Travis Williamson

If anyone is curious I performed some extra tests today and this is what happened: a) 416 presents the same problematic noise in all channels (1-6) without exception, with a variety of cables. ntg3 presented no problem in channels 5 and 6. nor did the ev676, which i brought in to me mix. i did not bother to test these two mics in channels 1-4. it would have been thorough of me, but didn't seem necessary once the 416 exhibited the same problem in all channels. c) both the ntg3 and ev676 used the same cables as the 416, eliminating the possibility that the cable(s) were the source of the problem. d) channel 5 was clean with both ntg3 and ev676. not to with the 416. this would all be good news if not for what I now can only refer to as 'Mondays anomaly': 12 hours into a shoot, the ntg3 in channel 5 produced the same noise which the 416 produces without fail on all channels. oh boy.

The problem is a new one, within the last few days, so while I would say no, I'm not in denial of the problem Senator, I'm just trying to narrow the problem down. At this stage, I think it's reasonably clear that the problem is with channel 5, but whether it's a problem with the channel itself, or at the digital recording stage is yet to be seen. The problem has not yet repeated on any other channel of the machine, however, like I said, it's early days, and the problem is intermittent, and took a whole day of shooting to manifest the second time on channel 5. It could very well appear again on another channel if I spent a whole day listening and waiting. So in summary, at this stage the problem is isolated to channel 5. When the problem first occurred, I was only running one channel- channel 5. Second time it occurred I had radios open on channel 1 and 2, neither of which contained the problem. So, yes reasonably clear that it's channel 5. Have not tried powering with internal batteries. Why would the NP1's all of a sudden effect the abilities of the machine? Why would the channel itself not work efficiently now, for that matter? I guess it's worth mentioning that in the two years I've owned the machine, i've scarcely used channel 5. The only reason I used it on these two occasions is because I've colour coded the channels with short breakout cables- the break out cable for channel 6- my green channel- failed me, so rather than using the white cable in the green channel, I just used the white channel, which happened to be channel 5. So, the OCD factor allowed me to spot an error with the machine. As for the nature of the offending sound, it reminded me of RF interference too, but it's pretty clear that it is not.

Thanks for the reply. Here is a longer clip, this time an MP3, so as to not exceed 2MB. I cut it, so we hear the most obviously noisy parts. 664_Ch5_Noise_longer.mp3

SD_664_Ch5_NTG3_Noisy.wav I've just tried posting twice and both times somehow deleted all the text, so here's an ulltra brief run down of my issue: Channel 5 of my 664 is producing a weird noise, as heard in the attached sample. It is not cable or mic related as both have been switched out. It happens with both the 416 and Rode NTG3, and any cable. It is intermittent. I first heard it two days ago, about 4 hours into a corporate shoot- single boom, in channel 5. Noise would come and go. Usually immediately after buttoning on. I switched the cable out, the problem persisted, I switched 416 out to the NTG3 and the problem dissapeared. Next day I'm using the NTG3 on a short film thinking the 416 is cooked, 12 hours into a 13 hour day I hear the noise again. Switched to channel 6 for the last hour, with no problems. It's worth noting that on the second day, I had two radios on channel 1 and 2 respectively and boom (NTG3 on channel 5). Channel 1 and 2 do not contain this noise, only channel 5. Noise began immediately after buttoning on, lasted the whole take. I immediately switched to channel 6 after we cut, and stayed there for the remaining hour with no issues. Clip is attached. Noise exists on channel 5 from both shoot days, on both the CF and SD media. Anyone else heard this or experienced this before? If I send the machine back to Sound Devices, I could end up paying for 10 hours of labour time just so they can sit and wait for the problem to occur.

Rings bell from a few years back- I seem to recall it on a poster... went looking on youtube for an ad but coulnd't find that one.

Oh man. The Golden Gaytime is an Australian icon!

