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ADVICE please! Buy a 744t or Zoom f8?


Freeman

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Thanks so much for your replies! 

I have been reading a huge number of reviews and I know the theoretical ins and outs of both machines, but it's incredibly helpful to have all of your advice on this particular issue as many of you have way way more experience with this stuff than I do. It's immensely appreciated. Jose your review was fantastic, and really the only thing I've read about the f8 which I've actually taken seriously. It was actually what prompted me to seriously consider it as an option.

I've operated the 744t before, and I'm in agreement that it's a solid machine. The zoom f8 does look amazing on paper though, and I'm hindered by a limited budget. For me it's only a matter of getting something that will allow me to perform well at my job and bring me more work. 

As I mentioned I have a 442 which I'll be running as my front end, so preamps and integrated mixer functionality aren't so much of an issue.

Just to clarify, I live in Australia, so the zoom f8 is gonna cost me around $1600AUD (>$1200usd) after shipping, tax and the good old old "you live in australia" surcharge :P

It's good to know I can resell it to one of you guys if I dont end up hanging onto it though :)

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For many small jobs a 744T will be just perfect and sufficient, such as docu/interviews etc., even without a mixer on the front end. If you get bigger productions at some point there should be enough budget to buy something suitable then. I wouldn't do a production that needs lots of ISOs on an F8 at this point. Maybe later when it is a bit proven and improved.

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I'm thinking of getting a F8 to pair with my SQN4s, it'll give me iso's & mix tracks ability. But then, not too keen on being a beta tester for zoom..

If I had a 744t offered for the same price I'd go for that because as Mr B said more or less, it's a proven workhorse.

Grant.

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- Headphone amp has a lot of coloration, which can be misleading when monitoring on the field.

Hi José, can you be more specific about this coloration? Exaggerated bass, muffled highs? Is it that much of a problem? Is there a possibility that the headphones interacted with the recorder in a bad way? I ask this because I have encountered situations where headphones  behaved very  differently according to the characteristics of the equipment it was attached to. Not that it changed completely the sound, but it was sufficient to be noticed. If, perhaps, the coloration of the F8 is exaggerated, it will be indeed a game stopper. 

Thanks. 

Edited by minduout
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Hi José, can you be more specific about this coloration? Exaggerated bass, muffled highs? Is it that much of a problem? Is there a possibility that the headphones interacted with the recorder in a bad way? I ask this because I have encountered situations where headphones  behaved very  differently according to the characteristics of the equipment it was attached to. Not that it changed completely the sound, but it was sufficient to be noticed. If, perhaps, the coloration of the F8 is exaggerated, it will be indeed a game stopper. 

Thanks. 

Hi,

I can't remember exactly what the sound was like monitoring through the F8, except for it sounding too mid-range-y, if you know what I mean. It was a combination of things I guess. I was monitoring using the Remote Audio HN-7506, which uses the same drivers as the Sony MDR-7506. And I monitored on location both the F8 and the 744T with the same signal chains. The latter sounded clean and transparent while the former had lots of coloration.

Initially I thought it was the pre amps, until I got back home and monitored the recordings, and noticed that F8 recordings sounded clean and transparent as well, comparable to that of the 744T's (though I still like the 744T's pre amps a bit better).

I think initially it can be a serious problem, as ideally you would be monitoring exactly what you're recording, but I suppose that if you get used to the coloration and how it translates to the recordings, you could probably get away with it with time. I personally would rather not.

Cheers,

José

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Everyone is going to have a different opinion based on different things that are important to them. The F8 might have more tracks and features but be aware that it is a budget item, and will have budget item problems eventually. Not to mention the fact that you may get some flack for using a Zoom instead of SD, Zaxcom, etc. Personally, I believe that if you intend to be serious about your work, I'd get a more serious machine. The 744 is a tank like everyone has mentioned, and at that price it is hard to pass up. It still might not be the right machine for you though. Maybe you should ride out your DR680 a little longer and save for what is the right machine for you if that is the case. Just remember that the general rule in the pro audio world is that you get what you pay for. I wouldnt put my trust in that Zoom, even if it were made by SD. A reputable company like SD will tell you that if they have to make a product fit a certain very low budget point, they will have to sacrifice quality, and this is evident in all kinds of budget equipment, even if it is made by a reputable manufacturer. 

Either way, if it has to be between the Zoom and the 744, I'd go for the 744 all the way. 

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How hard is it to swap out a HP amp? Bussman was offering upgrades to the dr-680 mic pres. If the mic pres in the zoom are good but the HP amp is rough there could be a work round making this small, light tracker a useful addition to a kit (even if doesn't have the branding and reputation of more expensive machines).

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Hi,

I can't remember exactly what the sound was like monitoring through the F8, except for it sounding too mid-range-y, if you know what I mean. It was a combination of things I guess. I was monitoring using the Remote Audio HN-7506, which uses the same drivers as the Sony MDR-7506. And I monitored on location both the F8 and the 744T with the same signal chains. The latter sounded clean and transparent while the former had lots of coloration.

