jrd456 Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 HuH I know SM-57's are popular, but I don't get the logic of the statement... Talking about when micing different sound sources Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Two lavs clipped to a person would not be stereo. Two mikes on a podium pointed at one person is not stereo, either, assuming they're both in the same place (like the Reagan mikes above). I always assumed that podium mikes on awards shows and stuff like that just used one microphone, period, and the other mike was just there as a standby. No way would I want to combine two identical outputs together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toy Robot Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 30 years ago, politicians tried to talk to both the left and the right at the same time. Now they only speak in one direction... Zing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toy Robot Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 If the lavaliere elements are a 1/2 inch apart center to center, you shouldn't have a null until 13.8 kHz if you mounted them in the worst possible alignment, in line with the sound source, i.e., one above the other on a person. Mounted in the usual left to right alignment, even if a little off center, phasing issues would be much higher in frequency, easily outside the audible range. Best Regards, Larry Fisher Lectrosonics I hope we all thank you enough for how useful this type of information is. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 It is stereo of course... "Stereo" means there is a spatial relationship such as left-right... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Feeley Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 I think Bubba was joking. Pretty solid sense of humor (get it?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungo Posted July 4, 2012 Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 Over here in Germany there's a tv show in which they use an omni lav for broadcast and a cardioid lav for pa (roughly cut in lower frequencies, not sounding good, but it's "only for the audience"). So there's no problem with rumble noises in the broadcast signal and pa feedback problems are less. The Sennheiser ME 102 (Omni) and ME 104 (Cardio) look completely the same. But you see more and more dpa headsets in skin colours on tv shows. So they go back to using one transmitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep owl Posted July 4, 2012 Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 Directionality and responsiveness of the diaphram greatly affect phasing problems.Thats one reason SM57's are popular in rock music recording. Good ol' SM57/58. Use it as a hammer, then go use it as a mic. Probably never fail on ya...as a hammer or a mic. That's why they're popular in rock music in general. Singer for 'At the Drive-In' could swing it around the stage on 40' of cable, hit instruments, props, bandmates, reel it in, stick it in his mouth and scream, spit it out on the ground, and finish the song with a light whisper. For recording? Eh, good to put 1 or 2 on a snare drum, maybe high toms, and decent on guitar cabs that are pumping out distortion power chords. There are better options but the 57 holds it's own for what it is. Sade's vox on early tracks were often recorded with a 57 or 58. That's impressive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted July 4, 2012 Report Share Posted July 4, 2012 Don't use your 57 as a hammer--they aren't that solid.... The mic that used to be demo'ed by hammering with it was the EV 635. It didn't hold up well to hammering all that well when I tried it either. phil p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sounddguy Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 Funny how, back in the 1980s and prior, they always used three microphones up on the Presidential Podium (all Shure SM-57s with windscreens): The three mic split was one to PA, One to Press Feed box and one to the official white house recording team, with all three cross wired as back up. ( Working PA I had a feed from the press mult box and from the WH team etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Tucker Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 Good ol' SM57/58. Use it as a hammer, then go use it as a mic. Probably never fail on ya...as a hammer or a mic. That's why they're popular in rock music in general. Singer for 'At the Drive-In' could swing it around the stage on 40' of cable, hit instruments, props, bandmates, reel it in, stick it in his mouth and scream, spit it out on the ground, and finish the song with a light whisper. For recording? Eh, good to put 1 or 2 on a snare drum, maybe high toms, and decent on guitar cabs that are pumping out distortion power chords. There are better options but the 57 holds it's own for what it is. Sade's vox on early tracks were often recorded with a 57 or 58. That's impressive! This reminded me of something I read in Sound On Sound a while back. I went ahead and googled it. Thought y'all might find it interesting. I'm guessing that the shotgun they're referring to is a 416 "Jack Douglas, engineer for many of Aerosmith's most successful albums, has also mentioned that he often combined close and ambient mics for Steven Tyler's vocals. Unusually, though, he used a Shure SM57 dynamic up close and a heavily compressed Sennheiser shotgun mic about five feet away." Regarding durability, the SM's are pretty good, but not the tanks that most make them out to be. I've definitely gone through quite a few in my FOH days. Your mention of ATDI reminded me of a Converge show I saw recently (any metal heads out there?). The singer went through at least 2 mics and a couple cables, after repeatedly thrashing them against the stage and throwing them into the crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbapro Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 I think Bubba was joking. Pretty solid sense of humor (get it?). I was joking, but it does not seem nearly as funny now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron Alexander Posted October 5, 2014 Report Share Posted October 5, 2014 Hello All Just want to add that for live micing involving sound reinforcement they would feed one 57 to the PA and another phase reversed to the stage monitor. This fought back the feedback. Not to say that this is how it was done in the picture. There shouldn't be ANY noticeable phase discrepancies between coincidental pairs. Cameron The three mic split was one to PA, One to Press Feed box and one to the official white house recording team, with all three cross wired as back up. ( Working PA I had a feed from the press mult box and from the WH team etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted October 8, 2014 Report Share Posted October 8, 2014 I sort of don't think having the monitor wash being 180 degrees out of phase with the FOH mix would be a good idea. How would this help re feedback (in the monitors)? philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Rubilar Posted October 8, 2014 Report Share Posted October 8, 2014 it was an old technic, trying to fighft the feedback unity gain. Phase reversed signal from a second mic(for monitors) that is gaf-taped to the main mic (for front of house). I have never did that, and dont know if it realy works. You can see it in old live rock videos. It is not in use anymore, replaced by graphic eqs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 8, 2014 Report Share Posted October 8, 2014 The technique involved two matched mics taped together with the mics wired out of phase, not the monitors. The artist then worked really close to just one of the mics. The PA sound was picked up by both mics and largely canceled. The artist was much closer to one mic than the other and, therefore, not canceled out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted October 8, 2014 Report Share Posted October 8, 2014 Oh--THIS I did try--the two mics taped together out of phase thing. Sucked, ditched it. The famous Owsley "Wall of Sound" system used by the Grateful Dead did a similar thing, but was much more advanced--custom made mics etc. I guess it worked sort of ok--I'm told the players didn't like it much. Evenually they went to mats placed where the vocalist would stand that had a contact switch in them that opened a noise gate when they stood on it--in front of the mic (their head then blocking the Wall of Sound from the mic, they thought). This also proved problematic as Jerry Garcia would stand with one foot on the mat and another off and sway and shift his weight has he soloed, thus inadvertently switching his mic on and off. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisH Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Ive used this technique before in narrative for an extremely dynamic scene. Two transmitters set at same level one with a regular COS-11 on with a red dot Cos-11. This allowed me to have excellent signal to noise for both the whispers and the yells that happened in the same scene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Ive used this technique before in narrative for an extremely dynamic scene. Two transmitters set at same level one with a regular COS-11 on with a red dot Cos-11. This allowed me to have excellent signal to noise for both the whispers and the yells that happened in the same scene. So basically: NeverClip. Nice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikewest Posted October 11, 2014 Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 Best identical response lavs that I once owned were Sony ECM 50's Two mike subject - in UK TV we used to have two mikes on a Fisher boom for live shows! (3 including me lol) mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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