Mid-Range Hypercardioid Help

[berniebeaudry]

Thanks for comparing the two. I'd certainly love a MKH50, but I can't afford one new and I can't find any used ones anywhere. I've listened to quite a few samples and prefer it over the CMC641 to my ear. I understand the CMC641 is more natural sounding and the MKH50 is a bit (just a bit) hyped and deeper. From the recordings I heard at least from the "As I Hear It" shootout by Dan Brockett - http://www.kenstone....c_brockett.html - I preferred the MKH 50 for the female vocal and the male vocal (with the rolloff engaged, I thought it was too "Barry White" with it off). Am I crazy for not preferring the CMC641 as the top dog in the high-end mics? I don't think I've developed my ear for comparing completely yet...

Its a matter of what your ear likes to hear. I prefer a natural, uncolored sound so I prefer the Schoeps line of mics. The Sennheiser line is a standard in the industry as well, but to my ear they sound somewhat hyped. Not a bad sound just different. Many pros will choose a Sennheiser instead. Its great to have so many good choices.

[Toy Robot]

Oktava MK12 hypercardioid is a very good compromise but you need to test them before buying one. You can use the same accessories than those for Schoeps.

+1. There are links on JWSound you can find if you search that will show you decent places to buy them from. Do not buy from Guitar Center, is the rub. I use an Oktava MK-012MOD on almost every project. I love it, clients love it, and actors/actresses I have worked with have put it in their reels on multiple occasions. It is very good for the money in my opinion, and you can purchase different capsules based on your pattern preference.

Also, this is a very good link to start with: As I Hear It: Choosing the Right Microphone by Ken Stone

It helps if you hear these mics in person. I'm about to point something out others have voiced, but I feel it is both true and worth noting again. Hearing someone's voice you've never heard before already recorded on different mics might show you the difference in mics, but won't allow you to evaluate the coloration of the individual mics to the real human's voice. In other words, you might be able to say, "That one sounds better." But you won't be able to say, "That one sounds more natural." How can you know if you haven't heard the real person?

And lastly, everyone has an opinion...

This was mine.

[OmahaAudio]

AT4053b - Mostly positive reviews. ~$600 new, can't find used.

I like it, found mine on EBay for $450

[Marc Wielage]

Thanks for comparing the two. I'd certainly love a MKH50, but I can't afford one new and I can't find any used ones anywhere.

I got mine practically brand-new from eBay about five years ago for maybe $700 or so. There's one up there right now (ends 4/23):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sennheiser-MKH-50-P48-Condenser-Cable-Professional-Microphone-/200747109978?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ebd75ce5a#ht_500wt_1280

Microphones are one of those things that I think you can't skimp on. The good thing about investing in microphones early on is, they hold their value for a long time, and they also make a big difference in sound quality (all other things being equal).

[zwiggi]

Thanks for sharing Marc - that just went up. Seems like good luck. Just put my bid in, crossing fingers. I also just put an order in for an Audix SCX1 one to try as well. Finally will be able to test a few of these out myself. Thank you for all of the valuable thoughts and feedback!

[Olle Sjostrom]

There are other aspects to consider than just the sound, which I find important;

- weight

- sensitivity to handling noise

- size (IMO, often overlooked)

- accessories

(null)

[filmsalang]

I found the film when I began searching for the different versions of the Gefell on the forums (210, 300, 310) since I didn't really know much about that particular mic. I think it came up when there was a conversation about a South Korean trying to find a Gefell 310 (which seems to be a very hard mic to find).

From the $600 price difference, I might try out the Audix first, unless you feel there's a big difference between the two.

I've got M310 and was the guy looking for any info about GefellM310 or so.

I have some interview recordings out of the M310 somewhere in my computer. Let me get you some examples when time allows me.

Just in one word, the mic is more than fantastic.

[zwiggi]

I've got M310 and was the guy looking for any info about GefellM310 or so.

I have some interview recordings out of the M310 somewhere in my computer. Let me get you some examples when time allows me.

Just in one word, the mic is more than fantastic.

I'm very interested to hear the M-310. Where'd you end up getting it?

[zwiggi]

There are other aspects to consider than just the sound, which I find important;

- weight

- sensitivity to handling noise

- size (IMO, often overlooked)

- accessories

(null)

Great points. Do any of the ones I listed have positive or negative aspects with these factors that are notable?

[zwiggi]

I grabbed the Sennheiser MKH50 as well (the one on eBay) - I'll give the Audix SCX1 and the MKH50 a shot and compare. I'd love to hear the Gefell 310 as well, but it seems quite hard to find. Thank you for all of the feedback!

[benr]

I grabbed the Sennheiser MKH50 as well (the one on eBay) - I'll give the Audix SCX1 and the MKH50 a shot and compare. I'd love to hear the Gefell 310 as well, but it seems quite hard to find. Thank you for all of the feedback!

