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Surround encoder for PT10 native?


jgbsound
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So I have a project coming up in a few months (probably more like 6), that will require at least a 5.1 surround mix.  

 

I have Protools 10 native with the Complete Production Toolkit unlocked.

 

I want to be able to encode the data stream for a blu ray and for a DVD as well.

 

I see a bunch of encoders such as

DTS encoder, Neyrinck Soundcode for DTS, Neyrinck Soundcode for Dolby E, etc. 

 

 

Bear in mind I know very little about the plugin I need to select (I have only done limited surround mixing in my past.

 
Thanks for any suggestions you can give me.
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No space isn't an issue.  I guess I thought that you needed the encoder to actually create the datastreams. Am I wrong?  If PCMs are the way to go, what's the workflow for creating that?  

 

Is is a simple as creating stems for each audio channel (Lft, Rt, Cen Sub LSurr RSurr ?

 

Forgive my ignorance but what's the advantage of using something like DTS then?

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I think this would be a better discussion on the Gearslutz Forum's Post section, or on Avid's on Digidesign User Conference.

 

Rich Tozzoli's book Pro Tools Surround Mixing goes into this in a lot more detail, though it has not yet been updated for PT10. The textbook on Pro Tools Advanced Post-Production Techniques also covers it, but it's an expensive book ($50). 

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I think this would be a better discussion on the Gearslutz Forum's Post section, or on Avid's on Digidesign User Conference.

 

Rich Tozzoli's book Pro Tools Surround Mixing goes into this in a lot more detail, though it has not yet been updated for PT10. The textbook on Pro Tools Advanced Post-Production Techniques also covers it, but it's an expensive book ($50). 

 

Probably so, but this is the post place on JW and there as a lot of post guys floating around here.

 

But what Marc said is right. It would be as simple as bouncing or rerecording your mix. if you have questions about exporting and authoring you would be a lot better served on the DUC.

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Use the raw PCM on the Bluray, and an ac3 on the DVD. You can even make AC3 files from the PCM with Apples' Compressor app.

 

The currently available Blu-ray authoring software feels like trying to make DVDs did 10-15 years ago. I haven't found affordable Blu-ray software that will author discs with PCM uncompressed 5.1 audio. I make lossless DTS-HD MA files as Adobe's Encore will take those.

 

Compressor, Neyrinck, etc produce lossy, legacy Dolby Digital AC3 files that have audible artifacts from the data compression.

 

As far as the OP, I've only ever used the Pro Control surround panners. You should look on Avid's site as I know they list 3rd party panners.

 

Mark O.

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The currently available Blu-ray authoring software feels like trying to make DVDs did 10-15 years ago. I haven't found affordable Blu-ray software that will author discs with PCM uncompressed 5.1 audio. I make lossless DTS-HD MA files as Adobe's Encore will take those.

Compressor, Neyrinck, etc produce lossy, legacy Dolby Digital AC3 files that have audible artifacts from the data compression.

As far as the OP, I've only ever used the Pro Control surround panners. You should look on Avid's site as I know they list 3rd party panners.

Mark O.

What would you suggest for the DVD files then?

An in terms of surround panners, NOTHING beats Spanner by Maggot Software.

http://www.maggot.co.nz/software/spanner.shtml

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Why steer people away form this site, especially to vastly inferior ones? I learn from these questions and answers.

 

Oh, I dunno. I've seen some tremendously helpful info on Gearslutz and the DUC, specifically on surround mixing and so on. I think in the case of Blu-ray authoring, I think this is a specialized area far beyond normal sound mixing, since the picture and sound have to be muxed together within an actual authoring program. 

 

I think the best advice for JGB would be to find out where this Blu-ray disc is going. Is this for a film festival? Viewing copies for clients or potential distributors? Or is this a final disc to be sold in stores or online? If it's just a reference disc, I think just a regular stereo mix would be fine, even for festivals. They may actually require a DCP, which is a whole separate mastering pass, requiring a finished set of picture and 5.1 or 7.1 WAV files. I'm not a fan of people doing their own DCPs -- I think it makes more sense to hire a company that does this (inexpensively), so you can actually go over there and see what it'll look like on a DCI-certified projector.

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What would you suggest for the DVD files then?

An in terms of surround panners, NOTHING beats Spanner by Maggot Software.

http://www.maggot.co.nz/software/spanner.shtml

As DVD can only contain stereo PCM, Dolby Digital, or DTS, I'd use stereo if the original audio is 2.0 and Dolby Digital or DTS if it's 5.1. Blu-ray allows PCM up to 7.1, but no affordable authoring software currently offers that option. DTS-HD MA is a great alternative.

 

Yes, I was talking about hardware surround panners. I just realized the OP wasn't asking about surround panning, but it is a relative topic. I've never used a plugin for panning, though I suspect the people at Maggot know what they are doing. Hardware panners make it very easy to pan and you can still go in and tweak the automation points.

 

Mark O.

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Thanks for everyones input! All this has helped me to understand that my desire to create the surround mix may actually not what I need to focus on at this time.

As Marc W had mentioned and i had came to realize early on is that a stereo mix would be best for the festival mix mainly because I have no way of knowing what kind of playback systems will be encountered in the different festival venues.

I had planned to do a 5.1 for the distributed release (I don't think this will get a large theatrical release) though I have several months before that will come up. I hadn't really thought past that point to be honest.

As others have suggested, just outputting the 5.1 stems (Lft, Rt, Cen, LSurr, RSurr, LFE) will do for now. I'll also check out the surround books mentioned too.

John

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