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Sound Report Writer vs. Movie Slate


RPSharman

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SH

"Otherwise, you would be reliant on the hope that the report would travel with the files."

 

Well, it should.....  Personally I have the DIT include the report IN the folder WITH the files.... The report is also emailed to production with orders to have it sent to the editor...

 After all that, if they cant get the report... they are mentally challanged and probably should not be participating in the Motion Picture Games...

All you can do is all you can do....  I really don't want to spoon feed people any further....  Giving them neat, tidy, well laid out data with NO chicken scratch written on sheets of shredded compressed trees.... I think is a huge plus...

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Of course. Report in the same ( daily) folder: 100% agreed.

But then, still, I'd make sure all the info entered in MovSlt has got the same nomenclature as what would be found on the files. I mean exact same file names, scene, takes , etc or at least Tape/Roll number.

All of this * in case* something gets lost or separated.

But I agree babysitting is not part of our job...

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I use Wave Agent for the majority of the stuff I do. I don't think either apps, or any app for that matter (including CL-WiFi!), will both edit the metadata AND give you a sound report, PDF or otherwise. Sound Report Writer was created to replace paper notes. When you write paper notes, you aren't editing any metadata on the recorder. Either way, my reports go into the daily folder on the CF card or through the daily transfer to the DIT. Different scenarios call for different applications.

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I use Wave Agent for the majority of the stuff I do. I don't think either apps, or any app for that matter (including CL-WiFi!), will both edit the metadata AND give you a sound report, PDF or otherwise. Sound Report Writer was created to replace paper notes. When you write paper notes, you aren't editing any metadata on the recorder. Either way, my reports go into the daily folder on the CF card or through the daily transfer to the DIT. Different scenarios call for different applications.

Wave Agent makes a report in pdf and csv which both have their usefulness. And it reflects the real metadata in the files.

I generate both for the CF cards I turn in.

Takes about a minute to do it.

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>I don't think either apps, or any app for that matter (including CL-WiFi!), will both edit the metadata AND give you a sound report, PDF or otherwise<

I'm away from my machine so I cannot check, but I believe I can edit the metadata of at least 10 of the previous takes.

It will edit the metadata, but what I'm saying there is no single-unit solution to produce a PDF. The CL-Wifi will not produce a sound report, that's Wave Agent (laptop).

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from the 788t v2:19 manual p 78

                 

 

Generating Sound Reports

                    

A sound report can be generated for all the files in any folder on the 788T. There are two methods
for creating a sound report. Each method will create a CSV file named SOUND_REPORT.CSV in the
target folder.


                    

To generate a sound report in the current recording folder on all media, simultaneously press the
STOP and MENU buttons. A message will appear indicating that the reports are being created, fol-
lowed by a message indicating that the reports were created successfully. Push the TONE button to
accept this. 

 
            

        
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Yes, the 788T will generate a CSV sound report, as will the Zaxcom recorders. I'm curious how many mixers use CSV reports. Seems like you leave too much to chance on whomever is looking at it (what program they use to open it and how that program interprets the fields). A flaw in the in-system reports that I've recently learned is that you can't create a daily report if you are using scene folders. It will only create a report of files in folders, not files within folders of folders. Just an observation. I think we can all agree that the ultimate tool would be for the recorder to generate a PDF, but there are many obstacles in doing so. Hey, there's Magic Lantern out there for cameras. Maybe it's time someone hacked the audio recording market.

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Yes, the 788T will generate a CSV sound report, as will the Zaxcom recorders. I'm curious how many mixers use CSV reports. Seems like you leave too much to chance on whomever is looking at it (what program they use to open it and how that program interprets the fields). A flaw in the in-system reports that I've recently learned is that you can't create a daily report if you are using scene folders. It will only create a report of files in folders, not files within folders of folders. Just an observation. I think we can all agree that the ultimate tool would be for the recorder to generate a PDF, but there are many obstacles in doing so. Hey, there's Magic Lantern out there for cameras. Maybe it's time someone hacked the audio recording market.
I use CSV reports form my nomad Regards Chris W
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I do both a pdf and a csv as they both have their usefulness via Wave Agent at the end of the day.

