Camera Hopping - Personal, up to date, experiences - Thanks

[RPSharman]

Hello,

 

I am curious what people are using for sending audio to camera, both in a "scratch track" capacity and a "professional" capacity.  Obvously I am aware of the various choices from Zaxcom and Lectro for L/R and mono, and other choices from Sennheiser and Comtek - but I would like to know what everyone is personally using.  Are the choices personal, or are there expectations from production?

 

It would be nice to see some pictures for mounting to various kinds of cameras in the least obtrusive way possible.

 

I have honestly almost NEVER run wireless sound to camera, except for a few days on a couple of RED ONE shows some years back.  One show was having issues with RFI (Comteks), but were syncing my audio on set anyway, so I just stopped.  The other broke 2 Comteks in 2 days, and nobody was listening anyway, so I again just stopped.  The only other times I ran audio were on shorts, and I ran a cable.  It has always been easy to talk production out of it, by telling them it would cost more, and that it's typical to sync producion audio before any editing takes place.  The DP also is on board with not attaching stuff to camera.

 

But since it seems rather common, in commercials especially, and might become more common, I am looking into options.

 

Thanks,

 

Robert

[jason porter]

Zaxcom for me.

The Lectro Sr receiver has gained a lot of popularity up here in Toronto. I know a few guys who dumped their Zaxcoms for Lectros for various reasons.

If you are just looking for a mono scratchtrack, a Sennheiser G2/3 or Lectro UCR100/LM tx are nice and small and reliable.

[Jack Norflus]

I am using Zaxcom QRX100.

For cameras without a power tap I will use these batteries:

http://www.all-battery.com/li-ion18650148v2600mahrechargeablebatterypackpcbprotectionwith22awgbareleads.aspx

And for cameras that don't have a mounting plate I use this:

http://www.rycote.com/products/wireless_receiver_camera_bracket/

 

I will take a photo when I have a chance.

 

I also have Zaxcom ERX receivers that I use to send a scratch track and or TC.

[Philip Perkins]

HiFi: Lectro SR+2 LMA--very happy with.  SR almost always with its own L mount batt.

 

Scratch: (re 5D, 7D, RED, Epic, Alexa, C300, EX3 and etc etc etc):  Senn G2s . Plenty good enough, easy to mount and interface.

 

TC: SBT and/or Lockits, SB2a; thinking about a TC Bud.

 

philp

[MatthewFreedAudio]

My personal kit is all Zaxcom so I have a 900AA/STA100 for the Tx and a couple 900S units for the receivers. Those go on real cameras (not DSLR) or when that audio is primary. DSLR cameras get either a Zaxcom ERXTCD or nothing at all. The show I'm working on this year all gear was provided by the production company. We have a couple Lectro UM400a transmitters for L/R and SRb5p receivers on all the cameras (XD Cams). Both the Zaxcom and Lectro setups work extremely well. Receivers are always powered off the cameras. But, if they can't be, I have dual saddle bags where one side is an NP1 and the other is the receiver. Production Sound Mixing for Television, Film, and Commercials.  www.matthewfreed.com

[Matias U]

2 um400a for sends for L/R mix to camera(I like to be able to see the led metering and being able to turn on/off the tx from the top,I do bag work)Might not seem too big of a deal but when you're running and gunning I find it helps.

As for hops... Lectro Sra and Srb powered with sony nfp700 on a batt sled, which last a whole 12 hr day and them some.

Cheers

[old school]

I use my old 211 receivers. They work well and sound good. Fuzzy velcro on one side, hooky velcro on the other side. I put it anywhere on the camera they want it. Sometimes on the dolly as well.

CrewC

[Zack]

Depends on budget/requests IMO.

G2 Hop = low budget, no TC, single mono scratch for DSLR, and RED cams.

ERX Hop = single mono scratch with TC for budgets that afford it, just about any camera, (no TC when used with DSLR's though).

Zaxcom Hop = 2ch high quality audio and TC for budgets that afford it, mostly ENG and reality work.

[cmassey]

My mounting system is just like Crew C...velcro wherever works best for all involved.  Handful of cables with right angle adapters and off I go. 

 

Most often an older Sennheiser EW100 wireless for scratch track...always record for the real thing...I will use my 411A if absolutely need be and again velcro is my friend...