Ha ha I was watching that auction! That guy relisted that mic a couple times. I think he was confused about how he wanted to list it.

[zwiggi]

Ha ha I was watching that auction! That guy relisted that mic a couple times. I think he was confused about how he wanted to list it.

Yeah! It was driving me crazy. I'd put a bid on it and then it would disappear and re-list. I think he just wanted to do the Buy It Now the whole time.

I also am picking up a Busman BSC1 for my "test" as well, to throw a potential dark horse into the mix. I'm going to be comparing the Audix SCX1-HC, Sennheiser MKH50 and the Busman BSC1 in a basic recording test in NYC - I'll probably have one male and one female voice and try to keep everything consistent. If anyone is in NYC and wants to try out another mic in a big test, please let me know. Could be interesting to have 4-6 HC mics all recorded under the same settings for comparison. It wouldn't be perfect, but would help some people who don't have the ability to test them out otherwise.

[BrianW]

Something I'm a big fan of is renting mics that you think you might like to know more about. It's relatively inexpensive and gives you hands-on experience with the mic you're curious about.

Some mics are naturally higher quality than others, of course, but when it comes to personal reviews they're just so.... you know, "personal". Different room, different voice, different pre-amp... too many variables. There's nothing like trying it out yourself in the exact situation that matters just to you.

[OmahaAudio]

Ha ha I was watching that auction! That guy relisted that mic a couple times. I think he was confused about how he wanted to list it.

I love it when someone on EBay gets confused. I got a brand-new-in-the-bag K-Tek 102CC boom, a new K-Tek boom pole holder and a new Boom Tube case for all of $425 because someone didn't really know how to list it and was selling it for a friend...

[Olle Sjostrom]

Great points. Do any of the ones I listed have positive or negative aspects with these factors that are notable?

Not really, just would be great to see on such a list;

Dimensions and weight

Accessories (changeable capsules, swivels, Colette cable etc etc)

And such as...

[studiomprd]

Hello there...

sorry I got here ;late only to say

"it depends", as many of the it depends have been covered, and others, not so much...

what specifically, and how, are you going to be using this mic for ??

all of the candidates you mention, and others have their uses, and their fans...

ultimately selecting a mic is both subjective, and personal.

As mentioned, the MP-3 files, even WAV files, are a starting point, but have limitations.

reading, comparisons, and your particular needs are essential elements of your decision, which is an education.

[Marc Wielage]

I would also add that each of these mikes has pros and cons, and none are flat-out bad. What I would say about the Audix / AKG / Peluso comparisons is that they're not what I see being used out there in LA very often, at least not among TV and feature crews, or commercial and documentary crews. I think the MKH Sennheisers have a reputation for being absolutely rock solid, nearly-impervious to humidity problems, very low self-noise, and freedom from RFI from florescent lights and so on, as well as very good "reachability"; the Schoeps' reputation is for accuracy and excellent off-axis response.

I own both and use both all the time; my preference is generally for the MKH60 or MKH70 in exteriors, and the MKH50, the MKH40, or the Schoeps 641 indoors. You can make very good cases for many of these microphones; for me, the Sennheisers cut better with the Tram50 lavs I use for wireless. For music recording, or situations where I can control the acoustics, no question the Schoeps are going to be the best choice.

For somebody starting out: the first mike I ever bought was a Sennheiser 416, and it still gets some use from time to time. I generally won't do a shoot without knowing it's available in the truck -- it's the "Swiss Army Knife" of microphones for me (despite being German). The second mike I ever bought, exactly six years ago this month, was a Sennheiser MKH40, and it's been flawless (after an initial trip to the service department in Connecticut). To me, either of those would be better choices than the others on your list.

Barring that, don't overlook the prospect of rentals. Sometimes, this is really the best way to get familiar with a microphone and to understand its strengths and weaknesses. Also, don't forget the need for shockmounts and booms: K-Tek, Rycote, and Cinela are often discussed around here, and each is good in their own way, but not necessarily appropriate for all situations. Often, the reality is that where the mike is placed and how it's used may be more critical than the mike itself.

[studiomprd]

" the reality is that where the mike is placed and how it's used may be more critical than the mike itself. "

aka <tiger>

[jason porter]

I had an AKG SE300 +CK93 sitting around in a box, I bought it and never used it. This week I broke it out and used it for some sit downs (indoors, fairly quiet spaces)

The subject had a hidden COS-11 and the 300 overhead (arms length away), split tracks.

I was really impressed with the way the 300 matched up with the Sanken. They sounded very similar except the hyper had a bit of room/reverb, whereas the lav was dead dry. Even though I had to push the gain to 4 o'clock on my 302, I did not notice any more noise than on the lav (SMV + 411a)

It won't replace my MK41, but overall, I can see myself using it again.