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Lavalier mics with low ambient noise


RogerBansemer

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Mike,

Let me explain this really carefully. When people here refer to a mic "reducing ambient noise" they are simply using shorthand-speak for "reducing the amount of ambient noise that the mic picks up relative to the desired sound."

Surprisingly, most people here understand that. Then there are those who choose to derail the conversation with the nit-picking of literal minutiae.

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Surprisingly, most people here understand that.

Thank you, John, I was beginning to wonder about that.

 

Senator, you have demonstrated how skillful you are at using the internet by finding out all those names and manufacturers of dynamic lav mics. Now that John has told me about this thing, "The Internet", I think I (and others) may have been able to achieve that myself. The question, however, was of personal experience with said microphones. I would be very interested in any reports on how well or not they work, from you and others

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" The question, however, was of personal experience with said microphones. "

once upon ca time, they were about all that there was, and they did the job fine, though bigger in size...

when newer smaller mic's came around, we began using them, and in the USA, they quickly replaced "desk" and boom microphones for newsreaders and other uses...mostly due to size, not sound...

to this day I still have some of them, and at least Shure still makes one, and I periodically find them useful tools.

Dynamic mic's are typically less sensitive, and tend to seem tighter, and thus seem to have less ambiance in their sound, though some prefer this, others do not.  obviously (isn't it) they are not as convenient for hiding, or as unobtrusive visually...

also typically the dynamic lav's do not have as wide a frequency response, which is helpful, even preferred in some circumstances,  and not in others.

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A close female friend who, over the years, has helped enlighten me greatly about how the world interacts with women, made a point once that has stuck with me and continues to inform my viewpoint.

We were discussing competence and its relationship to a level playing field. I had pointed out many competent women I knew who were making their way quite well in the world. That's when she hit me with it: It will never be a level playing field until women are allowed the latitude to be as incompetent as men are.

Think about that.

I rail at the thought of incompetence, but her point was made. She wasn't saying men are inherently incompetent, she was saying a man can be mediocre in this world and still be accepted, whereas, a woman would often need to excel to achieve acceptance as an equal -- and, quite frankly, that isn't equal.

So, with great respect for the good intention voiced above, it's a disservice to view the thread from a gender perspective, which then serves to set the expectation that women mustn't be as dumb and annoying as us men.

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So, with great respect for the good intention voiced above, it's a disservice to view the thread from a gender perspective, which then serves to set the expectation that women mustn't be as dumb and annoying as us men.

 

Especially when we are all (myself included) still conflating the terms gender, sex, and even (sometimes) sexuality.

The quagmire of culture, and the sublime object of ideology is nothing to sneeze at.

...salud!

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So, with great respect for the good intention voiced above, it's a disservice to view the thread from a gender perspective, which then serves to set the expectation that women mustn't be as dumb and annoying as us men.

 

I'd prefer to view it the other way round: the men here should try to be as smart and sensible as the women on this board (see post #38, for example). That would result in much less annoying chest beating posts.

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I heartily agree with setting the best among us as role models. A common phrase made toward that goal is, "I wanna be ____ when I grow up," filling in the blank with the name of someone setting a positive example. The important takeaway from what I wrote earlier is that the person should be chosen strictly as an individual, without regard to gender.

The point therefore, as in post #38 that was referenced, I don't credit Jan's gender for her being the nifty person she is, The credit goes to Jan.

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" The question, however, was of personal experience with said microphones. "

once upon ca time, they were about all that there was, and they did the job fine, though bigger in size...

when newer smaller mic's came around, we began using them, and in the USA, they quickly replaced "desk" and boom microphones for newsreaders and other uses...mostly due to size, not sound...

to this day I still have some of them, and at least Shure still makes one, and I periodically find them useful tools.

Dynamic mic's are typically less sensitive, and tend to seem tighter, and thus seem to have less ambiance in their sound, though some prefer this, others do not. obviously (isn't it) they are not as convenient for hiding, or as unobtrusive visually...

also typically the dynamic lav's do not have as wide a frequency response, which is helpful, even preferred in some circumstances, and not in others.

Thank you, Senator. That wasn't too difficult, now, was it? I still would have liked more of a personal account and less of a lecture, but that's fine. But maybe tying it in to the OPs original quest? That'd be great! Then maybe Roger, although maybe not willing to post here anymore, would have taken something away from this thread, other than feeling insulted (whether justly so or not).

