studiomprd Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Duffy: " It's a fine concept, but I don't see it ever making money for a manufacturer. " just like so very many other requests made to manufacturers by members here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Reilly Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 FYI, Juiced Link claims more DARs in development. Maybe one to fit this niche will surface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Watson Posted September 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Bruce, I must be thick or something, I just can't seem to figure out what it is you want... Yes, I get that often enough. Written communication isn't my strength. If there's a thick one here, it's bound to be me. Just sayin'. Here's the "problem". I've got an SD MixPre-D that I use for small jobs. Actually, for me I use it for most jobs (this isn't LA). And SD, in their infinite wisdom, stuffed into the MixPre-D a set of ADCs, formatting software, and the hardware to give the MixPre-D AES3 output, switchable to an XLR socket. So I thought: "wouldn't it be cool to actually use this AES3 output stream?" But it turns out, there's not an easy way to do that. In fact, I can't find any professionals, on this board or any other, that are actually using that AES3 stream at all. Because there aren't any AES3 bit-buckets to take advantage of it. And that was the purpose of my original post. I searched and came up with zilch. So I asked here, asking if any of you knew of any AES3 bit-buckets I could use for this purpose. And the answer I got back was a resounding "NO". Which just confirmed that I had not missed anything in my searching. And for that knowledge, I'm grateful to this group. So I dropped it, let it go, and went on with my work. But the fact that this thread has been revived a few times now, not by me, tells me that there's at least some interest in a small, light, simple, AES3 bit-bucket. So maybe I'm not completely crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Watson Posted September 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 So write the utility yourself, and run it on some miniature CPU-on-a-board gadget. ROFL! Yes, actually, I could. I'm a design engineer by training, and I built stuff like this for 30 years. I can build the box, design and prototype the electronics, and write the software. It wouldn't even take that long. But I've grown to despise writing and debugging device drivers; I've got the skills but not the smallest interest anymore. I do not want to build tools anymore. Now, I want to use tools. I'm looking for a tool, which is the point of my original post. How did you manage to twist that into thinking I wanted to make one? I know that you don't understand why I'd want a small, light, simple AES3 bit bucket that I could plug into an XLR jack on my MixPre-D. I get that you, personally, don't want one. But just because you don't want it, doesn't mean that I don't want it. Indeed, several others here seem to be interested too. I never thought I'd be defending my desire for a tool to the guy who probably knows more about the tools of audio than any other. Ironic, that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wandering Ear Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Buy a trx742 and be done. It will do what you need, and isn't much bigger than the batteries and electronics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Rose Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Bruce, I wouldn't mind having one. I just wouldn't want to pay the many hundred bucks it would take a manufacturer to make one. As far as my twisting things to you building one... no, no twist. I'm just saying that economics dictate that DIY is the only way you'll get one. -- Historical note: At some point in the not so distant past, the thought was that $$$ digital camera manufacturers might include an AES input for single system. At least it wouldn't sound as bad as the lousy digitizers they were including back then. But the industry didn't go in that direction... for which I'm actually grateful, or else features would be shooting single system on two tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Bruce: " I can't find any professionals, on this board or any other, that are actually using that AES3 stream at all. " that doesn't mean none are actually using the capability, and the ones I know of are using it to feed a downstream device's (not necessarily a recorder or as you say 'bit-bucket') digital inputs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Coomer Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 So I thought: "wouldn't it be cool to actually use this AES3 output stream?" But it turns out, there's not an easy way to do that. In fact, I can't find any professionals, on this board or any other, that are actually using that AES3 stream at all. Because there aren't any AES3 bit-buckets to take advantage of it. The MixPre-D is commonly used to add an additional two analog inputs to a Deva. The Deva only has 8 analog ins, so it's perfect if you are running an analog board and need more than mix and 7 isos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Watson Posted October 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2014 Tascam DR-10x. This at least looks exactly what I'm talking about. The size and form factor and how it's just a "plug-on recorder" and all, is pretty frellin' close. Maybe I can convince one of the modders to rip the guts out of this and replace it with just the electronics needed to accept the AES3 output from a MixPre-D and record it. Heartbreakingly close, this is. Sigh.