Jump to content

Indoors interviews recommendations


James Lopez

Recommended Posts

Hello everybody

Firstly I'd like to thank, independently of the possible discussion/suggestions related to this thread, all of the professionals that have shared their valuable knowledge on this forum. I can assure you that after reading many related threads in image/video-based forums, i am truly glad to come across a sound-oriented forum such as this one, with tons of useful information. I also have to mention that I have already more than a few threads related to this issue here at jwsound and I'm familiar with the opinion of many on the subject.

A bit about myself.. Up until a couple of years ago, i have mostly worked in music production, specifically OST's on documentaries and short feature films, as well as live sound engineering for a variety of music styles (from east european traditional music to teenage punk groups). Both my academic and professional background has always been related to sound/music and i could safely say that i understand audio fundamentals related to sound transmission, acoustics etc. Mainly due to my personal interest on the subject, I have decided to take a rather steep turn in my career and get involved into broadcast/media sound production, as a boom operator/recordist. I have by now worked in 3 small/medium feature documentaries with decent results, especially considering the quality of the equipment used. Said that, i am perfectly aware of how both technique/quality gear can have a huge impact on the end product and i am doing my best to get both on the highest level possible :-)

Onto the subject of discussion then..

In the next few weeks, me and my team (sound, camera, script/production) will be starting the production of a small series of corporate videos. They will be interview-based, with the interviews talking place mostly (and possibly always) in the interiors of a corporate building, namely offices, meeting rooms, laboratories. Even though some of these spaces seem to have some kind of acoustic treatment and therefore less than horrid acoustics, i will have to confront much less than ideal conditions in others. Ceiling A/C's will be there, and even though they are quite silent, they are not dead silent by any way. Larger, echoey rooms will also possibly be there as well as some medical laboratories (not very noisy but again, definitely not silent). Since most interviews will be static, I have chosen to use my DAW (MBP-Apogee Duet) since i trust both the duet's stellar converters as well as its transparent preamps. Unfortunately, this is not the case if the set doesn't allow me to be tethered, where i shall be using an H4n instead, with all that comes with it. It appears that for the amount of sessions needed in this project, renting material is not the most economical option and, due to the lack of a wide variety of microphones available from my 'usual suspect', it doesn't even give me a solid chance to 'try before buy' either. To be exact, there aren't any broadcast sound oriented stores in my area, which leaves few if not no chances to try out the equipment and decide if i want to keep it. Hence, i have come across the so-much-talked issue of an interior mic solution. My budget lies at around 650 euros, not including the cabled k-tec pole which is already accounted for (in case the lav solution is discarded of course). I will also be using the 'interiors' of the rode blimp, which have worked decently in the past. Im sure that people here are familiar with that price point and where it gets you.. Before i start naming (my) candidates, id have to chose between the basic solutions, hyper or lav. In case i go with the lav, theres the advantage of 'assured' healthy input due to the placement's close distance, regardless of the wideness of the shot (which is not determined at this time unfortunately), which will help both for the noise/acoustics. Important downsides may be the fact that the person interviewed has to be tethered (no budget for a wireless system) and also the impossibillity of recording 2 people simultaneously (sited next to each other), even though its not certain that this will happen. In case i choose to go for a hyper, i ASSUME that due to its diagram's real lobe i might have higher A/C noise and if the camera wants to go for a wider shot, i may end up moving dangerously far away from the subject (even though hopefully this will never be the case). It does however give me more control, being able to move freely or between 2 subjects. I understand that with said budget, i could buy 2 lavs which could be used cabled, hence being able to record more than one person (always tethered though).

So, here comes that list...

