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Nagra Stories Sound-men won’t ever tell


JBond

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Here's a beaut. this guy has this recorder that's worth $15.00 and 2.00 at a tag sale.  Searched the whole internet couldn’t find it. Found a lot of Nagra’s though.
So let's call this Nagra like / open box condition (even though he doesn't have the box) He has now relisted it at 450.00 1450.00 buy it now. 
I don't know what's worse listing an overpriced Nagra or pretending to list an overprice Nagra.


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So pissed I sold my Nagra D, mine was mint cosmetically but did not work correctly. They are so much smaller in person. Now I'll never be able to get another with the prices they go for.  I didn't know they had such a low hour life span. Now a worn out one will still bring high dollars, should have kept the one I had. 

 

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19 hours ago, JBond said:

So pissed I sold my Nagra D, mine was mint cosmetically but did not work correctly. They are so much smaller in person. Now I'll never be able to get another with the prices they go for.  I didn't know they had such a low hour life span. Now a worn out one will still bring high dollars, should have kept the one I had. 

 

 

I think that the nominal life time of the head assembly is 1500 hours, but I guess that it also depends on the general care for the heads and drum. One of the problems with having a defective Nagra D is that virtually nobody can service them. They are not only quite advanced, but the repair also mostly involve very specialised tools. F.ex. to measure the RF output voltage on the Nagra D, you will need to mount two special clamps on the entry tape guides on the drum assembly. But since there is no picture or description of these tools, it is impossible to find out anything about their function. I am not even sure that Kudelski can do more that rudimentary service.

 

And then, of course, there is the battery. An ancient, probably defunct PAG NiCd battery pack that is required to allow the Nagra D to be powered up. The battery can be charged within the recorder, but it only charges when the machine is turned on, which is a bit of a Catch 22 situation...

 

But even if it is not working, it still is a fine piece of machinery...

 

 

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Upgraded to the Nagra Iv STC in 1988 and immediately started the movie "Dracula's Widow" in Wilmington NC. Followed by the Television mini-series "Noble House". Subsequently the Nagra was used on movies "Heart of Midnight" with Jennifer Jason Lee, "Blood Salvage" with Ray Walston and John Saxon, "Cyborg" starring Jean Claude Van Dam. 
Major commercials that the Nagra was used on include Apple, Microsoft, Acura, General Motors, Coca-Cola, IBM.
 
Here is a partial list of music videos that used this machine:
 
1) Aerosmith "Janie got a Gun" Live version
2) Georgia Sattelites ' Keep you Hand to Yourself"
3) Driving and Crying "Fly Courageous"
4) Stuck Mojo "Rising"
5) Outkast " Miss Jackson"
6) Elton John " The Circle of Life"
7) Arrested Development "Tennesse" and "Mr Wendel"
8)   Smashing  Pumpkins "Live at Six Flags"
9) Bloodhound Gang "Fire Water Burn"
10) Xscape "Just Kickn It"

 

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I have owned and used most all of the models of Nagra from the beginning of my career: Nagra III, Nagra 4, Nagra 4L, Nagra 4.2, Nagra SN, Nagra I-S, Nagra 4-S but never owned (and only used a  few times) the Nagra-STC. The timecode Nagra really came into general use in L.A. with commercials since it was commercial production that started to use, then demanded the use of timecode for all shoots (these shoots, of course, we're all on film and generally used timecode slates). When this change came, television commercials were able to do away with the daily transfers of ¼" tape to mag film for editing and completion. The dailies could be assembled directly in telecine utilizing timecoded ¼" production track and film print. When all this happened, it cut out about 70% of the transfer work we had been doing at Northstar Media for television commercials. At that time, I was solidly doing feature films and rarely doing commercials, but I did have to rent a Nagra 4-STC (and learn how to use it!) to do those commercials. Northstar Media did purchase a Harvey-modded Nagra 4-S for transfers  ---  that's the closest I ever got to owning one. Feature films, at that time, rarely if ever utilized timecode  ---  I was able to use my Nagra 4.2 on every movie until I was no longer using it (served as a backup in the early days of DAT). I can 't remember what the first movie I did that required timecode slates. 

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And that was a good move getting a Harvey Mod IV-S vs the factory IVS-TC.  Harvey's system was much better than Kudelski's for a working soundie.  Re: the Nagra "D": nice sound but "too" everything: too big, too heavy, too expensive, recordings too nonstandard for regular production sound, and not enough tracks to make it worthwhile.  I was making very good sounding digital recordings with far greater post-prod compatibility at that time using a Sony F1, a porto VHS deck and my analog cart mixer as the front end.  (And if I used a "hifi" type deck got 4 channels of record: 2 digital + two in the hifi channels.)  Then DAT came along, and the industry went to that for portable digital recording (esp for anything that had to be telecined) within about a year.

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  • 4 weeks later...

This is one for those who have not seen the Nagra II wind-up recorder the first time around. What a great sound this 2nd Nagra "tube" recorder has for 1957,…. Or is it just movie magic?  All others nothing to see here.

 

 

 

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Thanks, yes it is in pristine condition. The most expensive recorder in my collection.

Just to be clear as Philip already knows the video of the Nagra II is just a video of the recorder with the reels turning under windup power. Even though it's all electronically complete and clean the tubes require special batteries to run. The motor is run only by the wind-up crank.

The music was added to the video by an iPhone not coming from the Nagra recorder itself. The turning on, adjusting the volume up showing the speaker even mentioning the "tube sound" was all intended to make it look like it was playing back the recording. 

