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Sound Devices Mix Pre-3 and Mix Pre-6

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16 hours ago, soundmanjohn said:

Waiting to hear from Ambient in Germany when they have mine in stock. Great company, easy to deal with and a couple of hundred bucks cheaper than buying in the UK.

WIll report in as soon as it gets here.

John

Thanks John, just check around the prices in the uk, so much more expansive! Wonder why?! It's probab the Brexshit, but that's for another topic....:)

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On 5/1/2017 at 2:24 PM, Matthew Manville said:

 But also by going with the Zoom,  you lose the trust of the Sound Devices name, which can go a long way with producers. 

maybe the right way to phrase it is: real producers.

honestly i thinks the mix pres will eventually outsell the zoom f series because people in the zoom market will not invest in enough really good wireless and mics to plug into it.

they want cheaper but find it hard to balance or quantify/qualify cheap vs adequate vs sub par vs decent vs great. quite often they are the people who buy twice/cry twice, several times with different items!! lol.

at least with the mixpre 3 they would, with a little research and due diligence in regard to making smart purchases, understand what a 'great basic kit' really is for their intended purposes.

if they don't they keep buying and crying and ultimately get nauseous when they finally succumb to having to hire a sound guy or girl who wants nothing to do with operating the equipment they have already purchased in error.

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@soundmanjohn Cheers! very informative. I have to order mine soon I guess. I am wondering if it worth waiting to hear any sound samples first. I am avoiding being an early adaptor in general, but it seems I am in the waiting for a lot of equipment this last year!

Thank you again.

@Gerard-NYNY from time to time I have to work for "producers" that have their own equipment and they only pay you for your presence. Most of the times you are in trouble because their equipment is of very bad quality and they do not understand their responsibilities (or they do not care), that is why I am so excited about this MixPre, I can have a full set of lower - end equipment for jobs like these, and I don't have to worry for other people's mistakes. I will pay for extra equipment, but I will have peace of mind!

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1 hour ago, Kisaha said:

@soundmanjohn Cheers! very informative. I have to order mine soon I guess. I am wondering if it worth waiting to hear any sound samples first. I am avoiding being an early adaptor in general, but it seems I am in the waiting for a lot of equipment this last year!

Thank you again.

@Gerard-NYNY from time to time I have to work for "producers" that have their own equipment and they only pay you for your presence. Most of the times you are in trouble because their equipment is of very bad quality and they do not understand their responsibilities (or they do not care), that is why I am so excited about this MixPre, I can have a full set of lower - end equipment for jobs like these, and I don't have to worry for other people's mistakes. I will pay for extra equipment, but I will have peace of mind!

from the get go, if i receive a call like that my standard rehearsed ad lib is: are you sure you want me to work with that crap?...

you have everything to gain by introducing that into the discussion. you and i are prepared to elaborate on the subject. the producer side, usually not prepared. on the other hand, losing a potential headache is not a bad thing at all.

if you care more about the end result/quality of sound and supplying a hassle and crisis free shoot than the producers do it's not a good match.

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I just expressed a reality in the market I am in. If you are not from the G8 -and a few more countries, then you are trying to build from a not so ideal situation, and you go from there. The world is a relatively big place and dominant of not ideal situations, I wouldn't be surprised that someone has to work for not an ideal employer. Well, we have a lot here!

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2nd field recording sounds nice (Front Porch Birds) low hiss/noise, but they could put the microphones near the birds, on a windless day (?). Still it's a bit harsh with unpleasant highs in my opinion (2-4 sec) but it's more about the mic I think or the bird :P

It would be great to have it tested on ambient side by side with other recorders like zoom h5, f4 and 633 :D. 

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On 5/19/2017 at 6:45 PM, Kisaha said:

I just expressed a reality in the market I am in.

I think the reality of the market you are in is a worldwide phenomena and G8 countries are just as full of foolish cheapskates as the rest.

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Even with  the other recorders included, I would be willing to bet that with properly recorded tracks, using the exact same mics in the exact same position, none of you could tell the difference in which recorder recorded what. This recorder will sound just fine... 

  Any differences or perceived problems with the recordings are more a product of mics, placement, playback equipment, headsets, or the speakers your listening through. In real world use, once through post, there is no problem whatsoever with this machine.

 

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7 hours ago, Gerard-NYNY said:

I think the reality of the market you are in is a worldwide phenomena and G8 countries are just as full of foolish cheapskates as the rest.