[tonetripper]

I use the QRX100 for my camera hop with the trx900aa with the sta150. IFB enabled.

The beautiful thing about the setup is the time code in/out functionality.

Worked on a doc whereby I was wireless and also recording to the 744 but camera was running tape time code. Took the t/c out of the camera which sent via the network back to the 900aa and fed t/c to the 744. Post loved it and I had no sync boxes on camera. Everything was perfectly locked. There isn't really any other all in one solutions for t/c to be seamless as such or as versatile IMHO, which was why I went w the camera hop in the first place.

On the downside the ta3 locking inputs on the qrx are a bit cheap. I got Harry Quan out here in Toronto to replace them w metal ones. The stock plastic ones eventually give up. Zaxcom should fix this. I paid to have mine done as my ta3 for the outputs were popping out all the time. I used snot tape to keep them hard fastened. That was only due to the inability in time to fix them. I recently had it done and that is making me feel much more comfortable about the unit.

Some guys are all about the D4s out here in Toronto. I just think they are a bit more power hungry and don't have that t/c backup recording capabilities.

Fo reference track ill use my G2s. They sound decent enough even for broadcast when set proper and are rock solid in close for RF. this would be mostly when I'm wanting them more for confidence whilst recording to another unit eg 744 788.

[Michael McQueen]

i use SRa with battery sleds (or not) for 2 channel hop via smqv's, ERXTCD's for scratch/timecode/IFB or Senn Gx for mono/IFB.

[Marc Wielage]

SRa with DIY battery sled, plus 1 x SMQV (sometimes two, if I have a stereo situation, which is rare). 

 

I believe in sending them a scratch track only because I know of the drudgery of having to sync up dailies without any reference at all, and I do this in cases where I'm suspicious that the camera crew won't stay on top of timecode. It's their decision if they choose to wave me away and say, "no, no -- we'll just do it 'film style' and have no timecode or sound reference." That's a client call.

 

To me, it's about 5 extra minutes of effort to send them a mono mix via camera hop, so it's not a big deal to me.

[pscottm]

i use an older zaxcom stereoline kit for mixing to camera ENG style where cam audio is going to be primary audio.  one transmitter, one receiver.  i mount it w a side bracket that comes off the cam's battery plate.  cam operators seem to like the sturdiness and light weight.  

 

i've also used an SRa in a cam slot which works well too and is even more ergonomic for the cam ops but it ties up two transmitters that i'd rather use for talent than for links.  

 

for scratch tracks i send a mono mix via sennheiser g2 which works surprisingly well and will run all day on two alkaline AAs.  it's small and easy to mount, doesn't have the same audio quality as the zax but has been good enough to tempt lazy editors to not sync the recorder tracks on occasion.  so now when i work w that production company i over-modulate the g2 a bit to keep the lazy editors honest.  most of the time they're using plural eyes to sync audio/picture so the occasionally distorted scratch track does it's job and is still way easier for the software to recognize than the built-in mic of a dslr.   

[Tim M]

What are you guys charging for these extra options? I'm at the point where some other guys are offering quality wireless hops for $400 or lower a day for TOTAL day rate. Most every camera guy I have recently worked with prefers wireless hops.

[MatthewFreedAudio]

If I'm doing the Zaxcom hops it's $150/day for one channel/camera and an additional $75/day for a second camera. <br /><br /><br />Production Sound Mixing for Television, Film, and Commercials. <br />www.matthewfreed.com

[pscottm]

less than 400?  oh dear, that's crazy.  i guess i'm lucky to charge $90/day extra for hops..  i still try to make sure the cam department requests it so production is less likely to bitch about it (sigh).

 

scratch track is a courtesy when running double system so no charge there..  

[cmassey]

Scratch track is not a courtesy in my book...they need it, even if they don't know it.  $100 a day for the wireless system and all the gack to mount it on, near, or around the camera. 

[atheisticmystic]

Scratch track is not a courtesy in my book...they need it, even if they don't know it.  $100 a day for the wireless system and all the gack to mount it on, near, or around the camera. 

I don't like it when a DP imperiously notifies me that they'll take a hop from me when the UPM has clearly negotiated a budget that won't pay for it. If we're not using the third talent wireless in my basic kit, I'm OK throwing the G2 on cam (velcro or hotshoe) for a scratch track, otherwise, I politely inform them that there was no budget for it.

