much better sounding than anything else, even when driven by a G3 Tx. The range is incredible even with the G3 Tx. 

If you really want a high quality Rx reception, this is the way to go. 

my 2 cents... :)

-vin

 

Didn't even notice they existed ! Thanks for pointing out :) (MPR30-IFB)  http://www.wisycom.com/www3/storage/downloads/Products/MPR30_IFB-en-b01.pdf

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