It is human nature. Some people are plain cheap!

There are differences though, the peak of the industry (quality), its bulk (quantity), and the socio-political structure of societies (working laws and benefits). Humans are basically the same of course, but working conditions are much different in Western countries than the rest of the world. I have lived 6 years on a couple of them (G8) and I know! Anyways, we all took our decisions long time ago, I guess, and job opportunities are not the only think matters on this planet, at least not for me. 

Mixpre6/3 is bridging the gap, it is the most professional of the amateur ones, and the most amateurish of the professional ones!

Thank you @Robert0 for finding out the first samples. I liked what I heard, these are not microphones I will be using, even though I have access of the Rode, but I guess when the first bunch will be delivered (and it will be soon) there are going to be hundreds of samples everywhere on the internet!

The other thing is the touch screen, I would worry about something like that on a pro machine, but we will find out soon.

Another reason for its popularity it is the somehow limited new releases of NAB2017, so all the popular v-logs and youtube channels had extensive coverage of the new MixPres, so everybody knows!

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Not having the MixPre-6 in my own hands I thought it would be interesting to visualize which bag might be a good fit for it since there aren´t any recommendations out there yet. So I roughly modeled them in 3D using the correct proportions. Here are the results - it´s a pretty small device!

mixpre-6_stingray_dr70d.jpg

mixpre-6_stingray_jr.jpg

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@Janik Hampe I was considering something like this http://www.orcabags.com/product/or-27-small-sound-bag-for/  215*130*90

or the slightly larger http://www.orcabags.com/product/or-28-mini-sound-bag-for/, I have no 3D models though, just a plain sweet girl on their website!

Their Harness would be nice with those smaller bags too. Featherweight in total.

 

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Here is a comparison with the Zoom F8, in my opinion the difference is huge! :) (By huge I mean easily noticeable :D)

 

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I contacted Sound Devices and asked for the allowed voltage range when using the battery sleds. The answer was:

Quote

 

Batteries:

If they have a nominal voltage of 1.5-1.8V.

 
L-Mounts:
If they have a nominal voltage of 7.2 - 8v.

 

Since the AA-sleds do have the batteries wired in series, we get 6 - 7,2 volts in total. And the L-Mount batteries beeing hot swappable indicates that the two slots are wired in parallel. To sum it up, the unit takes 6 - 8 volts.

I´m thinking on soldering a hirose jack to the 4AA battery sled and using Sony L-Mount batterys to remotely power the unit.

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So if I understand this correctly, the difference between the two models when running MP-3 and MP-6 with LTC through the aux input comes down to one iso. Is that correct? With the MP-6, you are forfeiting inputs for tracks 5-6, whereas with the MP-3 you still have available the 3rd xlr connector. So it's 4 iso vs 3 in this case.

Just for some mental gymnastics, this mic-aux is stereo in both models. You have the option to send LTC to either side. Therefore, with a y-cable wouldn't it be possible to salvage track 5 on the MP-6?

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I'm also very intersted in this what James is talking about.
Maybe is to much to ask for 5th iso track but it would be nice to know that this ability exist.
I must say that i cant figure it out is it possible (if its possible at all) to convert Lectro signal into this aux-mic input so that one more wireless can be used

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk

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On 5/24/2017 at 3:13 PM, Janik Hampe said:

Since the AA-sleds do have the batteries wired in series, we get 6 - 7,2 volts in total. And the L-Mount batteries beeing hot swappable indicates that the two slots are wired in parallel. To sum it up, the unit takes 6 - 8 volts.

well, since AA run down to about 1V when discharged, I'd say it probably takes at least 4-8V

1 hour ago, James Louis said:

So if I understand this correctly, the difference between the two models when running MP-3 and MP-6 with LTC through the aux input comes down to one iso. Is that correct?

no, as mentioned earlier there are a few more differences, most notably 192Khz vs 96Khz and Input delays/polarity - see this page:
https://www.sounddevices.com/products/recorders/mixpre-3/feature-comparison

as for splitting input 5/6 in timecode mode, probably best to write SD directly for that. let us know what they say.

chris

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I've been reading posts on this forum for quite some time and have made some very informed (I feel) purchases based on what I've read here (i.e. MKH-50).  I've always enjoyed the varying opinions that are accompanied by the reasons and experience of the poster, not just some ignorant statements that are also prone to this forum.  And unlike most neophyte posters to this forum, I also realize that many of the questions asked here are subjective and do not have a definitive answer.

