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Robert La Rosa

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    Brooklyn, NY
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    Production Sound Mixer in the NYC Area
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    Yes

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  1. Hi Erob! It’s good to meet you and I have a lot to talk about from you last post (Sorry for just seeing this now). You’re based in Virginia? I can tell you right off the bat there are mixers there that for the past few years were quoting prevailing rates and were at the minimum last year doing $750/10 and $450 base package for a boom, mixer, and two lavs. Your prices were quite a ways bit under market but the positive side is you realized that and for 2023 now that the year just started should be starting at $800/10 and $500 base package for non union non commercial work and $975 - $1,000/10 labor for non union commercial work as Banjo, myself, and others here have been doing. You can always negotiate down but never ever negotiate on a 12 hour basis. Always do 10’s and if a production has exhausted all options and say it has to be a 12, make sure you account for time and a half. Don’t agree to a low rate because you have “Nothing else going on,” since racing to the bottom hurts everyone nationwide when a production comes to my neck of the woods or any other states. Negotiating happens often but you start at the prevailing price and within reason keep it close to those numbers or you simply turn it down. I said no way more than I said yes this year but work was very fruitful for me as well. I have comments about the two stories you mentioned: The first one in Delaware is interesting because I actually was reached out to by that very same production company. They were hoping to source me out New York City at the prices you mentioned ($600 flat labor - didn’t say 10 or 12 basis and $200 gear for an unspecified gear package). I talked to them at length and told them that since this was a commercial I would need $975/10 portal to portal and $450 gear (My 2022 prices) for a base sound package along with my mileage, tolls, per diem, hotel, and a travel day there and back for the Maryland date. They told me that they wanted a local but I mentioned no one was outright local to Delaware (Philadelphia is the closest market and even that isn’t necessarily close) and that since they reached out to me and I from the get-go said I wasn’t local, those were my terms. They told me to hold. Truth be told, I had hoped they found a mixer in Philly and one in DC since it was close from what I recall since that would work better for them but they definitely considered hiring me. Now fast forward to this very moment where I learned you ultimately booked it for the terms with no mileage, tolls, portal to portal, hotel, or per diem at a substantially lower gear rental and labor rate. I’m not upset since truth be told, I’m surprised they wanted me on this given my location but the reason I’m mentioning it is because the production took advantage of you and you unintentionally took advantage of other mixers by losing those terms I and others would be quoting. Just keep in mind, they were potentially prepared to pay my quote for this project complete with travel days at my labor rate. The second one on the reality show is another beast. Many reality shows try and get day players for around the prices you mentioned on a 12 hour day often (Usually $500 - $600/12) and then $300 - $400 for a $1,000 - $1,200 gear package. The one you were on, it doesn’t matter if it was an interview day or a day with some scene work, a day is a day and the production flat out took advantage of you and it should have been an easy no. These reality shows hope a sucker says yes when they say “take it or leave it,” and when I was in my first few years, I was that sucker. That said, the majority of mixers around the country on social media at least mention their rates and don’t budge much when they get that “take it or leave it attitude” back. These shows will wait until the 11th hour to find someone to agree but when push comes to shove, they will pay up when desperate. I’ve been on the receiving end of this and others even if there was slight negotiation. The job being close to you is nice and saves you and production on expenses but that’s all it is. Don’t look at it as a bonus from a financial standpoint. Yes its close to you but it still is a day like any other on set. Again, lose the term “half day rate.” It is a farce and does not exist because you can’t book anything else to make up your day. Now for your question, travel days used to be half of one’s day rate, that much is true, but other the last 3 - 4 years, plenty of crew (especially us in sound), are quoting our day rates in full and some even gear for travel days. Personally, I generally don’t get my gear rental on travel days but I have often gotten my full labor. Do I get pushback? Yes. How do I approach it? By then offering my bottom line, which is 50% of my day rate + 50% of my gear rental for this job. So for example, one of them that was $775/10 and $450 base package that I did in Cleveland this year became $612.50 per day rather than just half of my labor rate. I don’t do half my day rate for travel days anymore and have stood firm on this. This is slowly becoming more common with making more on the travel days but its been a slow change for the nation as a whole. I’d love to continue chatting more about this (and the Delaware job specifically) Erob. If you’d be game, shoot me an email at rwlarosa@gmail.com so we can connect and discuss things more! I’d also love to connect you with other mixers in Virginia who I know that are quoting around the prevailing rates so you can further ingratiate with the greater sound community (besides those of us on these boards of course). I apologize if I sound harsh on here, if this was over the phone, my tone would be different but I appreciate your comment and am glad you’re being so forthright with everyone! That is how we grow and raise one another up!