Not being able to check out none of these myself, after (really really really) extensive reading and little listening (not too many sound tests out there), I've narrowed my options to: a) audio-tecnica AT4053b B) Audix scx1-hc c) neumann km185. Im still searching/reviewing info regarding lavs, and haven't made my mind on which exactly the candidates would be. Chad Johnson and Dan Brockett have published some very interesting shootouts and both have been my primary audible source of information (Considering the specific acoustics/subject/equipment nature of the tests as well as compression issues of course). Chad Johnson has also done some tests on the AT4053b, which i found to have a full body sound that i really liked, even though maybe slightly dark (not in favor of overly bright mics though). Many have commented in favor of the Audix too, but i have failed to find any sound test/sample to get some idea on how it sounds. I have used the scx1 for viola recording and it sounded great, but of course this means nothing in this case. Some here at jwsound have expressed favorable opinions for the km185 and mentioned that in the latest revision neumann has worked on the RF shielding of the mic, very welcome addition indeed. If i was asked what I'm looking for in a hyper.. well, i guess what most would ask for. Smooth, natural response, sensitivity, robustness, no severe off-axis coloration, not too much handling noise if possible. This doesn't mean that i expect everything in this purchase, just pointing out. On the lav side of the matter, i admittedly lack knowledge even though i try to inform to the extend that one can do this by reading reviews and listening to some tests. I suppose that, having explained the project's nature, any suggestion given would be a great plus.

I fully understand that simply jumping in and asking the 'which is the best mic for this' question is not the appropriate attitude, especially given the professional background of users here, so I have tried to be as specific as possible, without this meaning that i expect any kind of special treatment. Just thought it would be a nice way to introduce myself in this community.. Thanks for reading this and for any specific or general suggestions/recommendations that may follow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

a) audio-tecnica AT4053b 8) Audix scx1-hc c) neumann km185.

Hi James,

you answered by yourself to your question, since in your price range there's no more options. Just one thing: if you're going to use the Zoom preamps, get the mic with higher output (the AT4053 in this case) since the preamps on the Zoom recorder are noisy. Said so, any of those mics will fit your needs perfectly.

Skip the Rode Blimp if you can: too heavy and too big. Something ultra cheap like a Rode SM4 mount will be way lighter and way easier to hide, btw Rycote lyre mounts are top notch quality and, for me at least, always the first choice.

On the lav side

If you're going to hospitals, medical laboratories and so on, use wired lavs any time you can instead of cheap wireless. Lavs can be rented if your budget is tight, but please, do yourself a favour: do not use cheap ones!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

" after (really really really) extensive reading "

here at jwsoundgroup ??

these mic choice questions come up continuously, and nothing much changes...

in this case, you do seem to have even answered your own question, so I suspect you are looking for approval...

OK, go ahead. ::)

and remember: it takes years of experience to get years of experience.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Winter, thanx for the reply

I agree that the Zoom preamps are noisy and they also have a plasticky sound that I'm not fond of in any way. I might be able to do without them though, since theres a big possibility that i might use the Duet's pre's instead (very clean, very transparent, 75dB gain) - not always though. On the other hand, i remember reading somewhere (not sure if it was here at jwsound) that the AT4053b is a bit noisy itself. I cannot verify that, nor i can safely say that the person that noted it didnt have issues on some other element in the recording chain that may have caused it. Opinions about the km185 here make me doubt even more.. Regarding the Blimp, i was actually thinking of buying the Rycote Invision (that would be inv-7?) which is very affordable and I've read great things about it. Even though i need to search/listen more, at a medium price level, i liked the audio-tecnica at899 as well as the rode lavalier. Their price would permit me to buy 2, if used cabled. To be honest, i have never been a great fan of wireless systems. Not sure if its just me, but i think that the same mic would give better results cabled than it would wireless, considering the wireless system i could afford in the near future.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

" after (really really really) extensive reading "

here at jwsoundgroup ??

these mic choice questions come up continuously, and nothing much changes...

in this case, you do seem to have even answered your own question, so I suspect you are looking for approval...

OK, go ahead. ::)

and remember: it takes years of experience to get years of experience.

Hello Senator, thanks for replying

I think i have clearly explained my lack of experience on the field and did so because i didn't want to sound know-it-all in any way. And i haven't answered any of my questions, since, even after reading as much as i could before starting this thread, I don't have the experience to assess and validate the info, nor i believe what i read as much as i do what i hear. Hence the need for advice from those that do know. It seems that I have not managed to search this forum sufficiently though, back to the search engine I go..

