Multiple mics on boom: cs3e and Schoeps 641

[Tom Morrow]

For a couple of film shoots I've been using two microphones on my boom at the same time:

1. A sanken cs-3e for when I'm only covering a single actor's dialog.

2. A Schoeps 641 for when I'm covering more than one actor's dialog.

I'm curious to hear from others who also do this sort of thing... You can see in the picture that my means for attaching these is pretty kludgy, although it works. I'm wondering if there are clips that I can buy to clip the two mics to each other or other better ways of attaching.

Also, the weight seems to cause my Lyre suspension to sag a bit and not be as effective at isolating boom handling noise. Also, I probably should be using a small-diameter pigtail.

Which brings me to wiring... I'm thinking of getting some kind of stereo cable whether it's 5-pin XLR or dual 3-pin XLRs on each end. Dealing with multiple cables is awkward.

[VASI]

Νο

[Tom Morrow]

What I love about this setup is being ready to go for any scene the director wants to do, rather than having to get different equipment set up for different scenes.

I wonder if eventually we will get "focus-free" mics like the lytro camera, where you can adjust the polar pattern of the raw-captured sound in post-production. The cs3e mic already has three cardioid capsules inside it; it would be cool to have a switch on the electronics to get the sound out of one or two of the capsules (wider polar pattern) rather than the narrow pattern from all three.

[taylormadeaudio]

good lord.

[VASI]

You need one or two boom operators. This is no solution dude with adhesive tapes etc.

[Dan Ostroff]

Just get Ambient's quick release...

(null)

[Jon Gilbert]

I'd be embarrassed to use that!

I find it amusing you're surprised that the Lyre suspension is struggling to work properly!

[Jeff Wexler]

This is the weirdest "solution" to a problem (which I don't think exists) I have ever seen. I like to have an open mind to new ideas but this is a stretch. Seems to me this is a bad idea all around. One simple reason to NOT do this: by placing these 2 directional microphones in such close proximity to each other, you have seriously altered the very design principle the mic uses to achieve a coherent polar pattern. I could go on and on, pointing out so many other valid reasons to abandon this idea, but I won't.

[VM]

You need this :

It's not very expensive.

http://www.pilotefilms.com/detail.php/Broadcast/RYCOTE/Bonnette-Anti-Vent/accessoire/clips/PFRCLIPSTEREO

Usually I know which mic I want on my boom, but why not using two mics if it does not bother you to boom correctly.

[taylormadeaudio]

um...

wow...

just... wow...

yeah...

[Joshua Anderson]

This is the weirdest "solution" to a problem (which I don't think exists) I have ever seen. I like to have an open mind to new ideas but this is a stretch. Seems to me this is a bad idea all around. One simple reason to NOT do this: by placing these 2 directional microphones in such close proximity to each other, you have seriously altered the very design principle the mic uses to achieve a coherent polar pattern. I could go on and on, pointing out so many other valid reasons to abandon this idea, but I won't.

Jeff's right about how this would alter the pattern.

I think the "problem" you (tmorrowus) might be having is that you're not happy with the booming technique when using the Sanken on more than one speaker. If you're relying on the Schoeps to have a "wider" pattern and pickup a 2 person conversation, I think it means you're not doing a good job of following the dialogue and cueing with the Sanken. If you are using the Sanken for single actor coverage, then it sounds like you prefer the sound of the Sanken mic over the Schoeps (which is fine). If that's the case, the solution isn't to tape a different mic option to it, but to get used to swinging and cueing the Sanken when covering more than one speaker.

[soundtrane]

first of all, why a cs3e WITH a schoeps

are you shooting indoors and outdoors at the same time??

you dont have the time to switch mics?

oh man...

[ccsnd]

Don't they hit each other when you move the pole?

[jrd456]

Please don't do this--it's wrong in so many ways--Why?

J.D.

[Sean ONeil]

Whoa, whoa, whoaaaaaaaa everybody . . . get off of your Brazilian Cherry apple boxes, put down your torches and pitchforks and simmer down. In the meantime, I'm going to try and remove the image out of my brain of those two beautiful microphones gaffer taped together, and try to think of something positive to say.

Ummmm . . . well . . . , errrr, ... ummm, ... howabout, . . . stay with me on this one, I'm spitballing here, . . . um . . . if it sounds good, it sounds good?

Cheers,

Sean O'Neil

Brooklyn New York

[Derek H]

Might be fun for a few minutes to be able to A/B the two mics and listen to the differences. Wouldn't want to actually work like that though.

[Max Hirtenstein]

scene calls for two booms, quick, untape those mics!

[Philip Perkins]

Let him experiment. Maybe he'll discover something. I'd recommend getting the mics into an over/under config, instead of "sidecar"--easier on your suspensions.

phil p

[VASI]

scene calls for two booms, quick, untape those mics!

[VM]

If you're relying on the Schoeps to have a "wider" pattern and pickup a 2 person conversation, I think it means you're not doing a good job of following the dialogue and cueing with the Sanken

+1, don't forget to move the boom....

Let him experiment. Maybe he'll discover something.

+1

[olphi]

Maybe you could add a CMC8 if M/S is required, a dynamic Beyer M58 in case of high level recordings and a surround mic for the post production :-).More seriously, use a ambient quick lock, very easy to swap microphones.

[VM]

If you absolutely want to choose the mic's directivity in post you can also use Schoeps Polarflex. But there is still no windshield

On post you can choose your directivity with a plug in. (between omni and figure of eight, no shotgun)

http://www.schoeps.de/en/products/categories/polarflex

[jozzafunk]

Or you could do something like this - notice the name

http://theicu.wordpress.com/2010/01/06/canon-5d-mark-ii-helmet-mount/

[Olle Sjostrom]

I like new inventions. But I'm a bit skeptical to this I must admit. Just the thought of those two windshields rubbing against each other, the tape flexing, the weight distribution in the Zepp... wow, watch your back there.

I have thought of the idea to have a M/S mount in a zepp on doco shoots (like the CMIT and CCM8) just to be able to swiftly record stereo ambs. It would be possible with that Schoeps mount, but I'm not sure about the necessity of it, since it would require me to have a pole with a stereo coiled cable in it and whatnot... Too much work for that one little improvement, that can be easily overcome by just having one extra mic in a zepp ready to go up fast.

I'm not bashing on your invention, if it works for you and it gets you jobs, why not eh?

This also reminds me of the behind the scenes of the movie "Elephant" (Gus van Sant), they recorded the dialog in M/S didn't they? I remember seeing a really odd mic combo in a short clip on the DVD... And then later on they went with mono anyway in the mix.. Gus had some idea it would sound great in stereo but he realized dialog just sounded weird...

[soundslikejustin]

Sound field mics (Ambisonics) allows you to choose the polar pattern in post, too. But I wouldn't want to be the one swinging it on the end of the boom, or dealing with the 4 channel cable that comes off it.