orionflood Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 Getting decent pay on a reality show but the turn around has been 8 to 9 hours every night after 14-16 hour days. Have any of you quit a good paying job due to circumstances like these? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 How long do you need to keep this up? If it's for more than a few days, then you could consider diplomatically letting the production know that what they are doing is dangerous--tired people are accident prone and make mistakes. philp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 Is this some crazy show in some crazy location or someplace really remote? People doing shows like that seem to sign up for unusual circumstances. Is there travel involved? 8 hours of turnaround with any kind of commute would be horrible. Not that any of that would make it okay, but if this is in a regular city or town, that's nuts. Hope you are making bank on all the OT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whit Norris Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 The IA turn around is 9 hrs in most cases. Camera operators have 10 hours. Under the ASA IA contract there is now a clause if you work more than 14 hours 2 days in a row there will be a 10 hour rest period until the work day is less than 14 hours or the employee receives a day off. These are the conditions that I work under and rest can still be a issue. 8 hours of turn around on a regular basis is challenging, dangerous, and unhealthy. I know you are not on a union production, but generally the IA has set the standards for the industry. Many non union productions still follow some of the practices. Look out for yourself and be safe! Whit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 The IA turn around is 9 hrs in most cases. You should talk to your union about this. 9 hours really isn't enough, especially if you have to drive home for an hour or so, which I'm sure isn't unusual in places like LA. In Germany we get 11 hours, which will be extended to 12 if the work hours exceed 13. To the OP if your bed isn't on the other side of the road of the set, I would seriously reconsider this job. Less than seven hours means your only getting maybe 5 or six hours of sleep. If this happens regularly this can be very unhealthy and if there is driving involved, dangerous for you and others. No job is worth that. If you don't want to lose the job, rent a trailer, an RV or find a cheap hotel nearby so you don't need to drive home (and back). On a recent production, they had rented RV for the actors to relax in during the day. It was a two hour drive for me, so I asked to be allowed to sleep in one of the RVs. They agreed and I did. It was very nice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whit Norris Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 You should talk to your union about this. 9 hours really isn't enough, especially if you have to drive home for an hour or so, which I'm sure isn't unusual in places like LA. In Germany we get 11 hours, which will be extended to 12 if the work hours exceed 13. Constantin I agree with you that this is not long enough. There have been several campaigns here to change our working hours and rest periods. JW's father has been a big leader in this with 12 On 12 Off and his documentary "Who Needs Sleep"as well as the campaign "Brent's Rule". Our union still has done very little to change this. Our union has not listened to its membership. I encourage everyone to watch Haskell Wexler's "Who Needs Sleep". It explains a lot of what we are dealing with in the US with long hours in the film industry. Your country and others in Europe have always had more civilized hours than we do in the US in our industry. When I have worked overseas it was always a 10 hour day with a very large turn around 12 hrs. Whit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Woodcock Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 EU law it's illegal to have less than an 11 hour turn around. For one thing my car insurance becomes invalid if I get less than 11 hours rest. It's not worth it. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VASI Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 10h here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundtrane Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 I wonder why American, Brit and European productions work 12 hours when they come to India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al mcguire Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 How many crew members have we lost to falling asleep driving home after another way too long production day ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 How many crew members have we lost to falling asleep driving home after another way too long production day ? I don't know any that have died, but offhand I can think of a few I know personally that fell asleep and went off the road. At that point, it's kind of a fluke they walked away from the wreck. I've felt better having my boom op in the car on some of those rough drives home. It's been a few years since I did anything like that, but it stuck with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chriskellett Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 http://www.tvweek.com/tvbizwire/2014/07/death-of-crew-member-on-drama/ http://articles.latimes.com/1997-04-16/entertainment/ca-49080_1_time-limits http://www.huffingtonpost.com/haskell-wexler/film-industry-hours-sleep_b_1385766.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirror Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 You should talk to your union about this. Hahahahha! Here in America our union only gives things away instead of gaining ground. All the things that were fought so hard for years ago are now bargaining pieces to give away. When contract negotiations come up, the Corporates bring in teams of attorneys, the union thinks it's a good idea to use "jailhouse" lawyers. The end result is a degradation past contracts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 22, 2014 Report Share Posted November 22, 2014 orion: " Have any of you quit a good paying job due to circumstances like these? " yes... if you are employees, this could violate some labor laws... and what about IATSE or other unions? I know this is non-union, but it could flip, and this and healthcare are the hot-button issues. whit: " JW's father has been a big leader in this with 12 On 12 Off " including banner ads here on JWsoundgroup.net " Our union has not listened to its membership. " actually the IA (HQ) has listened, and despite L600 , 695, and some other locals, the membership wants the OT!! JP: " I don't know any that have died, " you should; Brent Hirscberg died, and there have been many documented close calls and serious accidents. follow the jwsoundgroup.com banner-ad, or find the old threads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 Senator I mean I didn't know any of them personally. I know *of* more than I'm comfortable with. The people I've worked with have all been very fortunate in their accidents. It has solidified the non Union crew around here to demand fair turnarounds on narrative work. Usually 10 hours, but the commute might eat up some of that. I hope that still stands with the current group of non-Union crew members, I don't get to do much narrative these days. The rates have dropped a lot in the last few years. (Topic for another thread) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 JP: " The people I've worked with have all been very fortunate in their accidents. " maybe the productions have been fortunate in their accidents (say compared to "Unclaimed Freight"), but anyone getting into any accident as a result of lack of proper rest is not, IMO, fortunate... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orionflood Posted November 23, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 If they are violating labor laws who do you contact to enforce this, or is my only option to quit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 (edited) Orion: " If they are violating labor laws who do you contact to enforce this, or is my only option to quit? " every jurisdiction has some sort of "department of labor" (typically you must be an employee for labor laws to apply), and in the USA there is OSHA... there are a couple of set safety APPS now, as well with pertinent reporting information. Edited November 23, 2014 by studiomprd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 (you must be an employee for labor laws to apply). I don't know... Are you sure this is true? Labor laws (just like laws generally) should apply to everyone, regardless of employment satus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 Constantin: " Are you sure this is true? " as sure as I am about that SPL thing... actually, I cannot be certain that it applies 100% throughout the entire world, or universe, but typically, and in the USA, labor laws deal with employees and employment. Thus "Independent Contractors" are not normally covered by labor laws; for example, a true IC could work 8 hours personally, and then send in the B team to finish the shift, or perhaps work the long shift, and have the B team report the next morning... that is IC. OTOH, ICs and Professional Corporations (Doctors, Lawyers, etc) fall under a whole lot of other laws... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Constantin Posted November 23, 2014 Report Share Posted November 23, 2014 Constantin: " Are you sure this is true? " as sure as I am about that SPL thing... ... So, you are sure, but wrong anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al mcguire Posted November 25, 2014 Report Share Posted November 25, 2014 I really hope you grow out using emoticons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 25, 2014 Report Share Posted November 25, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjafreddan Posted November 26, 2014 Report Share Posted November 26, 2014 I recently did a fourteen hour event job, corporate bullsh*t, setting up two small stages, sound, light etcetera. Then running sound at the event and at the end of the evening dismantle it all. Drove home at 1 am and definitely wasn't feeling like good driver. The day after I was work-hungover. Man, I'm too old for that kind of sh*t work. But now and then I guess it's okay, pays the bills. Like everybody else points out, it's dangerous to work crazy long hours for an extended period. Stuff gets broken or lost, and people might get hurt (or die). The worked-to-much cold comes like a letter in the mail after such a work period and no one will pay you for the sick leave. The production should at least pay for a motel close to the set, me thinks. Cheers Fred Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.