A printed version goes with the CF card that has both both versions of the report.

The report reflects the info on the files not making this a 2 part endeavor with a report AND the files potentially not having the exact same info.

The reports also live on a shared dropbox folder where the reports from all days/episodes also live.

 

In totality it takes me 2 minutes from card ejection to full printed report and packaging for post.

Post very much appreciates this and it really doesn't  take that much to make things better for the folks down the line.

 

Scott Harber

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I personally find apps(MovieSlate) for writing sound reports useful, for several reasons. I've been using digital reports since designing, with help from others, my own on Boom Recorder. I hated having to photocopy several reports at the end of the day, or white-out several sheets of ply when making an error in the report. I have more note information I can put into the report, using the app. The Deva only allows for so many characters, and it's never enough. Yes, often, there is plenty of room for a simple one or two word description. But sometimes, I find it hard to tell the whole story about how our department is getting boned on a shot. With MovieSlate, you can take photos of said "issues" preventing you from capturing your best sound, and attach it to the report, to the exact shot, with a link that opens up the photo. Also, soon to come, awesome color coding that allows your notes to pop out and catch the editors eye. Also, I've gone to post production in the past, and discussed the shows progress in relationship to sound, and found that the sound editors didn't get my notes!!! What?!? (I won't get into the fact that they never asked for them either, different gripe, altogether) Now, everyone gets an emailed copy, everyday, of every sound roll, AND it's all copied into the master drive, into their respected folder. I think that someday, metadata info will trigger changes to the devices keeping the reports, and I'll be happy to embrace that change. Using the apps, also allows me to check over scene info and notes with Script, without having them get out of their chair or off set. They seem to really enjoy that!

 

My 2 pennies!

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Movie Slate has improved many things for the productions I've used it on. Paper reports will soon go the way of the 1/4" tape, and for better reasons. For one, within seconds of calling wrap on my current show, 14 people around the world have the sound reports in more readable detail that paper reports have ever provided. No more tearing, collating, and stapling 4-part carbon copies at the end of each film break. Movie Slate also gives me instant access to all the details of any day's work of the last two years from a single device (iPad); much faster and much more conveniently than multiple 3-ring binders of paper reports ever could.

 

gt

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Movie Slate has improved many things for the productions I've used it on. Paper reports will soon go the way of the 1/4" tape, and for better reasons. For one, within seconds of calling wrap on my current show, 14 people around the world have the sound reports in more readable detail that paper reports have ever provided. No more tearing, collating, and stapling 4-part carbon copies at the end of each film break. Movie Slate also gives me instant access to all the details of any day's work of the last two years from a single device (iPad); much faster and much more conveniently than multiple 3-ring binders of paper reports ever could.

 

gt

 

Just having my first sip of coffee with JW (first news stop of the day) and your comment about the 3-ring binder struck me, Glen.

 

First thought was that the 3-ring would be one thing post might miss.

 

Now I've had a 2nd and 3rd sip, recall that digital reports are searchable. Tradeoff. Nevermind.

 

But then, an idea: all the sound reports from a project gathered in a digital, searchable 3-ring rather than spread out among the various folders...

 

And then, realize I've no idea whether the post geniuses don't already do such a thing.

 

Bottom line as I brew the 2nd cup: do post folks have a digital 3-ring and if not, can we provide that for them as easily as we provide them with the comprehensive audio drive at the end of the project? 

 

Seems like lots of users gather the reports in a Dropbox or similar cloud-like delivery system. Easy enough to drag and drop from there. Is there something further we could do, like make them into one document? Spitballing...

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Metadata on the recorder is vital and of course should still be done regardless of what method is being used for sound report. That is why we are all pushing for a couple of things: it would be great if the recorder could interface seamlessly with MovieSlate (or some external software/device) so that metadata could be entered in one place and be distributed many places, including generating a sound report that has potentially the most info about the shoot. I know people are going to tell me that other recorders (not my Deva) already do all these wonderful things with metadata and sound reports, but it just isn't true. I firmly believe that the recorder should put only the necessary and relevant metadata in the sound file --- I would not want to use the recorder, even with a keyboard, to contain all the other "metadata" that people might want to put in (lengthy notes, microphones used, location conditions, how many company moves that day, etc.).

