Jeff Wexler Posted November 13, 2013 Report Share Posted November 13, 2013 "You mentioned the cellphone's rfi, Jeff. This will occur only when the mic is on a zx. This same phone will not cause rfi when the same mic is on a cable. Is that not a curios fact, worth inquiring about?" I have had cell phone interference on hard wired lava before. Even if this issue has not been discussed in adequate detail to answer ALL of tour questions, one thing is abundantly clear which is RFI type problems are quite unpredictable and subject to all sorts of conditions which are not always easily defined or described. A given microphone in a certain situation MAY have a problem and in what appears to be an identical situation, exhibits clean performance. As for explaining why this is so, I am not qualified to explain this (but there are several others here who could explain all these things if willing to take the time to answer your specific questions). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Todd Posted November 13, 2013 Report Share Posted November 13, 2013 I had the DPA problem with Block 20 TRX900LANC's. I have two slightly older DPA lav's that work fabulously. Would love to pick up a few more when they sort this out. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 15, 2013 Report Share Posted November 15, 2013 " I don't know why you don't want me ask this question? " you are incorrect in that conclusion, I suspect JW is saying about what I say: it has been discussed thoroughly already. " Why are microhones more susceptible to rfi when used with a plug-on tx, but less so when cabled? " that can be difficult to say, as there could be numerous and various reasons, -but one is certainly: proximity- as well as the fact that your "more susceptible" observation may be flawed. There is plenty of Physics out there for all sorts of issues! The observation is just that. What may be flawed is the conclusion drawn from it and of course, that's very possible. Which is why I was asking for others to share their experiences. Proximity however is an unlikely culprit, as that was the same for both modes of transmission. I know you don't like this, but would you mind kindly pointing me to where this issue has been thouroughly discussed? And don't say this thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 15, 2013 Report Share Posted November 15, 2013 "You mentioned the cellphone's rfi, Jeff. This will occur only when the mic is on a zx. This same phone will not cause rfi when the same mic is on a cable. Is that not a curios fact, worth inquiring about?" I have had cell phone interference on hard wired lava before. Even if this issue has not been discussed in adequate detail to answer ALL of tour questions, one thing is abundantly clear which is RFI type problems are quite unpredictable and subject to all sorts of conditions which are not always easily defined or described. A given microphone in a certain situation MAY have a problem and in what appears to be an identical situation, exhibits clean performance. As for explaining why this is so, I am not qualified to explain this (but there are several others here who could explain all these things if willing to take the time to answer your specific questions). (Sorry, I don't know how to multi-quote in Tapatalk) Of course, I don't expect anyone to explain this to me, especially since I seem to be the only one curious about this. And maybe it is a non-issue. And you are certainly right about the unpredictability of rfi. And yes, I've had rfi on hard-wired mics, too. I'm not saying that they are impervious, I was just trying to find out if there is a trend for more rfi in the audio on wireless transmissions. Anyway, at the moment it seems like there is not much interest in this, so we can leave it at that, I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beatty Posted November 16, 2013 Report Share Posted November 16, 2013 Block 21 for me as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Wilcox Posted November 18, 2013 Report Share Posted November 18, 2013 Doug can you describe the problem? Or post a sample. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beatty Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 I sat down for 5 minutes today to document this issue, so I'm pretty sure they will have no problem replicating this once they have the Zaxcom gear on hand to test. Stereo sample of the older 4063 [L] and the newer 4063 [R] It's been 10 days since DPA's last update and my fingers are crossed that they can come up with a simple solution in a timely manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Coomer Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 Doug - I've told DPA about this thread, but I don't know if they are monitoring it. I forwarded this file to DPA and I'll let you know as soon as i have an update thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 " a simple solution " that is difficult to say, as sometimes the things we think ought to be simple are not as simple as we think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Wilcox Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Thanks for posting. I have the problem as well in block 21. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Maxwell Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Why do these RF problems keep coming up with Zaxcom? Same for the TRX 742. I think Zaxcom needs to start addressing this problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Why do these RF problems keep coming up with Zaxcom? Same for the TRX 742. I think Zaxcom needs to start addressing this problem. Hey, Geoff, I don't think you've been following this whole issue carefully. Quite awhile ago when it is was discovered that several of the mics we typically use were overly sensitive to RFI when used with digital wireless (and Zaxcom was and still is the main supplier of pure digital wireless for our sort of jobs), Zaxcom DID address the problem by working with the manufacturers to IMPROVE their RFI rejection --- this was a win-win situation for everyone --- we found ourselves now with an improved Sanken COS-11 and Schoeps microphone --- how can this be a bad thing? The current DPA problem surfaced just about a 2 months ago and is also being addressed by both Zaxcom and DPA. It should be noted that this comes after many years of ZERO problems with probably the best sounding lav there is coupled with the best sounding transmitter in the industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Maxwell Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Thanks Jeff, I stand corrected. I was more or less hijacking this thread trying to get some resolution to the TRX 742 RF issue which seems similar. I have personally never had any RF issues with any Lectrosonics wireless using them with all types of lav mics DPA included and Lectro plug-ons with Schoeps , Neumann, Sennheiser. I'm trying to move into some Zaxcom wireless but all this RF stuff has me spooked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadoStefanov Posted November 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Geoff, As far as I know only css5 has problems when you connect the 774 directly in to the mic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wandering Ear Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Geoff, As far as I know only css5 has problems when you connect the 774 directly in to the mic I have heard some interference with my schoeps plugged directly into the 742, but it's minor and a short cable resolves the issue. I also never need to plug the tx directly into the mic, i prefer it on the pole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 "I have personally never had any RF issues with any Lectrosonics wireless using them with all types of lav mics DPA included and Lectro plug-ons with Schoeps , Neumann, Sennheiser." The RFI problem is not a factor with Lectrosonics (analog hybrid) transmitters --- only with digital transmission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Norflus Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 This problem is no different that cell phone data getting into a mic. The issue is not with apple or samsung but with the mic manufacturer. They need to prevent rf from getting into the mic itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Maxwell Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 OK thanks for the clarifications guys. My trepidation occurs when imagining that conversation with the director or producer explaining why the last take is N/G and I need to swap out mics on the actors because of "Mic" RF issues and the reason I was using the Zaxcom (digital) radios in the first place was because of a marginal but definitely perceptable difference in quality....etc.etc.....a conversation I would rather not have. As far as the plug on situation, according to threads on this site and Zaxcom's user site the RF issue occurs not only when the TRX 742 is plugged directly into the mic, which one would never do in practice, but when used near the mic such as with an Ambient Top Tip or even in some cases at the bottom of the pole. Most of my boom swingers like the TX on top of an uncabled pole. The reports say various Schoeps and Neumann mics have been problematic and vintage doesn't seem to be the determining factor. Since Zaxcom is the only all digital system (that I know of) aren't we assuming the fix lies in the mics themselves and not something in the digital radio design? Pure speculation here because I am nothing close to an electrical engineer, just a monkey turning knobs and getting a paycheck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 " that conversation with the director or producer explaining why the last take is N/G and I need to swap out mics on the actors because of "Mic" RF issues " and " The reports say various Schoeps and Neumann mics have been problematic and vintage doesn't seem to be the determining factor. " well, CRAP happens. OTOH, if something doesn't work properly... don't use it. I went to the Doctor the other day and told him it hurts when I bend my arm like (imagine it) this, and he told me to not bend my arm like that... I have... and ...it has stopped hurting and, BTW: " which one would never do in practice, " although another one might. " aren't we assuming the fix lies in the mics themselves and not something in the digital radio design? " some kids just don't play well together...they don't always get along. " just a monkey turning knobs and getting a paycheck. " and sometimes having unrealistic expectations ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 "I have personally never had any RF issues with any Lectrosonics wireless using them with all types of lav mics DPA included and Lectro plug-ons with Schoeps , Neumann, Sennheiser." The RFI problem is not a factor with Lectrosonics (analog hybrid) transmitters --- only with digital transmission. Well, ever since having gone down a similar route Geoff is now going down on, too (in the same thread even) I have been told that it doesn't really matter if it's digital or analogue or both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 " I have been told that... " and if you were told on the Internet, then it must be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VASI Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 This problem exist with Sennheiser 9000 series digital wireless or other digital (not a digital hybrid) wireless in the market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted November 26, 2013 Report Share Posted November 26, 2013 Again, Geoff, you are right that the "fix" is in the microphone. Once the mic is "fixed" you can use it with any of the digital transmitters and you won't have to have any uncomfortable conversations with the Director or anyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 26, 2013 Report Share Posted November 26, 2013 " I have been told that... " and if you were told on the Internet, then it must be true. Funny YOU say that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 26, 2013 Report Share Posted November 26, 2013 " Funny YOU say that... " I read on the Internet that it is a law! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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