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Buy a trx742 and be done. It will do what you need, and isn't much bigger than the batteries and electronics. Are you sure it records AES3? I thought it only does AES42, analogue mono and stereo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Norflus Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Are you sure it records AES3? I thought it only does AES42, analogue mono and stereo Yes you can use an AES3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VASI Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 About AES3 and AES42. For not confusion what it is AES42. http://www.taperssection.com/reference/pdf/AES%20-%20Digital%20Microphones%20-%20AES42%20and%20all%20that.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Yes you can use an AES3. Excellent, good to know. About AES3 and AES42. For not confusion what it is AES42. http://www.taperssection.com/reference/pdf/AES%20-%20Digital%20Microphones%20-%20AES42%20and%20all%20that.pdf Don't think anyone is confused Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Norflus Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Yes the 742 can accept analog mono, analog stereo, AES3 and AES42 microphones. You just need to change the input cone for the appropriate microphone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Norflus Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Plus you can shut off the transmitter and use the 742 as a recorder only. You also have the ability to turn on the zaxnet transmitter to have confidence monitoring. The zaxnet transmitter is independent from the uhf transmitter and can be turned on and off when desired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 The original post asked for a small single channel digital plug-on to be fed from a little 2 channel mixer. That exists, and it's the Zaxcom TRX742. Also, as mentioned by Rich in post #2, a Zaxcom ZFR100 with STA-042 would work. The STA-042 is the digital input adapter for the ZFR/TRX900AA. If you don't want an ERX for monitoring, the TRX942 accepts digital and has a headphone jack. Problem has been solved for years now. Otherwise, put the MixPreD on the backup shelf and get a Maxx or 633. I'm sure Sound Devices pondered recording in the MixPre-D (like the 552), but didn't see a need for it..... Or at least not when they weighed what that would mean to cost or price or something. That's something I wouldn't expect them to explain because it's a business decision. Maybe the same reason they didn't simply add basic recording to the 302, but developed the 633 instead. I know there are people using the MixPre-D digital outs in studio settings. They raved about it when it first shipped. Sound Devices sells a lot of gear to people that don't strap on a harness and hold a boom. Look at products like the USB-Pre and the HX3. We're not buying those, but somebody is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VASI Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 Excellent, good to know. Don't think anyone is confused I didn't say you are confused. Maybe someone need a clarification what is AES42. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Thomas Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 The MI users come up with this idea every year as well - a bit bucket for them to use with a boutique mic-pre and A/D converter. But they don't want to spend more than $99 on it - "just take the microphone off the top of the hand-held recorder and put a digital in on instead". It's such a niche though. Charge $99 and you'd sell a handful and lose a lot of money in development. Charge $499 (because it's going to be used with 4 figure converters) and everybody says "I'll just use the S/PDIF in on the DR-680 or DR-100mkII and have it to use it for other things as well." It's a fine concept, but I don't see it ever making money for a manufacturer. I'd be happy to pay USD$500 for a small 2ch box with timecode and aes3 in. I did have thoughts about getting an ifb200 for this job, but running zaxconvert's an extra hassle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Visser Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 You don't need an active format converter box to go from AES/EBU to S/PDIF. Just pin1 to case and pin2 to tip and it will work, done it myself. The impedance of the cable will be wrong of course, but for short cable runs this will not matter, only in very long runs is it possible for there to be impedance mismatch reflections to cause issues, which is why 100ohm twin axial cable is specified for AES. There is also a professional flag bit normally enabled for AES, but any digital receiver chip built after 1985 should have no problem reading that flag (as well as other flags such as emphasis) regardless of wether the implementation is coaxial or optical S/PDIF or AES. Engineers have been doing this for years. For many years the M-Audio Micro-Track II has been the darling of the industry exactly for this bit bucket application. Apparently some of the newer Tascam recorders also feature digital inputs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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