minister

On 4/19/2018 at 5:04 PM, JonG said:

What are some of your favorite plugins for post production, and are any free? I’m getting back into post but since my absence a lot has changed. 

 If free is a criteria, then (re)learn to use stock plugins.  I could get by with Avid (or any DAW's) stock plugins. It's all about the technique and using your ears to hear where it should go then getting it there (in the time they paid for).

Not Free:

Avid Pro is god, but not free - subscription.

DMG:

Equilibrium

Compassion

FabFilter:

DS

Limiter L2

Cedar DNS ONE (distinctly NOT free, but you ASKED for favorites......)

Exponential Reverbs

Acon Digital De-reverberator

RX6 ADV -- using round-trip with the application

I found Acon to be a better deverberator. RX's is awful.

I have found several uses for Unchirp and Unfilter in really bad sounding things. Or, interviews that were conducted over Skype or some dumb thing. And once, on the deck of a freighter out on the ocean. After dealing with the wind, I need a little something to get the voice to cut. I am glad to have them, but I don't use them that often. I find that I turn a dial slowly and it starts to sound better ... better... then BAM! super ringy and over processed.

On 3/19/2018 at 1:00 PM, Joe Riggs said:

Hello,

 

I was wondering if any post audio pros could answer this.

 

We re-edited a finished film from years back. For the re-edit we used the 5.1 stems:

 

The 5.1 dialogue tracks
The 5.1 background tracks
The 5.1 FX tracks
The 5.1 Music tracks

 

So all 24 tracks were carried throughout the edit. Now my question is
what is the procedure to create new master Stereo and 5.1 files?

 

For the Stereo file is it as simple as
Pan all L and Ls channels to the left
Pan all R and Rs channels to the right
Leave C channels as is and discard LFE
then export?

For 5.1 would you just mute all tracks except the Center channel for each stem,
and export, then repeat that for L,R,Ls,Rs, LFE? 

On 3/20/2018 at 9:37 PM, Jay Rose said:

Your plan makes sense, except I wouldn't totally throw out LFE on the stereo mix... there might be something important there. 

 

And there might be some level trimming necessary if the scene-to-scene flow has changed. 

 

The unanswered question, of course, is will the new edit disrupt any of those stems? I don't know what cutting they did, but music frequently gets mangled both inside and across scenes, and bgs can have abrupt shifts if there are edits within a scene. That might take some bandaids -- or at least, offsetting the edits -- before you mix.

I realize this is an ancient post, but I wanted to correct this for any future viewers of this.
Do not simply pan and not adjust channels to Downmix to Stereo!

This simple formula is:
L pan Left, leave at unity

R pan Right, leave at unity

Center leave Center but drop 3dB

Ls pan Left, drop 6dB

Rs pan Right, drop 6dB

LFE -- I never understood why people drop this especially if you properly use it as an EFFECT! Though, I know that the Dolby Stereo (LtRt) auto downmix does drop it. Why not mix it in? but drop it 6 or 9 12dB. To taste! if is only info below 120 for boom and rumble, why not have it in stereo?

"For 5.1 would you just mute all tracks except the Center channel for each stem,
and export, then repeat that for L,R,Ls,Rs, LFE?"

I don't understand this question. After you print the mix, or consolidate stems then export clips as whole files. No export. No need to mute and do 1 at a time.

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Jim, I've read the DCI spec docs before.  I know what Forensic Marking is. Which is, yes, a process added to each DCP.  But, Audio Forensic Marking is inaudible. (look at page 120 in your document) That's different than what he says here about using a pattern of taxi horns.

On 5/18/2016 at 10:19 AM, cmgoodin said:

I wouldn't necessarily give the credit to a meticulous sound design team.    In most high dollar popular Films they use Car Horns,  Dog barks and other short BG SFX to code the "print" (DCI Distro)  with a unique ID that can be tracked for Anti Piracy enforcement.   The position of the Car Horn or the number of Honks can serve to indicate which theater was showing the film when somebody used a Camcorder to make a pirate copy.  It is a version of Watermarking that can survive bad camcorder copies and other attempts to conceal the source.  That Taxi Horn may appear in different positions or with a different Honk pattern in each location it is shown.

 

Mule muffins!

I have never heard of such a thing.  My friends who work on big dollah films have all told me tales of overly meticulous sound supers spotting all kinds of things in addition to the editors themselves and the Director. The audio post sound budgets for these things are north of 400K!

Creating different position and honk patterns for a MAJOR release would require an unwieldy amount of copies!  Think of the spreadsheet and the amount of time to PRINT each mix.  Batman V Superman was released in 4242 Theaters.  Presumably there will be more.  You mean to tell us, there will 6,000 (or more) DIFFERENT copies of the soundtrack?

I find this all quite hard to believe.

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Just saw this post and my first thought was the above are your biggest concerns.  FX recording often requires good dynamics for just these reasons.  I would look at some Senn 441 or 421's or SM57's or Heil Mics ... something like those (whatever you have) and bring lots of foam and tape and zip-ties.... and find places inside and outside the car.  And a couple sets of ORTF stereo (since this won't be surround) in key pass by spots.