Haha it is awful that we call them buttplugs. I will add that I only followed the crowd on that one for simplicity. Will definitely be buying one of these mounting options (the rycote it seems), possibly with a new windshield altogether, AND an HM. Really impressed with the sony system, but the limiters just can't compete with Lectro. Far as using a UM transmitter for wireless boom goes, are most people powering their mics with an MM1? Those things are over $500 new, making the HM seem cheap in comparison at $1075. Of course for me in Australia things are a bit more expensive being that the AU dollar has seen better days (we were at parity at one point!)

Nice discussion guys, and some neat toys there. I don't have an internally cabled pole- stayed away from them, never used one. I figured if something did go wrong inside, it's a bigger re-set than getting rid of your average tangle. Would like to try one someday though. For the time being I think I'll go with the easy does it Rycote XLR holder, looking at a new WS 295 for the 416 anyway, so maybe I'll treat myself to new toys all round. If anyone is curious, this Sony UWP plug on Tx is not bad, I'd say good for ENG/doco work, corporate stuff, anything thats not destined for the cinema. Range is good, noise floor is not amazing, and its a bit thin and plastic sounding if you really want to be picky. Haven't had any overloads yet, but the difference between its compressor and a Lectro compressor is huge. Lectro just sounds nice, Sony just a bit thin and toy. Good for a camera hop alternative to spending thousands on the best Lectro or Zax stuff. Gonna buy an HM after the next feature methinks.... I'll run it in 200 compatibility mode until I can get a hybrid receiver for it.

Perfect. By the looks of things, it comes as an accessory with all the other kits too. Thanks again Peter.

Thanks Peter, that was pretty much the only option I could think of, though it may get tricky with the conbox built in.

So I've bought this Sony UWP system to use primarily as camera hops, but I got one set with a plug on Tx. It actually doesn't sound too bad at all. The only problem is, plugging it in is problematic- my K-tek pole is quite wide at the top and when I plug it into the either the Rycote, or Rode pistol grip, the Tx ends up on a ridiculous almost 45 degree angle, no doubt putting strain on the connector. With the old style Rycote rubber Softie and Invision mounts I can plug directly into the back of the mic, although these aren't ideal solutions as the mic tends to sway a bit, which might be troublsome in some of the more fast and delicate boom dances. I could use a breakout cable and gaff the Tx to my pole, but I was hoping for something a little more elegant than that- how do you guys mount your plug on Tx?

Does anybody use the WS 295 with a 416? As seen here http://www.rycote.com/products/modular-windshield-ws-295-kit/ They say to add an extra 50mm for the connector, which brings the total length to 300mm, and the body length of the cage comes to 295mm. By those numbers it's a no brainer, however, the listing says that many favour it as an alternative to the WS 4. Personal experience with the WS 295 and a 416, anyone?

BUMP. Has anybody used the plug on transmitter for their wireless boom? It's almost sacrilege to compare a Lectro to a Sony (again the "you get what you pay for" resonates with me) but I'm looking at a cheaper alternative to a Lectro HM and UCR411 combo which will cost far more than this Sony package- if the Sony plug on works as well as its beltpack transmitter (comparison tests to the G3s suggest it gets better range) then it might be something I'm willing to add to my existing kit of older Lectro 200c's. There aren't any user reviews of the plug on transmitter available on Youtube. Anyone got some first hand experience to share? Cheers, Travis

Just wanted to say thanks to Marc for this post. I've been looking for a quick, cheap, temporary solution for powering a couple of UCR211's until I can afford a proper distro box and run everything including the 664 off an NP1. I came across a few batteries just like this in my research travels. I'm still learning about electonics and how to power things, so it's reassuring to hear someone else is doing it. Travis

Ok guys, thanks for all the advice. I did have a read of the manual and play with the gain settings. Tx is now CRANKED, and sounding better. Here's a link to another test https://soundcloud.com/travis_williamson/test2 if anyone can be bothered, and below are how everything is set now. The problem of the compander still persists, slightly, espeically when I drop the files into Logic and dial in a compressor, obviously the noise is more audible. Curious to know whether you guys think this is about normal, or if I should send them to Lectro to get serviced/diagnosed? (hoping Larry F has some wisdom to drop here). Second test with improved gain stages. a) B3 (flat cap) >> 200c Tx @ almost full gain >> 211 Rx @ -09 dBu >> 664 LINE LEVEL (Course gain @ 2 o'clock, fader @ 2 o'clock - reads about 8dBu on the 664) B3 (extra crisp cap) >> 200c Tx @ almost full gain >> 211 Rx @ - 12 dBu >> 664 LINE LEVEL(Course gain @ 3 o'clock fader @ 1 o'clock, reads around 8 dBu on the 664) Thanks for all your help- I admit I was wrong in saying I didn't think it was a gain stage issue... things have improved, but they could still be better. Peace, Travis

