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302 and red epic


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I am a fairly green soundie, who usually works as boom or utility. Tomorrow I will be mixing some second unit coverage on the show I am currently on. I will be using a SD 302 and 2 lectros, and a boom. I'm going directly to camera via beta snake and I have never recorded straight to camera like this before. I guess I'm just looking for any advice in general and potential problems this setup could present. Thankyou

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" I guess I'm just looking for any advice in general and potential problems this setup could present. Thankyou "

there is already tons of stuff to read here on jwsoundgroup.net.

an advanced test session would be a good idea to figure out things prior to the actual shoot...

remember, it takes years of experience to get years of experience...

break a leg.

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Record backup/primary audio to an external recorder...even a cheap Zoom or something...

Download and read the RED Epic Operation Manual:

https://www.red.com/downloads

Read these two (and some other recent) discussion threads here on JWS:

Find out which version of the firmware the camera is running and what your camera can and can't do.

Make sure you/they have the cables you need.

Record backup/primary audio to an external recorder...even a cheap Zoom or something...

Arrive early and ensure you'll have enough time with the camera to get things settled.

Turn off the RED's limiter.

Record backup/primary audio to an external recorder...even a cheap Zoom or something...

Good luck.

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and I would even add: Record backup/primary audio to an external recorder...even a cheap Zoom or something... ::)

Even a Zoom sounds better than on-camera RED audio...

And your earlier comment about it taking years of experience in order to get years of experience is all too true.

--R

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Read the 302 user manual while you're at it too!

It is possible to attenuate the 302 main outputs down to mic level which is what the red epic will require. Also, some sort of xlr to 3.5mm trs adapter will be needed to interface with the epic. They will probably provide that... Probably!

Have fun, I'm sure something will go wrong and you'll find yourself under the bus. Just try to push for having a back up recorder.

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I have done corporate videos going into the camera of a Scarlett, which is very similar to the Epic. The output of the device is heavily delayed, which is extremely distracting to listen to when monitoring from the device , As you SHOULD be doing when going into camera, however: The camera does not play back audio upon video playback (That one didn't anyway) so I ended up only monitoring from my H1 backup [usually my primary in my small it] (I was feeding the Scarlet with XLRs which were attenuated and the H1 with the tape out which was not) and told them that I would give the camera proper audio, but because I could not verify that it was there on playback ( so I didn't REALLY know if it was getting onto the camera at all even though the meters were going), that I would monitor my H1 and give them those files in case the camera's audio was in fact not recording. It was recording and the audio they used was from it (which they were happy with), but if it wasn't on there they had the backup which I KNEW was clean. My advice, use an H1 out of the tape out for a simultaneous back up.

For your direct question: attenuate the 302 and the Epic levels to get your tone where it needs to be, read the manuals to be able to do this, and monitor from the camera always (even if it is delayed).

Let us know how it goes. Good Luck.

Also: Is that how the show usually works? Why don't you ask the Main Sound Mixer how he does it?

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Yeah, the stock Epic has two balanced or unbalanced 3.5mm TRS jacks on the front of the 'brain' under the lens. Read the manual for the specific set-up procedure and don't expect the cam ops to know anything about it. Beware, the 'audio present' light only means something is 'plugged in', you must acually see the tiny meters registering and hear the auido.

That said, I only send audio to the any RED for reference purposes only. The RED is totally unpredictable and setting's can change each time the camera re-booted. (which is usually quite often).

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" and don't expect the cam ops to know anything about it. "

That would be my clue to also not know anything about it --after all it is their toy, and not my toy-- so 'here is the audio line' if camera wants to do anything with it. >:(

Honestly I disagree with this attitude. It's similar in my mind to camera refusing to deal with tinecode cause they see it as a sound problem. Camera and sound are interfacing with each other for the benefit of production (or post in this case) and need to work together to achieve sync and help each other when they can. Refusing to learn anything about the sound section of a camera makes you look worse, not camera, and it's irrelevant if camera knows anything about it. They can make themselves look unknowledgable all they want, but that's not how I want to be seen on set.

Just my $.02

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Hey guys, thanks for all of the posts and sorry about the late reply. I was unable to hear the audio playback from the red epic, as stated above, i think because of a firmware update or lack there of. I could see the meters on the camera and had attenuated down to mic level on my 302 but was still worried about the actual sound the camera was getting. I ended up just using splitters to run it to camera as well as my Tascam DR-100 just to be safe.

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" The good professional camera people I've worked with know all areas of their cameras. "

The good professional camera people know all areas of their cameras. ::)

" I was unable to hear the audio "

now we are back to absolute basics:

when recording audio, someone should be listening to the audio at the recording device

we cannot be responsible for audio recording we do not make

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Red is aware that the Epic cannot play back audio from the camera (but it's promised in a future upgrade). You can monitor through the camera's headphone output while shooting. There's lots of complaining from users at the moment that Red's RedcineX Pro debayering program -- used to convert R3D files to DPX, Quicktime, or Avid files -- does not play audio at the moment. The sound will play back in most editing programs. But I still caution my clients to only use the camera sound as a scratch track.

Not sure how many of them listen to me, but that's what I tell them...

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