An others too, who may be in a similat situation

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" a personal account "

condenser mic's, which have active electronics also have a noise figure for those circuits.

I suspect that asking about a lav mic, which are mostly condensers, with "lower ambient noise" would be a question of this noise floor.

Also, mic's timbre is often discussed in terms like open, tight, airy, close, etc. etc.

Dynamic mic's, which generate their own electricity, also are subject to signal to noise floor considerations...

personally, trial and error, resulting in experience are major factors in mic selections, which are subjective, and a bit personal......

and it takes years of experience to get years of experience.

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Senator, I am disappointed. You clearly either haven't read the post #1 und thus don't understand what this entire thread is about, or you are so hung up on the literal meaning of the words that you are unable to try to understand what the OP was actually asking. Please, for homework, read post #1 again and then report back. Or just admit that you don't actually care to help others or that you don't have anything of relevance to say about dynamic lav mics. I mean of relevance to this thread.

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Have you guys seen that directional 'gun mic' lav made by DPA?

I haven't tried it yet but it looks interesting (if the talent is doing a piece to camera without headturns).

Simon,

Are you referring to the 4080/4081?

I have used those because they were the only wired Lav that we had that I could get my hands on last minute. They are ok. They don't sound like the other Lavs they make, 4060s and 4070s. They are very directional and I could see them being great in a news situation but location recording not so much. Plus you can't hide them easily because of how they mount to the clip. I took the windscreen off of one and it literally looks like a mini shotgun.

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"as I remember, the 50 was silver and the 55 was black"

The ECM-55 is (or was) available in silver ( ECM-55S), though I've never actually seen one in person.

 - Shure's dynamic Lav is the SM11, I've used them for S/FX in automotive engine compartments.. low sensitivity, typical of a dynamic.

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Flipped on PBS just now, and what do you know, your show was on. Watched you paint a sweet farm shed, well done. However I don't believe I ever saw the left side of your face, so I'm not sure why you're against a head worn mic like the ones recommended several times. And I still can't believe that a show on a major broadcast network was done pro bono; sets a bad precedent for those of us trying to make a living with TV work...

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I need to use a lavalier mike and we have two. One omni directional and one lavalier. Both sennheisser. :wacko:
 

I recently was told that an "un-sensitive" mike is what I need. I was not familiar with this term. :blink:

Can anyone begin to clarify this and give me some suggestions as to what we might use.

I didn't know it but apparently the mics come rated as -20db, -40db, etc.

I'd sure like to get a mic that will suit us better so we won't constantly have to deal with so much post audio trying to get rid of unwanted sounds.

 

I do not understand clearly the first statement (he has two lavilier mic's, one an omni-directional and the other a lav...

I do not recall the term "un-sensitive microphone", but extrapolate that one would reduce the output of everything...

What the OP seems to desire to do is increase the ratio of signal (his voice) to noise (everything else), but he has rejected the easiest, and probably best way to do this (a head-worn mic)

 


 

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<br /><br />I do not understand clearly the first statement (he has two lavilier mic's, one an omni-directional and the other a lav...<br />I do not recall the term "un-sensitive microphone", but extrapolate that one would reduce the output of everything...<br />What the OP seems to desire to do is increase the ratio of signal (his voice) to noise (everything else), but he has rejected the easiest, and probably best way to do this (a head-worn mic)<br /><br />

Your conclusion is correct, which is why a lot of posters were trying to help him by pointing out to him that what he deemed to be an unsuitable solution might be the best way after all, and why others tried to find a viable alternative. Help should not be denied just because he rejected one popular idea.<br />One could deduce, Senator, from your previous replies that you think only audio professionals who are savvy of all the correct audio terminology (and will invariably use only the correctest of phrasings) are worthy of a helpful, respectful reply. Newbies not welcome in your classroom? Please say it isn't so
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I remember coming across a soundies blog where AT899 omni lav was best for room reflections..maybe it's good for ambient. I had one and thought it good for roomreflections but higher noise floor (than an ECM88) in quiet interviews.

 

(Keep in mind.. the spec sheets and polar patterns don't tell the story in terms of perceived reach, sensitivity. and any number of other qualities)

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