Thanks again

EDIT: Didn't want to sound bad or insulting, sorry if sounded that way

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They will be interview-based, with the interviews talking place mostly (and possibly always) in the interiors of a corporate building, namely offices, meeting rooms, laboratories. Even though some of these spaces seem to have some kind of acoustic treatment and therefore less than horrid acoustics, i will have to confront much less than ideal conditions in others. Ceiling A/C's will be there, and even though they are quite silent, they are not dead silent by any way. Larger, echoey rooms will also possibly be there as well as some medical laboratories (not very noisy but again, definitely not silent).

A couple of suggestions:

1) lavs will eliminate much of the room acoustics, which could be good or bad, depending on the degree of realism you're looking for. I've used Tram TR-50's, Oscar Sound Tech 801's, Countryman B6's, and they're all decent performers.

2) wireless transmitters and receivers are generally expected in this kind of situation, so choice of preamp is not going to be a factor. The people I typically deal with in docos are not accustomed to hard wires for lavs (but it was done in years past).

3) if you choose to go with a boom, the usual suspects are Sennheiser MKH416, MKH50, MKH40's, Schoeps 641... tons of great choices out there. Do a search on this site and you'll find them. Used microphones are plentiful if you haunt eBay. You already know that different pickup patterns will react very differently to different environments.

4) your experience as a studio mixer may come in handy if the production needs you to reduce HVAC noise or other location-related problems in post. iZotope RX can be a miracle worker.

5) bring along sound blankets and ask the grip crew for some C-stands, and see if the sound blankets can tame flutter echo and other room problems.

Be warned that neither the Apogee Duet nor the Zoom is ideal for interviews, in my opinion. I think a purpose-built location sound recorder like the Sound Devices or even the relatively-inexpensive Fostexes are higher quality and more portable and will suit documentaries much better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2) wireless transmitters and receivers are generally expected in this kind of situation, so choice of preamp is not going to be a factor. The people I typically deal with in docos are not accustomed to hard wires for lavs (but it was done in years past).

This is true for normal shootings (well, if the word "normal" means anything in doco world...), but I've also suggested to hardwire because this guy needs to work in medical labs, so in order to avoid RF issues or because of internal rules (like the prohibition of using wireless devices including mobile phones...this happened to me two times) could be a safer solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What camera are you shooting on? Also, you didn't mention a mixer. It could be cheaper, easier, faster to record sound directly to the camera. I know, blashemy on a sound forum, but most corporate shoots I've done were straight to camera. The preamps on most modern HD production video cameras are more than adequate for corporate work. Monitor through headphones.

How will the project be delivered and who is going to see it? Internet? Broadcast? Internal company video? DVD? Blueray? This can determine whether or not you need to hide mics. On most corporate shoots I've done in the past 20+ years, visible lavs are OK, especially if it is talking heads addressing the camera. Not having to hide mics can cut down on a lot of clothing noise issues, especially on fast moving shoots.

In that case, 2 Rode or OST lavs straight to camera would be a good sounding an inexpensive solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A couple of suggestions:

1) lavs will eliminate much of the room acoustics, which could be good or bad, depending on the degree of realism you're looking for. I've used Tram TR-50's, Oscar Sound Tech 801's, Countryman B6's, and they're all decent performers.

2) wireless transmitters and receivers are generally expected in this kind of situation, so choice of preamp is not going to be a factor. The people I typically deal with in docos are not accustomed to hard wires for lavs (but it was done in years past).

3) if you choose to go with a boom, the usual suspects are Sennheiser MKH416, MKH50, MKH40's, Schoeps 641... tons of great choices out there. Do a search on this site and you'll find them. Used microphones are plentiful if you haunt eBay. You already know that different pickup patterns will react very differently to different environments.

4) your experience as a studio mixer may come in handy if the production needs you to reduce HVAC noise or other location-related problems in post. iZotope RX can be a miracle worker.

