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2 mics, 1 blimp (Not M/S or ORTF)


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Is anyone here using 1 mono shotgun/hyper and 1 stereo mic housed together in 1 blimp?

 

I'm considering placing a stereo mic like the AT BP4025 underneath a CS-3e in the same blimp to capture stereo along with mono. Seems like a simpler way to do it than M/S for times when the post guys aren't comfortable with decoding M/S.

 

I suppose this means there'll be two (three?) cables out of the blimp (3 pin XLR for CS-3e and set of 3 pin XLRs for BP4025).

 

I'd be recording onto 3 channels, but it seems like a handy setup for docs or to get FX with the option of a little stereo ambience with it.

 

What do you guys reckon?

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Heavy.... If post in uneasy about ms, then perhaps a little googling in the subject would be if assistance? I don't mean to sound rude, but M/S has easy and lightweight solutions for what you want to accomplish. Your solution would work too, bit it'd be heavy and getting the cables inside the blimp and out on the pole.. I foresee a mess of cables... :S

But go ahead and try!

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I think your solution is good, but yes, the cables may be difficult to manage.

 

If your post guys are uneasy about M/S then they need a career change. You don't even need a plug-in to "decode" it. In my studio days, recording instruments in M/S was pretty standard practice, and we "decoded" it manually on analogue boards every day. Takes seconds to do :)

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You should not have to come up with original ideas and carry more equipment just because the person at post does not know how to do his/her job properly. MS is very simple to grasp actually. 

 

But if you really must then I suppose you can use a 7pin XLR instead of having to carry multiple cables and connectors but that alone is pretty heavy too....

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Thanks for the thoughts so far.

 

Yeah, I agree, M/S is simple and should be routine in many cases. I'm based in Pakistan though, and no one here is trained for it, and neither are they at all interested in being, unfortunately. 

 

Regarding the weight of my technique, it'll be handheld with a pistol grip on the blimp as it's mainly for gathering FX with a little ambience in some cases, so weight won't be a HUGE issue as I won't be booming with it.

 

If I do go down the M/S road though, would a CS-3e be okay as the Mid? I hope it's not TOO directional and leaves the S (maybe an MKH30?) sounding out of place.

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I've had good luck in odd situations with a hyper and a mono omni at the same point. If post doesn't know what to do, tell them to use whichever track sounds best to them (it'll probably be the hyper). If post is knowledgable and your reports get to them(!), they can do interesting phase tricks to get a spatial sense that collapses nicely in mono.

 

It's not true m/s... you need a figure-8 for that.

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OK, I'll chime in. There may be all sorts of reasons that a filmmaker, editor or post sound decides he has no use for an S channel, so one needn't assume that because MS fits nicest in a rycote basket that its the one and only way to provide a stereo solution. If the boom is moving about to follow a subject on its M channel then the S probably isn't going to be such a pleasant or useful element anyway. On the other hand, a (static) compact XY mic might well provide some decent and useful (non dialogue) stereo recordings of things such as atmoses or scenes showing specific actions going on ... it depends purely on whether you're providing something that's wanted. I've considered myself piggybacking my Audio Technica 822 into a rycote with a shotgun/hyper/cardioid as a mono or centre mic for FX but never got around to trying it (since that mic has been out on almost permanant loan for ages). Cabling needn't be a particular hassle (a stereo connbox, stereo lead for balanced Centre and unbalanced 822 stereo, then breakout at the recorder for that setup - easy). It might well be a good idea for a situation where you were shooting a good mix of talking shots and things-happening shots. On the other hand I would ALWAYS find out from 'the filmmaker' what is absolutely required (usually a good clean -mono- track with all the talking clear and rosy) and provide them with options for the specific project. I'd be quite astonished if anyone dealing with post wasn't familiar with the MS technique if they're working with more than one track: after all, you know how to exploit it, why wouldn't others. If especially they're doing a broadcast mix requiring mono folddown they may ask you for MS. Don't second guess them?

 

In short, I reckon it could be a perfectly decent arrangement for certain processes. I think I would be cautious of always running the three tracks though: just bring the XY stereo channel in for (static boom) shots where it is of obvious use.

 

Best, Jez

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Maybe Just use an MS setup and record it decoded? If you use XY, ORTF or AB you give post 2 (in)coincidental tracks as well, so why bother giving them a raw M and S track? You could give them a Left and Right.... No decoding, and you can deside how wide you'd like to let it sound.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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When I record stereo backgrounds with a MS setup, I will only send post raw tracks after confirming they know what to do with it.

Else I'll decode it and send them XY.

If they want to monoize it then, they can simply pan both to center. That way the S part vanishes automatically and they get precisely the M signal I was getting from the M mic.

 

Of course, when it's mostly about mono dialog and I have to boom it with an MS mic, I'll turn down the S channel completely.

 

If I want to give them clean mono dialog (boom) and stereo background, I'd rather have a fixed stereo mic somewhere else. It is very distracting to have a stereo image move around all the time, even if it would match picture.

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