Dolby Digital really refers to the process of getting the Mix to a 35MM print, which requires an approved room and  Dolby Engineer, a Dolby Meter Bridge, a Dolby DMU that creates the MO disk (with a form of AC3) which then goes to the Lab where they marry the picture and MO disk.  The Dolby Digital is then put in packets between the sprocket holes.  It being an AC3 for DVD's came much later.  To make an AC3 or a TrueHD encode of a mix requires no room approval or Dolby Engineer.

ATMOS comes with requirements similar to the 35MM process but evolved and more involved that that.

You are allowed to use the double-D logo on a DVD or BluRay if you use one of their encoders, you do not need to go through a pay-license process.  You only pay (paid) for the 35MM license and logo use.  ATMOS you also have to pay.  The license for the 35MM included the above process with the engineer and gear.  VERY few 35MM releases anymore, though....

5.1 as wave files are just the surround mix files.  There is no format (ok, well, there really is, but no trademarked format).  You can put those 6 files into a DCP and not have to do anything or pay anyone else.

Part of the confusion comes from Distributors and Exhibitors (especially Festivals) not really understanding what any of this means and giving mis-leading multiple choice questions on the submission forms.  Like, "Format of your Film, check one : Dolby Digital. Stereo".  When you have 6 mono files that make up the 5.1 mix, or an interleaved 5.1, the answer is neither.

This is true.  The idea of using multiple SRC's in a device and letting it "choose" which one is "appropriate" for the signal level based on its calibration is not a new idea - Lavry did this years ago as well as manufacturers of Live Consoles.  The concept is not new or patentable.  But a unique way of doing it might be.  Of course, a lot depends on how much money you have and how good your patent attorneys are.

Putting it into a Production Sound context is a great idea!  I imagine the real trick has been implementation in a device that small with those types of power supplies.

I usually hate Star Wars things, but this made me laugh.  Apologies for the obnoxious music....

Putting more Blunder into the Blunderbuss

This.

It's only $79 and they used the same SRC licensed from iZotope.

PINK noise is measured as -20dBFS RMS.  You are measuring PEAK.  Yes, it is approximately -11 PEAK. But you don't align Sound Pressure Level using PEAK.

Sorry Glen, this is misleading....

Theatrical alignment in US has been, since the 70's: 

Electrical alignment : -20dBFS 1kHz Sine = 1.23vRMS = 0 VU = +4dBU.  

For Room Calibration: -20dBFS RMS PINK = 0VU = 85dBC per Screen Channel in a room having a volume of 10,000 cubic. -82dBC per surround. and +10 IN-BAND for the Subwoofer (measured on an RTA)

Aligning a Music Mastering suite for -12dBFS= 0 VU has ZERO to do with theatrical alignment.  Mix of the final Theatrical product is -20=0VU.

When mixing a film, you calibrate, then MIX BY EAR.  So if it is PAINFULLY LOUD, like a piece of full scale music, then turn it down.  it's simple.  Yes, it's true, you would not play a Full Scale Mastered Music piece at that level, it would be painfully loud.

For smaller rooms, an alignment should be 79dBC or 76dBC for translation to larger rooms (with X-Curve).

Yes, Mattias outlines lower budget stuff as well.  I have done a fair share of low budget TV and corporate pieces .... mostly the Director, or Producer (depending on if it is a commercial project or not) comes in at the end.  or, not at all, and I post a Vimeo link for them to sign-off on. 

It depends.... Is the mixer also an editor?  Was the mixer setup to also be an editor, or was editorial supposed to be done before hand?  How much money does the client have?  How much time is there?

I certainly have changed and added sounds during the mix with the client if they are unhappy.  But on a higher end movie with 2-3 mixers, they usually don't spend time cutting in FX, and editor does it on another rig.  But only lower budget 1-person shows yes.

Why are you asking?  What is your situation? You will get a better answer for your situation if you are more specific.  Because, it depends......................

Is this question for a film?

On a typical film, the very first thing you do is sit down with the Director and the Composer and spot the film.  This takes 6-8 hours, where you talk about major themes, and individual scenes.  This way the music and sound departments are on the same page, and each has a go direction to start in.  

Then we need several weeks to go through the dialogue cutting the boom onto main DX tracks, and the LAV's on support tracks underneath.  Any spots that are rough, we scour the alternate takes to try to save the scene from needing ADR.  Once we believe we have exhausted that possibility, we bring in the Director to go through everything needing ADR.  Once spotted, we schedule ADR.

Meanwhile, foley break-down and shooting go on along with BG & FX cutting. At significant stages along the way we either bring in the Director to go over the editorial, or post clips.

Then, I bring in the Director for mixing after I have had a chance to put it all together, incorporated final music and begun to weave the story.  On a small budget film, this is still a minimum of 3 days with the Director.

I see 442's on Ebay for around $800

For surround?  Bass Managed?  Film work?  They are all a little different, fitting different applications.

If you need Bass Managed, then Blue Sky.

If you don't, I like the Passive SM Pro Controllers.  They make a 5.1.  Not Bass Managed.

For film work, the standard for a long time was the MartinSound MulitiMAX.  I have one of these in my film mix room. Not bass managed.  

For high-end, Cranesong Avocet (Not Bass Managed) or Trinnov (options are there wit these).