5) bring along sound blankets and ask the grip crew for some C-stands, and see if the sound blankets can tame flutter echo and other room problems.

Be warned that neither the Apogee Duet nor the Zoom is ideal for interviews, in my opinion. I think a purpose-built location sound recorder like the Sound Devices or even the relatively-inexpensive Fostexes are higher quality and more portable and will suit documentaries much better.

Thanks for pointing out iZotope, I've been looking for something like this for a while. I'll definitely be giving it a try tonight.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A couple of suggestions:

1) lavs will eliminate much of the room acoustics, which could be good or bad, depending on the degree of realism you're looking for. I've used Tram TR-50's, Oscar Sound Tech 801's, Countryman B6's, and they're all decent performers.

2) wireless transmitters and receivers are generally expected in this kind of situation, so choice of preamp is not going to be a factor. The people I typically deal with in docos are not accustomed to hard wires for lavs (but it was done in years past).

3) if you choose to go with a boom, the usual suspects are Sennheiser MKH416, MKH50, MKH40's, Schoeps 641... tons of great choices out there. Do a search on this site and you'll find them. Used microphones are plentiful if you haunt eBay. You already know that different pickup patterns will react very differently to different environments.

4) your experience as a studio mixer may come in handy if the production needs you to reduce HVAC noise or other location-related problems in post. iZotope RX can be a miracle worker.

5) bring along sound blankets and ask the grip crew for some C-stands, and see if the sound blankets can tame flutter echo and other room problems.

Be warned that neither the Apogee Duet nor the Zoom is ideal for interviews, in my opinion. I think a purpose-built location sound recorder like the Sound Devices or even the relatively-inexpensive Fostexes are higher quality and more portable and will suit documentaries much better.

Thanx for the advice, much appreciated. I agree that mixer/recorder are basic blocks in my equipment and cant be replaced by neither the zoom or the duet. Unfortunately, my budget is very tight atm and im still lacking 1 or 2 mics, depending on the type. I probably wouldnt be able to afford a fostex or sd, even if i rented the mics. Sound blankets would definetely help, Ill try to get hold of some. Thanks again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What camera are you shooting on? Also, you didn't mention a mixer. It could be cheaper, easier, faster to record sound directly to the camera. I know, blashemy on a sound forum, but most corporate shoots I've done were straight to camera. The preamps on most modern HD production video cameras are more than adequate for corporate work. Monitor through headphones.

How will the project be delivered and who is going to see it? Internet? Broadcast? Internal company video? DVD? Blueray? This can determine whether or not you need to hide mics. On most corporate shoots I've done in the past 20+ years, visible lavs are OK, especially if it is talking heads addressing the camera. Not having to hide mics can cut down on a lot of clothing noise issues, especially on fast moving shoots.

In that case, 2 Rode or OST lavs straight to camera would be a good sounding an inexpensive solution.

The camera does audio but not 24bit so I loose some headroom. A mixer's better preamps and limiter would definetely add to the sound though. I liked the sound of the rode lav in a shootout on vimeo, but also the at899, both affordable. Still not sure if i should go for a hyper or lav(s).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The camera does audio but not 24bit so I loose some headroom. A mixer's better preamps and limiter would definetely add to the sound though. I liked the sound of the rode lav in a shootout on vimeo, but also the at899, both affordable. Still not sure if i should go for a hyper or lav(s).

If you are just doing interviews you don't need that much headroom.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you are just doing interviews you don't need that much headroom.

After all, the REAL headroom on a Zoom recorder is very limited, i guess about REAL 14/15 bits....and yes, we're talking about interviews, no great headroom needed, I totally agree.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I note the unanimity on this :-) Still, even the mix-preD comes to around 890 Euros (you'd be amazed to see how in audio products, euro-dollar exchange rate 'transforms' to 1:1..), meaning that i would have to rent mics since thats about all my budget. I could possibly fit in something cheaper, but maybe it would be better to wait until i can afford an SD mixer/recorder.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I note the unanimity on this :-) Still, even the mix-preD comes to around 890 Euros (you'd be amazed to see how in audio products, euro-dollar exchange rate 'transforms' to 1:1..), meaning that i would have to rent mics since thats about all my budget. I could possibly fit in something cheaper, but maybe it would be better to wait until i can afford an SD mixer/recorder.