Initially I thought it was the pre amps, until I got back home and monitored the recordings, and noticed that F8 recordings sounded clean and transparent as well, comparable to that of the 744T's (though I still like the 744T's pre amps a bit better).

I think initially it can be a serious problem, as ideally you would be monitoring exactly what you're recording, but I suppose that if you get used to the coloration and how it translates to the recordings, you could probably get away with it with time. I personally would rather not.

Cheers,

José

Hi José, thank you for your response.

I think I can live with some coloration and in fact I count on it in some situations. Dependind on the job I use a different pair of heaphones knowing its frequency response will help me identify something that will get me in trouble at post. E.g., when capturing ambience I like to use the AKG 414p (wich is designed for on-stage monitoring). Because of its pronounced bass, it allows me to identify excessive noise that can ruin the take. It also has some sort of compression of the dynamics (I think because of the closed back design combined with its small cup) that help me distinguish unwanted backgound noise more accuratedly. These headphones are tuned for identifying airplanes coming far beyond the horizon... :)

Reading my post again I could see that I was being obvious, as the headphones behaving differently according to the equipment is the very definition of HP amp coloring... what I really was trying to say is that if it's not exaggerated it is a thing you can live with, as you pointed out.

Best regards and sorry for my bad english.

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IMO it is pretty exaggerated the difference between what you're monitoring and what you're actually recording. But alas, not the worst problem to have I suppose.

Best thing I can recommend is for anyone interested to test it out for themselves.

Edited by Jose Frias
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I think, as JonG said, "upgrading" from the 680 to the F8 is not really much of an upgrade, except for TC. 

The 680/442 combo provides 4 high quality isos and a (stereo) mix. There's no real advantage with the F8, except for TC. But with it again, you can record 4 isos and a mix from your 442. is having TC worth all that money to you? 

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Check out the Zoom F8 in about 8 months or so after it has been beta tested and hopefully corrected. It has a lot of problems and does not live up to their specs. On the other hand,I own a 744T and it has never let me down. Dependability is of course, mucho important. We don't know about the F8 yet----wait.

 

                                                                                                                                     J.D.

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Gonna try one out for this years North Shore surf season, just what the doctor ordered running around on the beach chasing surfers with potential salt water / salt air hazards.

The recorder as an expendable....., it is great all the new tools we have available...

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Hello Everyone,

My name is Samuel. I'm a product specialist at Zoom North America. I am here to answer any questions anyone may have, and hear feedback about the new Zoom F8 Field Recorder.

Thank you

All things look good about the product, preamp quality, user interface, time code accuracy, (presumed) rugged aluminum chassis, but I think the thing that most professionals would have issue with is the unit is lack of a mixing surface.  Most of us are excited about the size and weight of the unit, not so much about the price (although that's nice too).  I'm purchasing one for situations which would otherwise be a "bag drop" where I'm not mixing anyways, like white water rafting, kayaking, etc... but the ability to add a mixing controller would open up this unit for more mainstream use.  Adding a mixer to the F8 like a Sound Devices 442, mostly eliminates the size and weight advantage of the F8.

I'd also criticize the use of 1/4" connectors for line level input.  Digital AES would have been best, but completely not expected at this price point.  I like the 8 full size XLR connectors but dislike having to utilize 1/4" for the high impedance input.

 

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All things look good about the product, preamp quality, user interface, time code accuracy, (presumed) rugged aluminum chassis, but I think the thing that most professionals would have issue with is the unit is lack of a mixing surface.  Most of us are excited about the size and weight of the unit, not so much about the price (although that's nice too).  I'm purchasing one for situations which would otherwise be a "bag drop" where I'm not mixing anyways, like white water rafting, kayaking, etc... but the ability to add a mixing controller would open up this unit for more mainstream use.  Adding a mixer to the F8 like a Sound Devices 442, mostly eliminates the size and weight advantage of the F8.

I'd also criticize the use of 1/4" connectors for line level input.  Digital AES would have been best, but completely not expected at this price point.  I like the 8 full size XLR connectors but dislike having to utilize 1/4" for the high impedance input.

 

Hello Tom,

Thank you for your thoughts. We are taking feedback on this unit very seriously and the lack of a functional mixing surface it a comment we are hearing in multiple places. We are currently looking into some changes that could provide better mixing functionality. For the time being, if you have an iOS device available, the Bluetooth connected app provides a great mixing surface with a lot of controls and metering.

I also hear your feedback on the 1/4" connectors and will keep it in mind as we look to improve the F8 as well as future products.

Thanks

"1/4" for the high impedance input."

High Z... as in a 100k ohm 'instrument input'? If that's what the F8's 1/4" inputs are for .. a deal breaker for me and totally useless for most pro sound mixers.. Samual?

Hello Rick,

The 1/4" input is for Line Level Sources.

Thanks

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Since many people who would be in the market for the F8 would be solo-bag-recordists, I think the mixing surface could prob wait a bit.  The thing nearly all digital recordists need on every job is a way to enter and edit metadata, and having the machine be able to generate its own sound report is a major plus too.  Audio files that are undocumented or improperly documented are just one step from not existing at all.

p

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