[pverrando]

A camera assistant gave me grief recently for having the velcro soft side on my wireless. "Camera always gets the soft side," he said. "Its SOP to put the soft side on camera." 

[atheisticmystic]

A camera assistant gave me grief recently for having the velcro soft side on my wireless. "Camera always gets the soft side," he said. "Its SOP to put the soft side on camera." 

Now that you mention it, my G2 has "female" velcro on it. Have I been unknowingly putting myself out there to camera as the "bottom" all this time?

[ProSound]

Even though it may get me grief here I regular give my hop away for under market value $75.00 per day or free. If I am in a reality/ENG setting I do not want to be tethered to camera ever. My job is at least 75% harder when I am being pulled around by a clueless camera op. I would much rather give away the hop and sit in the corner out of the way all day and save my back then wear the bag for 8 hours while standing all day. In these situations I look at it as I may be losing money on the hop but I am saving on my Chiropractor bills and saving all my energy for days when I need to wear the bag all day and swing the boom. I also feel that its my job to try and keep the camera op as safe as possible and since I am wireless I can stay a few feet back and make sure he doesn't fall into a ditch, walk backwards into traffic or do something else that could injure him. I also feel like I risk being injured cabled to camera. 

Anyways its my 2 cents I love my SRA/ LMA set up battery life is great and it fits easily on any camera system. 

 

For commercial and long format work I use either a Comtek or a G2 for scratch track. I prefer to use a comtek as the range is better then a G2 and then one transmitter is feeding IFB and camera I also know that if the client has a good Ifb feed the camera scratch track is usually fine. 

[JonG]

For a long time I used my old G2/G3s, but my younger mixer buddies are continually renting them from me, so I never have them available. I purchased a Lectro um100/ucr100 set that I have been using, and it works well. Just got a Zaxcom IFB100/ERX2TCD set to send audio and time code (I had just been jamming the cameras up until this point), and since I still have my old comteks, those will still serve as principal IFB.

 

As far as mounting goes, every camera and every camera build is different, so I have a kit-o-options which includes velcro, bongo ties, those Sennheiser shoe-mount plates that I can mount just about anything to, and the clips on the back of the cell phone cases that I put my ERX2s in. Sorry I dont have any pictures, but I can usually find a solution that works with any of the above mentioned items.

[JWL]

Lectro SRA for me, with battery sled. UM400a's as trx with battery eliminators. Always record backup though, Better nights sleep with the backup.

[MT Groove]

I used the Zaxcom TRX900/STA100 transmitter with RX900S receivers. Sound quality is excellent. Range is OK when used as hops. However the STA100 setup causes a lot of RF spray and when using in a bag, it really reduces the range in my Lectro receivers drastically. In a cart setup, with sharkfins mounted high, RF spray is minimal and works very well. <br /><br />Recently, I just switched to using a pair of SRB/UM400a. They work great. No RF spray when coordinated properly with talent receivers. I LOVE the fact that you can drop the SRB into many full bodied cameras. Cam ops love the fact that it's such an ergonomic way of mounting hops. Plus, the SRB is light and gets no complaints. <br /><br /><br />Sammy Huen

[bigbenboom]

One show was having issues with RFI (Comteks), but were syncing my audio on set anyway, so I just stopped. The other broke 2 Comteks in 2 days, and nobody was listening anyway, so I again just stopped.

Robert

Do you mean you were using Comteks as hops? I had to do this once and hated it. They aren't really built for that, but it was the lead mixers call. I was day playing. I wont be doing it again if I can help it.

I use Lectros as hops, either 411s or SRa. I prefer the SRa because they are less cumbersome for myself and the camera op, but have not made the full switch over yet with my personal gear. If I have a two camera shoot somebody is getting 411s.

Something important to remember when you start building your wireless kits, is to try to have a dedicated block just for hops. If it is just you in the field with a couple of mics in the bag this may not be a big concern, but this could save your ass later.

I have done a couple of shows where I was given gear and my bag mics and hops were all on the same block. As frustrating as that was, I got it to work. However, as soon as another mixer was thrown in with the same set up, somebody was getting screwed.

I mostly use BLK 19 and 24 in the bag, and 22 as hops, but, depending on my available freqs (when I am on the road) I have the flexibility to move those around if need be. What is good in Chicago may not be great in Columbus.