  2. What I implemented this year and has worked multiple times is, I first mention how my normal terms are net 15. Often times they say, “We understand. Our policy though...” so my response is if I say agree to a net 90, my agreed upon day rate gets bumped up. One example in question from this summer was a shoot for a digital video for a major company (non commercial project). My day rate prior to learning the payment terms was $775/10 (plus separate gear rental but that’s irrelevent for here). Once they laid out the net 90 and said they couldn’t change the policy. I said I’d make the net 90 terms work but as concession for me working with their antiquated payment system, they’d have to move my day rate up to $900/10. They agreed. Done that a couple of times this year and either they take the new rate or they find a way to at least get me down to net 30 terms. I recommend trying it next time you’re in that situation!
  3. Here's the info for two of the mixers in Toronto that are roughly charging at the least $750/10 labor and $450 base package for a boom, mixer, and two lavs. You can always mention you got their info from me if you reach out that way it doesn’t seem too out of the blue. TORONTO BASED SOUND MIXERS: Beni Harper B.harper.sound@gmail.com Joey Lavoie Joeylavoie@gmail.com They can likely give you a few more names of people they know and trust that charge prevailing rates. Beni especially has been doing what he can to get the Toronto market up to speed but it doesn’t seem like the non union mixers aren’t as organized as many of us in the US are. There are no doubt a lot of Toronto productions under budgeting but the more people who see what we’ve been trying to do in the US and try to fight for a better way of life, the better it becomes. I would argue that would still be pretty darn bad for that gear package mentioned. I was in NY making the prevailing rates back 3 and a half years ago using my then F8 and G3’s (Which then was roughly around $600 - $625/10 and $350 base gear package for a boom, mixer, and two lavs). The gear mattered little so long as I knew how to use it inside and out and the productions I was working on in the digital, corporate, and high end doc space didn’t care either. I never let the gear brand effect the quote otherwise more people would be undercutting the market and tell new mixers entering that if they plan on taking non narrative or something that isn’t a passion project, they need to ask for the same gear amounts as someone with say a 633 and high end wireless would. I do agree though with your general sentiment; it makes little sense in the grand scheme for those giving away the farm for what the majority of people would charge double. Some people just don’t have guidance but some may also simply not have proper business sense.
  4. Yes, read your contract is definitely one part but I’ve seen too many mixers I’ve met over the years talk in flat numbers as in lumping labor and gear together in negotiations and that only helps the producer. Everyone needs to get in the habit of saying “XXX/Insert hours” not “XXX/Day” because then the producer will decide what that means. A “day” to them might mean 10, 12, 18! Because it isn’t defined, it's important to specify. I’m sorry that happened to you with that one company. They sound like a real “pleasure” to work for but its a shame they took advantage of your time and work. I also for the record want to say that this company does treat me well and they assumed that I would know their policy, but I think it was just a big miscommunication on their part. We met in the middle ultimately so it worked out in the end but moving forward yes, even if in text and email you specify the terms, make sure the deal memo follows suit. You definitely should get out of the habit of “all in” pricing because then the producers expect the next mixer if say they travel to my neck of the woods to do an all in basis and so, on where at least those of us in the US generally start with a base sound package (boom, mixer, two lavs) and then go a la carte per additional gear needed. If a company can’t afford said gear, it gets taken off the list. Makes my day easier! I’ve told other people in person that if everyday moving forward just needed a boom and mixer package, (essentially the smallest package rental you could have, which for me in NY would be $350 a day), I’d be a happy camper. Also, I saw your other comment and you’re in Canada correct? I can’t speak for the whole country but I know a good number of mixers in the Toronto market that push for 10 hour days and generally are working around the prevailing US prices (granted in CAD pricing). Happy to send you some of their info to connect if so but there are lots of Canadian mixers fighting for 10 hour days at the very least! A lot of the younger mixers (and quite frankly crew in generally, I’m seeing it in other departments) are realizing that this had happened and we’re all trying to “regain our time back” so to speak. I’ve been on a number of sets lately where everyone is on a 12 except for me because i was the one person who apparently pushed back whereas others weren’t ready to either negotiate or walk away. You’re totally right though.