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Well, is anyone importing their CSV's from their recorder into Movie-Slate at the end of each day? I've seen the option but I've never actually done it.

 

I'd be curious to see what's the result. You probably can render in PDF but also in all those formats that figure on their website ?

Does it deal well with all the metadata from all the manufacturers ?  (I guess CSV is an industry standard so probably working ok)

Yes  I agree with Jeff mics used, locations, etc are superfluous so there might be a way to select what we wish to actually appear on the report in the end, a little like in Wave Agent (check-uncheck) ..?

Gotta have a look back at their website; ironically, I think the ''paperless'' report idea has some merits but I'm bugged by not being able to actually print the manual so I can underline, make notes, etc...

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I'd be curious to see what's the result. You probably can render in PDF but also in all those formats that figure on their website ?

Does it deal well with all the metadata from all the manufacturers ?  (I guess CSV is an industry standard so probably working ok)

I've tested the .csv import into MovieSlate, and you have to reformat your .csv from the recorder to their format . A lot of copy and paste, and not all info from all the recorders are laid out the same, so it's several copy and pastes. Let alone, getting the report to your computer and then emailing it to your device running MovieSlate. This is more trouble then it's worth. If your recorder provides a .csv, the best bet is to just set up macros in a spreadsheet software and run them to format what your particular machine spits out.

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Metadata on the recorder is vital and of course should still be done regardless of what method is being used for sound report. That is why we are all pushing for a couple of things: it would be great if the recorder could interface seamlessly with MovieSlate (or some external software/device) so that metadata could be entered in one place and be distributed many places, including generating a sound report that has potentially the most info about the shoot. I know people are going to tell me that other recorders (not my Deva) already do all these wonderful things with metadata and sound reports, but it just isn't true. I firmly believe that the recorder should put only the necessary and relevant metadata in the sound file --- I would not want to use the recorder, even with a keyboard, to contain all the other "metadata" that people might want to put in (lengthy notes, microphones used, location conditions, how many company moves that day, etc.).

I completely don't see the point of making a report that doesn't enter the metadata onto the files recorded. There is a huge assumption that post will want to go back and look at the reports that aren't tied to the files. I'd hate that myself if I had the option of having that info integrated in my project rather than going back and forth between a report and my project.

 

Aaton had metadata entry and reporting going in 2006 on a pda and Sound Devices has been doing it for years as well. Movie slate and sound reporter look cool but all that info doesn't go anywhere other than a file that isn't part of the audio. At this point you would be double entering tracks/Sc/Tk/notes or...making a file that everyone down the line will have to refer to rather than embedding this info in the recorded audio files.

Useful to me is a single point of entry for metadata and sound report generation on a machine that will generate it's own report or allow the metadata to be used in making a report. If the Movie Slate or Sound Reporter did that I'd get on board but that seems a ways off but...if they could integrate with the Devas that would be huge.

This issue has been sorted out for a few years. The only thing that's changed for me has been integrating dropbox for the folks down the line. I make a folder with the project/episode/and all sound reports for that episode in that folder. Very easy to do and it works very well. In it there is the pdf and csv report for each roll.

 

Many ways to skin this cat but now I can send folks a report from my phone or laptop or anyones computer.

 

Scott Harber

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"Movie slate and sound reporter look cool but all that info doesn't go anywhere other than a file that isn't part of the audio. At this point you would be double entering tracks/Sc/Tk/notes or...making a file that everyone down the line will have to refer to rather than embedding this info in the recorded audio files.

Useful to me is a single point of entry for metadata and sound report generation on a machine that will generate it's own report or allow the metadata to be used in making a report."
 
I agree with you on this, what you have stated IS the goal: enter data once and it goes seamlessly to all the places it needs to go. Whether the recorder can be the initiator of this or some other outboard device (like MovieSlate) that talks to the pother devices, either way, that is the goal. In also agree that we are still a ways off on this happening.
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