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VirtualKaty and similar. Are they reliable enough?


elliotkelly

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In the context where I work, the video editors send us a finished episode to work with. Then, the audio team will do the backgrounds, foley, dialogs, music, etc, and when the final mix is done, the episode is sent for review to the director, producers, and a group of people who will ask for changes in audio, and video.

 

After the editor receives those requests, he will do all the video adjustments and send us back a new video and an .omf with a reference track to cut and assemble the Pro Tools session according to this new version.

 

Now, here comes the problem:

 

The changes made by the editor include opening space for new scenes and shots that were not in the previous version, changing the order of scenes, making a shot longer or shorter by adding or cutting frames, as well as deleting scenes and putting new ones, just to mention some of the changes they do.   

 

The consecuence is that once we reassemble the .ptf, everything is a mess, now the music, fx, backgrounds and dialogs will be cut at weird points, and we will have to manually fix every affected region (which is a process that will never be done right by any software).

 

My question is:

 

Are VirtualKaty and similar products reliable enough for the process of cutting and assembling a Pro Tools session in this context? Will they move every region and automation to their new location, delete the regions that were deleted by the editor, open space for new scenes, etc?

 

Thank you for your time.

 

 

 

 

 

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There's some (generally positive) discussions about Virtual Katy over on the Gearslutz Forum:

 

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/post-production-forum/235663-auto-assembling-pro-tools-sessions-assemblerator.html

 

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/post-production-forum/765809-virtual-katy-messed-up-reconform.html

 

Do a Google search on Virtual Katy and you'll get the rundown.

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All these apps can work well for you IF IF IF there are ground rules followed and some workflow testing done.  They are not an instant silver bullet for a project already in progress.   A secret to using them well is really managing how projects are ingested and layed out to begin with.  In any case I've never had one of these apps get me all the way there on a conform--you still have to check everything, fix edits and do detective work finding missing clips.  But it can reduce the amount of that to be done, and they have really helped me a lot on TV series that were being done in a rolling fashion, with serious deadlines.

 

philp

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Hi, and welcome...

elliotkelly: " The consecuence is that once we reassemble the .ptf, everything is a mess, "

I see a potential flaw in your workflow, in that the sound mix should be done after picture is locked.

taking into account your other posts, I also see the blame game may be involved here..?

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Thanks for your reply SENATOR,

 

The whole audio team has always thought that the flaw you mention should be corrected, since it would certainly help if the sound mix was done after picture lock.

 

However, clients, directors and producers want to watch the full episode after it is mixed, and then make their requests about audio and video. This is the way it has always been here, and I don't see it changing soon, but you have made me thought again about it. Maybe it is something that definitely has to be corrected in order to improve the workflow of the audio team.

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Personally Virtual Katy has become so complex and if the change notes are not prepared perfectly by the pix dept it will never work properly.  I have the software and never use it.  I have found that Maggot Software's Conformalizer is a fantastic tool for conforms.  It operates similarly to VK but it is much simpler to use.  You can use change notes or create your own change note by using video edls.  If the changes are minor I tend to do them by hand.  But for complicated and time consuming conforms I will run the notes and spend my time repairing the tracks. 

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  • 2 months later...

There's no magic solution for this as applying the picture changes to your audio tracks will always require fixes. For example, if in the vision edit a bunch of shots are swapped during a music montage and the music isn't changed, applying the picture changes to your Pro Tools tracks will cut your tracks when they didn't need to be. The other example is in the vision edit they may have made some changes to audio clips only, like changed a couple of voice-over takes. These changes will never come across in a picture change list. Hence these extra fixes always need to be made after an automated re-conform is performed.

 

However saying this, generally apply the picture changes to your audio tracks gets most of the work done that you would need to do. Once the changes are applied with an application the holes and edits need to be fixed and then you'd need to play down your edit tracks and compare them with the guide tracks of the new pictures to make sure they match.

 

Also, as mentioned above, this process relies on getting good data from the picture editor(s) and setting up a work-flow to handle these changes in an efficient way.

 

Another application to check out is EdiLoad. It not only re-conforms Pro Tools tracks for picture changes but can also conform (assemble) your location WAV files in conjunction with the Pro Tools expand tracks feature. It can also export a text file listing picture changes so you can update your session manually by inserting and deleting the required frames at a location that works with the material in your tracks.

 

http://www.soundsinsync.com/products/ediload

 

Regards,

 

Mark

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Another application to check out is EdiLoad. It not only re-conforms Pro Tools tracks for picture changes but can also conform (assemble) your location WAV files in conjunction with the Pro Tools expand tracks feature. It can also export a text file listing picture changes so you can update your session manually by inserting and deleting the required frames at a location that works with the material in your tracks.

http://www.soundsinsync.com/products/ediload

Regards,

Mark

I'm reading this on Tapatalk which doesn't show me all the signature and additional poster's information, but this should be identified as an ad, or something like that
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VK worked fine for me, I haven't used EdiLoad or Titan but I hear good things. I think Conformalizer was most effective in my experience. But you should always ask for a change list from picture department. Even if they happen to make a mistake that messes with one of these program's operations, simply A/Bing the picture cuts and walking though the change list can make an arduous process a little more manageable. 

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Mark is the author of Ediload, yes (and Editrace, which saved my ass countless times).  He is describing his own product, but in no more forward a way than Glenn Sanders does for his Zaxcom gear here all the time.  Probably many people here had not heard of Ediload, and it's a solid, useful tool.

 

philp

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Mark is the author of Ediload, yes (and Editrace, which saved my ass countless times). He is describing his own product, but in no more forward a way than Glenn Sanders does for his Zaxcom gear here all the time. Probably many people here had not heard of Ediload, and it's a solid, useful tool.

philp

no of course, and that's absolutely fine, like most of us here I welcome contributions from the manufacturers. I didn't mean that Mark shouldn't post here, but when posting about his own product he should identify himself as the maker of said product. Like Glenn Sanders usually does at the end of his posts, and others do too.

But like I said Tapatalk doesn't show signatures and such, so maybe I missed something there.

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no of course, and that's absolutely fine, like most of us here I welcome contributions from the manufacturers. I didn't mean that Mark shouldn't post here, but when posting about his own product he should identify himself as the maker of said product. Like Glenn Sanders usually does at the end of his posts, and others do too.

But like I said Tapatalk doesn't show signatures and such, so maybe I missed something there.

 

Fair point Constantin. I found the button to add my signature and will in future point out that I have created an application if I post regarding one of my apps.

 

Regards,

 

Mark

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