James, for the job you have to do, there's no real necessity to use a high-headroom and high-quality SD recorder. Obviously it will sound better, but it's not mandatory. SD prices in Europe are just crazy, I will never buy SD products at those prices; but why don't you just rent a mixer for a few days? Where are you in Europe? Surely you can find a rental house.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

James, for the job you have to do, there's no real necessity to use a high-headroom and high-quality SD recorder. Obviously it will sound better, but it's not mandatory. SD prices in Europe are just crazy, I will never buy SD products at those prices; but why don't you just rent a mixer for a few days? Where are you in Europe? Surely you can find a rental house.

I am in Barcelona atm and yes there are a few rental houses around. Recapping.. Ditch the zoom (and maybe the duet as well), rent a mixer to go directly into the cam, with either 2 lavs wired (or wireless if i can afford renting the wireless system) or a single hyper. I think that maybe i can squeeze all in. The dilemma between lavs or hyper remains, but this has got a lot to do with the particular location and the script i guess. Any opinion on the hypers i mentioned in the 1st post? Thanx for all the advice people, really helpful.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am in Barcelona atm and yes there are a few rental houses around. Recapping.. Ditch the zoom (and maybe the duet as well), rent a mixer to go directly into the cam, with either 2 lavs wired (or wireless if i can afford renting the wireless system) or a single hyper. I think that maybe i can squeeze all in. The dilemma between lavs or hyper remains, but this has got a lot to do with the particular location and the script i guess. Any opinion on the hypers i mentioned in the 1st post? Thanx for all the advice people, really helpful.

Man, I'm in Barcelona too! Rent a mixer at Ovide or Sonostudi, then go direct to the camera and use the Zoom as backup. About the lavs/hyper dilemma, ask the producer about the kind of sound he wants, but IMHO, a lav can be only a nice complement to a boom. I will never rely on lavs only, it's too easy to have problems, call them RF, noisy clothes or whatever. About the hyper: it's not the brand, it's the price range...ANY of those mics will do the job, and if you're still in doubt, rent the hyper too! Surely you can find at least an AKG blueline.

Job done! ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man, I'm in Barcelona too! I do Rent a mixer at Ovide or Sonostudi, then go direct to the camera and use the Zoom as backup. About the lavs/hyper dilemma, ask the producer about the kind of sound he wants, but IMHO, a lav can be only a nice complement to a boom. I will never rely on lavs only, it's too easy to have problems, call them RF, noisy clothes or whatever. About the hyper: it's not the brand, it's the price range...ANY of those mics will do the job, and if you're still in doubt, rent the hyper too! Surely you can find at least an AKG blueline.

Job done! ;)

Wow, nice to hear so man. Thanks for the rental suggestions, ill sure will pay them a visit (they are not the place i rent stuff from). Ill try to get hold of and test any of the candidates formentioned, a rental-purchase combination (buy the hyper, rent a lav) will do the job i think. Thanx for the advice man, much appreciated. :-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, nice to hear so man. Thanks for the rental suggestions, ill sure will pay them a visit (they are not the place i rent stuff from). Ill try to get hold of and test any of the candidates formentioned, a rental-purchase combination (buy the hyper, rent a lav) will do the job i think. Thanx for the advice man, much appreciated. :-)

Personally I do rent at sonostudi from time to time, because they're cheap and efficient, but there will be more rental house I don't know in town. Ovide it's more specialized, but I've never rent anything from them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Winter

You mention in another thread that you own an Audix and i think you are referring to the SCX1-HC? Is that so? If yes, could you share a few words regarding this mic? I'm deciding between this and the KM185, but apart from a few mentions i found about it, there's not much more around, so i could use some 1st hand opinion. Thanks

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...