Well, I only have two B3 Lavs, and nothing else. So trying another mic isn't possible for another week or so til a friend gets back from Sydney and can bring some sankens around. In the mean time, here is a test recording for you to hear the problem. I don't think it's gain stages. Please take a moment to listen to this short test recording and pass on your thoughts. https://soundcloud.com/travis_williamson/test/s-575bs Thanks to everybody who has replied so far. Travis

Also yes, the flat response cap minimises the damage, but it's still there.

Will definitely give the manual a look see when I get home. I don't think it's a gain stage issue because all three sets were in use prior to me buying them, and the same issue happens with all three. Been in touch with the previous owner and it seems like the settings remain the same as he left them, and they were in good working order then. Will be happily proved wrong though. Thanks to all who have replied- if reading the manual doesn't solve the problem I'll post a short clip of the sound for further discussion.

I feel like I should be ultra specific- the dialogue doesn't duck the noise, the noise is audible only when the dialogue occurs. So the hi freq noise has the same rhythmic patterns as the dialogue.

B3s I opened up the TA5 (basically just unscrewed the black plastic) but can't see where the wires are going because it's all held in real solid in there. I don't know how they're wired, I know next to nothing about wiring- it's definitely next thing on the list to learn thats for sure! Someone on the Freelance Mixer group on FB suggested a compander issue... but with ALL THREE sets, I'm a little skeptical. The guy I bought from seems like a good dude, and says he tested the B3s with these units and all worked, but he may have tested quickly and not heard the noise. I don't think he regularly used the B3s with these units, so yeah he might not have known there was a problem. I sent an email to Lectro, but was hoping resident genius Larry F would find this post and make some suggestions. Regardling level on the Tx, I'm hitting -20 and the occasional clip red if I really give my voice some volume. So I don't think I have a low level on the Tx. The Mics I'm using are the 'hot' B3s too, so I feel pretty confident I'm not running it low. It's not your normal noise floor either- noise floors are constant, this follows the rhythm of dialogue/transients etc.

Hi All, First time poster long time reader. I have just bought my first Lectros- used 211/200c, three sets. I did a search of the forum, but couldn't quite find the issue I'm having. Search functionality was good though Here's what I'm doing, and the issue I'm having- hopefully someone can help me diagnose the problem. 211/200c w/ Countryman B3 (hot mic, extra crisp cap) into SD664. There's a noise/hiss which occurrs in unison with the syllables of dialogue/all transient sounds. The noise almost seems to 'gate', in the sense that it will only be audible with the passing of dialogue/transients. Very high end hiss/noise. I had this problem years ago in film school with some cheap Sony wireless, it was impossible to EQ out, it seemed as though the more top end you roll off, you just hear the noise in the middle of the spectrum. The level of the noise is not above the dialogue, it's well and truly 'back there' in the mix, but it's obviously there. The only thread I found which came close to this symptom was one regarding a compander issue where the entire program content was 'gating'... however this is not the case for me, it's simply the noise which gates in and out. It happens with all three Rx/Tx sets. I have only two Countryman B3s, and it's possible that one of the mics is less noiser than the other, but only slightly. Could it be an issue with Mic wiring? Or are my Lectros in need of a service? I don't think it's a gain structure issue, but will be very happily proved wrong. I've also switched out my leads running from Rx to 664, no change. Batteries are new and full 9V Duracell Procell (non rechargable). I am in Australia, the units came to me from Singapore, and are not the AU models. Help me Obi Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope. Cheers to all, and apologies to anyone who finds this topic has already been covered here. Travis Williamson