  5. A cautinoary tale: Why you should never say $XXX/Day rather than specifying the number of hour terms even in informal text conversations. Company I worked with a number of times this year and is quickly becoming one of my favorite clients hired me for the shoot start of this month. Rate is perfect, job is fine. This has nothing to do with the job itself. Fast forward to billing. In earlier talks, I was booked at $775/10 but long story short, the scope changed and it became a commercial project so my labor was re-negotiated to $975/10. Job is completed. Invoice is submitted. Everything is fine so far. Fast forward a week later - Producer emails me and asks me to change the invoice - Apparently when they shifted my rate, even though I said $975/10 they would respond with “$975/Day.” I thought nothing of it. The deal memo I signed was this term as well. They said that when they list “per day” that means 12 hours as per their company-wide policy (Its a fairly big operation). Because I did not fight to have the invoice say “975/10” on the deal memo, I was roped into their company terms, which were apparently deep into my deal memo contract, which yes is on me but also every other discussion be it email or text I always said /10 so I wouldn’t say I’m at fault either. I wound up on one of the days going into 2 hours and 30 minutes of OT and was asked to remove 2 hours of it based on their policy. Ultimately the producer realized that I was not in the wrong entirely so we met in the middle and I took off 1 hour 30. Moral of the story - When a producer says, "We have $750/Day for you for labor," the word “Day” will be used in their benefit and they’ll likely try to make it out to a 12 if you don’t question it. I’ve seen people put text conversations with producers saying “Lowest I can do this for is $1,000/Day” for example. Get out of the habit of this and specify labor and gear as separate entities. Please don’t quote as “all in prices” even if its as your full day rate and gear rental for say a base package and please please please get out of the habit of saying /Day and instead /8 or /10 even in casual conversation or else you may find yourself in this very one I was in and be out about $200.
  6. No problem! I would say moving forward for the new year, tell them that with cost of living increases coupled with inflation, these will be your new prices. I just did it the other day for a shoot I have at the end of the year. The client asked me to do a 5 hour sit-down interview job and had budgeted my prices with them as of the start of the 2021 ($750/10 and $450 base package plus expenses) and I used that moment to accept that price but at the same time give them a polite heads up that for next year my prices will be $800/10 and $500 base for the same package. They were very agreeable with that and appreciated me following the old price to end out the year. As for the mixers, I’ll send you their emails here since I can’t seem to DM you on this platform. You’re welcome to mention my name if you reach out to them! AUSTIN BASED SOUND MIXERS Matthew Kluchin Mattkfilmsound@gmail.com Siegen Bretzke siegen@bretzke.net DALLAS BASED SOUND MIXERS Matthew Freed matthew@matthewfreed.com Ferris Shaheen ferris@gfssound.com I’m not sure which market you’re closer to but they all tend to work in their area but I’ve met a number of them directly when they’ve visited New York on travel jobs so I can’t stress enough that they are good people! If you have any questions you can always email me too at rwlarosa@gmail.com
  7. There are bunch of Texas mixers in the Austin, Dallas, Houston area that I know that do $750 - $800/10 now and $450 - $500 for a base sound package (Boom, mixer, two lavs like you and most of us). They all do portal to portal for jobs outside their local vicinity as well. None of them nor myself ever do “half day rates” get that idea out of your head because is a farce. With travel time, set-up, tear down, prep, etc, it is a full day. If you must, negotiate to an 8 hour basis (I do $650/8) as a last minute ask but that’s the bottom. In Texas there are mixers such as Matthew Freed, Matthew Kluchin, and Siegen Bretzke among many others that will back-up the numbers. If you don’t know them, I’d love to connect you with them.
