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Yamaha LS9 to HD-P2 to SD664?


Robert Buncher

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I need a little help here.

 

I never work music stuff but have a job this weekend taking a mix from an LS9.

For most of the day leading up to the concert I will be using my 664 to get interviews and run and gun stuff. My question concerns the concert.

 

I need to take a stereo mix from the LS9. I am waiting for a call back from the sound guy at the venue but right now I am hoping to be able to tap the stereo mix out.

I believe the LS9 mix out is SPIDIF (IEC 60958, according to the LS9 manual).  The #1 input of the 664 is AES3 and, according to SD tech support, may or may not work with the SPIDIF . It is a hit or miss situation. Has anyone had experience with running SPIDIP to the 664?

 

I do have an HD-P2 that has a SPIDIF input.  Can I just run an RCA cable from the LS9 Mix out to the SPIDIF input of the HD-P2. Would that give me the stereo mix.  If so I could then output that to my 664 to record everything on the same card and as a backup.

 

Is this a good workflow? Any suggestions?

 

Thanks,

Bob

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Just ask the sound guy to give you a couple of Omni outputs configured as the main program.  Analog of course.  Sometimes I will also use a wireless hop, so that I can of course get the feed wherever I'm at, but also, some live engineers don't like you hot patching into their board during the middle of a show.

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You may consider just bringing a thumb drive. The LS-9 can record to connected USB media in high res mp3 and I think .wav formats.  Then you're free to roam around and capture other stuff just sync it later off a snare hit or something.  

 

 

Going the analog output route:

LS-9 16 has 8 Omni outputs, LS-9 32 has 16.  

If he's using the 16 input version, he likely isn't also running 6 monitor mixes in addition to the mains outputs.  He should have two available, I would sure hope.  

Output configuration is really intuitive and I've found that the output stage of that console is really well designed.  You shouldn't have any problems.  

 

 

SPDIF route:

I've used the Hosa SPDIF to AES adapter to record the main mix on a recorder many times.  The only thing to watch out for if you're going to connect digitally is that most guys use the 44.1khz sample rate on the music desks rather than the 48k that we usually use. 

 

 

 

Yes usually the mix outputs in most systems are "stereo" though there's not much use for it in my opinion.  When I mix live, I usually only pan toms, overheads, and keyboards.  Certainly not main elements like guitars, bass and vocals.  Also I think it is technically "stereo" because you're creating a spacial relationship even if only for about 5 seats in the venue right in the middle.   ;)

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Thanks Crussell.

 

Interesting about the thumb drive. I don't think i can go that way as they are syncing the 2 5Ds to my sound with a smart slate. Not really sure about every detail as it is an out of town company, trying to get more info.

 

Senator, I could be wrong, but i think the client wants more than a mono mix so they can play with it later. As I said, I may be wrong, and i await more information from them.

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I know very few love engineers that don't at least pan drums and keys.

The LS-9 also has a card slot that can get you direct outputs for all 16 channels or 32 if you want to multitrack it or pull stems. I have 3 ADAT optical cards in my M7, routing is very straightforward.

There are options for days on these newer Yahama live desks.

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" There are options for days on these newer Yahama live desks. "

agreed, if the FOH mixers is willing...

For sure. If you needed a feed off my desk, I'd be honored to assist but I recognize that most FOH guys aren't location audio guys as a day job.  Diplomacy is key. 

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Well the shoot was over the weekend and went just fine.

 

The FOH guy was very cool and gave me two analog outs. He mixes the house in stereo so that is what I got.

It could not have been easier.

 

I tend to over think some jobs but I know the more I prepare the better I do.

I also sometimes find that, when I ask a question, not only do I get the answer I need but also the revelation that my ignorance is much greater than I imagined.

 

Thanks for your replies.

Bob

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The issue with stereo in live concerts is that this means every single person sitting in different parts of the arena will hear a completely different balance, particularly if they're sitting far off to one side. If the live concert is mixed in mono, then at least you can guarantee everybody will more or less hear the same thing.

 

There have been some spectacular exceptions to this, most notably the Beatles: Love show at the Mirage in Las Vegas, which I think is either in 16 channels or 32 channels, not sure. They had to add hundreds of extra speakers actually within each row of audience seating in addition to the ceiling and the walls of the theater, and I think it took months to get this right. I don't think multitrack is possible with a travelling show that goes to different venues every few days. 

 

I can imagine that a very relatively stereo FOH mix without hard-panned instruments might work for most of the audience, some of the time.

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I mix live a fair amount, and we only do mono mixes in the venues I work. There are multiple feeds to the different speaker clusters, that could be run in stereo, but the mix is mono. In wide rooms there isn't any point to mix in stereo due to the fact that only the people sitting in the booth would be able to hear it, and everyone else would receive a subpar mix.



Apparently Marc and I were writing at the same time.

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Meyer Sound's education department has been encouraging engineers to think in more mono terms. Buford Jones is one of their staff, if you ever get the opportunity to hear his talk on live sound mixing philosophy you simply must. He has been very important to my development as an engineer.

http://www.meyersound.com/about/people/buford_jones/

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The last show that I recorded that was mixed on an ls9 was in a relatively small room, in that it holds 500 seated and 1000 standing. We used an mkh 40 on a boom pole that was gaffed to a mic stand in front of the booth to get the mic high above the crowd. In a room this small a drumset and some of the other instruments carry enough of their own sound from the stage, that they are dialed way back in the system mix. If we had just taken a board tap, then we would have ended up with a strange mix. This way we were able to get a great recording of the actual live mix without having to create a custom mix matrix from the FOH board, and with the mic that high, we avoided pretty much all of the crowd noise except for applause.

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Howiecreate is right on this, you should listen carefully the live mix getting out the ls9 and maybe try to be there for the soundcheck.

has a retire live soundman, depending on a loud instrument are on stage, what you will listen out of a LS9 will not be as what you hear live.

Sometime when the bass player came whit is 8x10 inch cab, you don't need bass in you're mix, cause is all ready too much in the room,I seen that before  :) So pulling a mic, taking signal of the Ls9 and making you're own mix on the 664, can be a good choice .

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