A trick I learned here on Jwsound. I think the quote was 

 

"The sound you hear in movies is not always what you think it is."

 

I could have done a better job with it, like raising the sound level as the camera panned the speaker area and lowering the sound level when moving away from the speaker. I was also overacting turning the volume up. No one was there to say cut. There was no post-editing I did get the turning on and off pretty good thanks to being a reel machine as the sound did not have to be instant. 

But it was a low-cost, nonpaying, nonunion job on a stinking hot day when the sound mixer did not show up for work. The cameraman and producer were both drinking.  And to top it off I'm not even in the movie business. (raise arms) walk out of the room. cut, tape, print, post it.

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

 

 

 

 

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https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-Early-Nagra-SN-Prototype/184324103897?hash=item2aea929ed9:g:quEAAOSwwxxe4GOK

 

 

 

Clearly, this seller does not read Jwsound.  There was only one prototype and it was never sold and it didn’t look anything like that he is selling.

 But there Is that JFK reference at work again. Another one falls for it.  I wonder how many Sn's were sold based on that false Black Series reference. Every Nagra SN made was a commercially available model from day one!! And the first Nagra SN made was in Dec 1970, first one sold in 1971.

The correct eBay description should read, This is the  (87th or 97th?) Nagra SN made sometime in 1972 before they started silkscreening the decks.

 

Unfortunately, it also has been defaced and modified to be more like a later model SN. since they drilled a hole through the serial number for a later Nagra accessory.   The lid and bottom cover are not original to a 1972 no name Nagra SN but from a later year SN. The lid has the tell-tail silkscreen directions on the inside and is not the flat light gray paint that Nagra used in 1972. 

I seriously doubt the black case or anything included is original to 1972. 
I hope someone doesn't pay 6,900 based on his description and thinks this is the JFK designed Black series.  It's just a 1972 deck updated to a later SN that was put together from scrap later model parts. The early model SN's had the serial number stamped on the deck, the lid and the bottom cover.

The seller is just getting his information thats been out there for many decades on line, can't really blame him.

 

 

373 New The Nagra Story, updated  Feb 2018      

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

This whole thread has been so very entertaining, informational and even inspirational to a younger dude like myself. I just wanted to do a little happy dance and share the Nagra III I got today. I know its pretty beat up but I'm hoping it will power on and I can clean the heads. Fortunately there was no battery installed and it was at least stored with the lid closed but sadly the tape was never removed and that has caused some head damage.

 

Other than some casual reading of the first 1/2 or so of the thread I have zero Nagra knowledge. I do have a Teac 6300 but never used a Nagra.

 

I don't want to hijack this thread but if someone could point me to a few good resources for manuals or parts I'd really appreciate it and get out of the way of this thread.

 

Pics for attention :)

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No Hijack at all, this is what this thread is all about, Thanks for posting. 
Look's like you found yourself a nice 1960 Nagra III.
The five hundred and sixty-ninth Nagra III ever made. That does not look beat up at all, just dirty. 
 
Beat up is scratches dings, dents, and scrapes on the body and nameplates. All problems you can't remove.  I don't see any of that. You will be very surprised at how nice that will clean up. A little gentle soap some pledge a dozen Q-tips. Some solvent  to remove the tape marks on deck. Don't try rubbing that off, soften in up and remove it, otherwise you will leave a mark around where the tape was.

On the plastic lid some plastic polish then ONLY on what scratches remain with some 800-1500 grit sandpaper ONLY on the scratches followed again by plastic polish a little at a time.
Vintage Nagra's clean very up well.

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That is an Israeli Intelligence installation of a lock system on their SNST spy recorders. Developed so you can double lock the control lever in the on or off position when using the recorder in espionage situations. To make sure the recorder would not accidentally shut off if bumped and / or keep it locked in its stopped position. It's not a Nagra option or installation. It's an Israeli made upgrade to suit their needs. I don't know the reason for the brass roller it may have a purpose or maybe they couldn't get the replacement part and may have made their own. Did the recorder come from Israel

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I didn’t think it was a Nagra mod. Looks too crude. I've had it many years, forgotten where it came from.

 

btw I worked for Hayden Labs, the UK Nagra agents, from 1969 to 1975. The first SN we had was to be demonstrated to a UK government dept. It developed a motor fault. I had the job of flying to the factory, get it fixed and fly back! We always knew the SN as the Small Nagra.

 

At a APRS show, where the SN was first shown, I met Stefan Kudelski and was told to introduce him to Ray Dolby!

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Welcome to Nagra Stories Ashley Booth.


Wow, Very interesting, so you were right there in the very early years when the SN was born. 

I'm sure you have many stories you can add to this thread from back in the day when you worked at Hayden Laboratories. People with that knowledge as yourself are few and far between on this subject. 

Anything you can add about your years at Hayden Laboratories/ Nagra, the Nagra Sn, or Stefan Kudelski  would be very much appreciated.

 

Below is the only document from Hayden that I have from the time period of your employment and a DB magazine article from that time. 
Thank you, Mr. Booth


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Note: 
Date of magazine December 1970. The recorder in the picture is my 1972 Sn Serial # 811 it was manufactured in June 1972. 

1972 is the first year the SN-S (slow) model was introduced. 
Picture replicates what the New 1970 SN's looked like at the time and through 1972.

In late 1972 or early 1973, Nagra started RED silkscreening on the deck. 

 

Magazine in picture from American Cinematographer December 19707eGqPur.jpg

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