  8. If it is a tight frame, at minimum get a boom operator to help cover the participants that are not miced up. I’d personally mic (and rent out said gear) for as many people as you can and then get a very skilled boom op to handle the rest and float around the room. If not, my next bet would be either one mixer with a full cart set up and 12 channels of recording (a hefty rental package for sure) along with an A2 that can help tag team with you to wire people up. Personally I think this is the more ambitious route since with so much wireless coordination, who knows what will happen. Regardless of what you decide, this is 100% a two person job at a minimum. Don’t be a hero and try and do it alone!
  9. It is great to meet you Larry and thanks for smoking me out haha! I’ve been meaning to one day join JWSound so I’m glad this is what brought me here. I actually just sent you a message on Facebook so check your “Message Requests” folder on there so we can continue the conversation! Repeat business is always important. I have a few of them on my end and when they need a slight discount, I’m happy to help to a point (but in this case it’s maybe a $50 - $100 discount and they otherwise will always book me at my full labor and gear rental. I know NFL Films does pay the prevailing rates (and more according to one friend of mine who works with them often, but can’t speak for them). Regardless if it’s an 1 hour day or 10 hour day, I always try to book on a 10. Had plenty of days that are in and out in a couple hours but I’m still getting my full labor and gear rates since I can’t book anything else. “Half day rates” are not in my vocabulary (or for many of us commenting on here that I know). In negotiations I’ll go down to 8 as a last ditch effort but its not my norm. I don’t do live mixing board work personally (Its a world I’m not as versed in) but I do A2 work in that realm and for that I try to aim for at least $650/10 roughly for labor but sometimes I get pushback so I’ve settled on $600/10 from time to time. An A1 I’d aim for $750/10 roughly. Live sound is not quite the same as the production sound realm. Network news has low rates especially on the gear but from other colleagues they have told me there are ways to make the system work for you to at least be a decent day based on how you bill for things. News tends to be its own thing so that’s partially why I don’t work that realm but also from all I know, you need to be in with the DP’s there to get that type of work to begin with. On average I’m working at least 12 or so days a month with the exception of January where I worked 7 and July where I worked 6 but that was only because I was away from July 1 - 18 so I did pretty well considering for that month. Looking forward to continuing the conversation with you!
  10. Hey Larry! Fellow NYC based mixer here! Been at it for about 10 years currently. As of late 2022 I’ve been for non union non commercial work quoting $800/10 and $500 base package for a boom, mixer, and two lavs along with parking, tolls, and either mileage or gas (or if coming from my apartment, my Ubers). Any additional gear needed I add on an a la carte basis. For local NYC area jobs (the 5 boroughs), I don’t ask for portal to portal but anything outside of that I always quote for that. This is for any job that would be a “full rate” job and by that I mean any shoot that is a corporate, digital, non profit, reality, and high end documentary shoot. If it’s a commercial job, I charge union scale since non union commercials budget similarly as their union counterparts (In NYC its around $973.25/10 so I round it up to $975/10 labor. Negotiating happens from time to time but I’ve been I’d say about 50 - 60% of the time getting these prices with no pushback. I don’t do half day rates and those on here saying that for “an easy day” they will take less makes things harder for the rest of us. I’ve had many days this year that was a “quick 3 hour interview” but I still get my full 10 hour day rate and gear rental. At worst, I go down to an 8 hour rate at $650/8 and $300 for a boom and mixer package, no lavs plus expenses. Having open conversations about rates are how we raise one another up and do better over time. Those doing $200 - $350 for a base package really need to at minimum go up to $450 base since you’re leaving a lot of money on the table. If you’d want to connect Larry since we’re in the same market and continue the conversation, I’d love to make that happen!
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