 
So, after the lead in.  Why is it that, dare I say many, of the posters to this thread have expressed interest in, if not claiming to be buying a MixPre when it ships, yet I've seen several of the usual suspects (a phrase popular on this forum) totally disparaging the Zoom Products; F4 and F8 respectively?  I believe the terms "cheap Chinese garbage", "toys", "not serious gear", etc have been bandied about.  However, the moment SD announces a similar product, the fawning begins.  Now, to be fair, I've already preordered mine, and I have my reasons.  One being I don't own a 633.
 
However, is this just fanboy hype, or is there reason to think lesser of the Zoom products?  Odd that SD listed dbV instead of dbu, which if my calculations are correct, puts it at the same input noise level as the Zooms.
 
And don't get me wrong, I know SD is industry standard.  I'd just like to know for myself and others why a feature rich product like the Zoom F4 (which includes TC, two sd cards, more inputs, XLR outs, etc) is disparaged, while the SD at same price point is lauded?
 
p.s.  Knowing some of the personalities here, I'm already prepared for the snarky comments that will ensue.  And just to cover one more area: "it depends".  Now that we have that covered, any serious response would be appreciated.

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20 hours ago, chrismedr said:

no, as mentioned earlier there are a few more differences

Thanks Chris. Well sure, I was setting aside the other bullet points, but that does confirm my conclusions. The *-button on the MP-6, just for example, might have been a necessary design addition in order to access tracks 5-6, but I could see how this could be an additional selling point. Does anyone know the list of things it can be assigned to? And do you have the option to use it to step through a number of views? Particularly if it could be used to toggle mix levels and input gain with the encoders, that's been raised a number of times on this thread as well.

And in a separate comparison, the bus powering through a cell phone charger is not an option for the zoom F4.

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Hi Coolwing, 

I think in part you are priming yourself and the responses to be a bit defensive with that lead in. Don't listen to all the swag, pedantic answers, and hazing folks throw about here. You can almost always hone in on folks who just want to address your question.

Historically, I think zoom got the most heat with their initial field recorders when their input gain representation had no meaning in reference to line level, but more resembled a mic gain on a commercial camera. Forget how they sounded for a second. You and I can get over that so long as they've since course corrected. That said, here are the trade-offs with the F4 that I've gathered:

Pros: I'll only present the ones that aren't staring us in the face. There are MANY pros. For example, more output, routing, and monitoring options, right?

1) Solid and steady timecode crystal, even in a wide range of barometric, temperature, and humid conditions

2) Timecode in and out

Cons:

1) digital input limiters

2) USB for interfacing only, and if I see it correctly it's a mini (which is already being phased out), not micro connector?

3) remote app and bluetooth capacity not an option on the F4

4) perhaps the comparative weight after adding batteries

We'd have to put it to the test to see if the noise floor on both devices even came into play when presented with the dynamic range of 32-bit internal busing on the SD devices. But potentially ergonomics might be a consideration on the F4: not only the feeling and space for the encoders and the screen, but the placement for input connectors if you front end this with another preamp. 

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5 hours ago, James Louis said:

The *-button on the MP-6, just for example, might have been a necessary design addition in order to access tracks 5-6, but I could see how this could be an additional selling point. Does anyone know the list of things it can be assigned to? And do you have the option to use it to step through a number of views?

well, it's odd that the manual is still incomplete, but their quick start guide says:

 

10. The Star Button

The MixPre-6 has a user-programmable button, called the Star (*) button, for exible customization. You may con gure it to gain quick-access to certain menus or features.

To set the Star button functionality:

  1. Tap

  2. Tap * Button

  3. Choose a function from the available options, which include quick access to the following: toggling between Channel 5 & 6 screens, the Project sub-menu, the Solo/Mute screen, the SD Card screen, or the Undo function. 

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Hi James Louis, the * button on the MixPre-6 can be set to initiate the following:

1) (default) Ch 5/6 Screen Toggle

2) Solo/Mute Screen - a nice simple interface for solo-ing or muting any of the 6 inputs

3) Project menu

4) SD Card menu - for "emptying the trash" or formatting the card or viewing its name, size, and free space/time remaining at the current bit-depth/sample rate.

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