Philip Perkins Posted May 11, 2014 Report Share Posted May 11, 2014 There IS compression going on during production dialog recording. First by the hand of the PSM, then by both the input and output limiters of mixer/recorder, most especially when one is dealing with a combo of mumblers and big-voice theatre actors. Even the isos are after the input limiters. Re no comp or some comp or a lot of comp in post--I like the "nibble" approach, which is to do a little of a lot of things rather than whack the track with one high-setting plug. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arnold Posted May 14, 2014 Report Share Posted May 14, 2014 This whole scenario is somewhat ironic as the BBC has recently signed up to the R128 'Loundness' spec designed to increase audibility and reduce compression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontariosound Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 I have a hard time watching Cosmos : A Spacetime Odyssey. We know that the location recordist was stuck with only being able to use a lav on most of the shots. And with such a soft voice and intimate delivery, a studio engineer would have trouble getting a decent level from a U87 placed one inch from this chap's lips. He kind of hushes himself after every word which would be very frustrating on set. Not thrilled with the directing either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henchman Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 I have a hard time watching Cosmos : A Spacetime Odyssey. We know that the location recordist was stuck with only being able to use a lav on most of the shots. And with such a soft voice and intimate delivery, a studio engineer would have trouble getting a decent level from a U87 placed one inch from this chap's lips. He kind of hushes himself after every word which would be very frustrating on set. Not thrilled with the directing either. You have no idea. Between fader at the top, and clipgain, I would sometime have upwards of 30 db of combined gain on the end of sentences. And then I'd have to fight the noise on the end if those words as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 I'll say this: given what Mark had to work with, the sound on Cosmos is at least understandable. I can see that the issue is that they're trying to use material shot on location, shot on a green screen stage, and also shot in a VO booth, all combined together, sometimes within the same paragraph. I can imagine that trying to match those is a nightmare, especially when all three are different mics, most likely different crews. It's a great show, BTW -- probably my favorite of the year so far in terms of content. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bondelev Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 COSMOS has a ton of ADR. NGT is apparently quite good at it. The timbre of his voice is very inconsistent though because they constantly cut between locations. Considering the show, I will forgive that. It is among the best on television. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 DB: " COSMOS has a ton of ADR " are you referring to the VO... (which is not ADR, but which may, or may not need to be blended with production trax... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bondelev Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 @Senator, no, not VO, on camera ADR. I forget who told me, but much of the production sound was unusable and he is ADR on a lot of location material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henchman Posted May 22, 2014 Report Share Posted May 22, 2014 Since this has devolved into a "Cosmos" thread I feel compelled to comment. On the original "Cosmos," we all had the exact same equipment, wireless' and lavaliers, and in fact, because my lavalier mount was the "best" I trained the other two mixers how to apply the lavalier to Carl Sagan's wardrobe. While our show, released in 1980, was limited by the technology of the time, I felt like we had a good plan for attempting to have some continuity of sound on the show. I haven't watched any of the new "Cosmos," but I'm shocked to hear that there are mismatches between production, and voice over, with the technology that's available today, this is a shame. This was definitely not the case in this version of Cosmos. In fact. There was one case where they recorded a pickup line in the video editing suite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henchman Posted May 22, 2014 Report Share Posted May 22, 2014 @Senator, no, not VO, on camera ADR. I forget who told me, but much of the production sound was unusable and he is ADR on a lot of location material. Nope. Not true. There was some ADR, but we had to use most of what would be consider unusable production sound, and make it work. ADR was usually only resorted to when there was a line change, or mis-pronunciation of a name. A good example is the episode where he was in Italy. There is a scene where he talks about the speed of sound. There's a horsewhip crack, etc. Unbelievably noisy scene. Aweful production sound. They ADR'ed the entire think. But at the mix, were not happy with the performance. And I had to make the production work. Which made me cringe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontariosound Posted May 22, 2014 Report Share Posted May 22, 2014 I feel that the director should be taking a good deal of the blame for the low quality of the location sound. The soft, almost romantic delivery by the host. Those quirky body gestures that do not mesh with the script. The super wide shots that never cut to a medium close up during those walk and talks. It almost feels like one of those shows where the DOP says in pre-production that he owns a good wireless mic and he will take care of the sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted May 22, 2014 Report Share Posted May 22, 2014 That's been my life in docs pretty exactly, and indies too. They'll hate the production track (for good reason usually), go to a lot of trouble to record a fix, have me go to a lot of trouble to make the fix work in the scene, and then throw it out @ the mix and return to whatever I can do with the production track. The current COSMOS is just what happens when you work with in-demand talent, as was discussed in an earlier thread, they just aren't going to make themselves available for real studio VO, ADR and certainly not for small fixes and changes. I've been on the set with talent like this recording audio for job B, when I get a request to record some wild lines for job A, which was shot in some completely other place (probably other country). I felt sorry for the postie that was going to have to solve that jig-saw puzzle. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmahaAudio Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 More Mumbling! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/10856964/BBC-in-new-mumbling-row-over-crime-drama-Quirke.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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