I need a wireless solution - what system would be right for me?

[tim apter]

I live in South Africa and shoot mainly low budget tv shows (magazine/culture/lifestyle/youth etc), and the occasional documentary or corporate gig.

For a long time Ive been making do with rental gear and amateur gear, but the gear is unreliable and makes ME look unreliable too. So Im trying to put together my own kit with the money Ive saved from the jobs Ive been doing. What I already got is:

1 x Sennheiser 416p48 with Rycote Softy and Pistol Grip

1 x Oktava MK-012 with foam cover (havent needed anything more for the interiors Ive done). Shock mounting is with the Pistol Grip (416 and Oktava have same diameter)

1 x Sennheiser HD212pro Headphones

1 x Lightwave Internally Cabled Boom - its kinda heavy, but it gets the job done, is made well, and saves me gym fees.

A bunch of well made canford audio xlr cables, adaptors and bits and pieces.

2 x Sony UWP-C1 Wireless Kits (with supplied, horrible, lavs)

The main weakness there are the wireless, which constantly pump hiss (due to the companders?). Im pretty happy with the other sutff.

Im thinking I need the following to make the kit servicable, and hopefully good, for general, small scale work:

2 x Sennheiser Ew100G2 kits, with a plug on transmitter - Im going to keep the supplied mics as back ups.

1 x Sound Devices 302 mixer (with case and return cable, naturally)

1 x RE50 (for the odd presenter interview type situation, wireless)

2 x Countryman B6 OR Sanken COS-11 Lavs - If I can get hardwired with break ins for wireless use, that would be brilliant.

My questions are:

Will Sennheiser G2 be good enough for low to medium end TV and Documentary work?

Would I be better off with the Sanken or the Countryman lavs? The work I do is around 50/50 hidden/visible lavs, but will the better quality of the Sanken help even out weaknesses with the G2?

Will it be possible for me to get hardwired lavs also running wireless by putting a break-in plug in the cable? Is this a stupid idea?

I really appreciate any feedback.. if you dont think Im aiming high enough with the gear Ive listed here, please tell me that. I do have budget limitations, Im basically aiming for a strong, reliable, good kit.

Thanks,

Tim

[jason porter]

Most of your current kit is OK for what you are doing.

Definitely add a quality mixer to your setup...it is essential!

I have used the Sennheiser G2's with moderate success...the range I got varied from 50 feet to over 300 feet.  They sound Ok, but I don't think they would sound better than what you currently own, plus the Sony's have a diversity receiver which may help to get you more "range."  I haven't used the Sony's but I have read user comments that put them up beyond the G2's.

Does the Sony have a volume setting/gain setting on the transmitter?  Maybe it is set incorrectly, causing the "pumping" of the limiter (or compander) in the transmitter.  You should be able to buy wired lavs and add the proper breakaway to use them for wireless as well.

I have used the Sankens with the G2's, definite improvement in sound quality (and still easy to hide)

[tim apter]

thanks... i almost always shoot with the sound devices 302 or 442, but will be buying a 302 very soon.

The transmitter has only an attenuation setting, starting at 0db, then -3, -6 etc. The lower I put the attenuation, the worse the breathing. but even on 0db its horrible.

with the breakaway option, im actually thinking about inserting the plug between the power supply and the mic (as the cables on hardwired units are mostly very long, and the power tube would get in the way). Im not sure if this could work...

thanks for the feedback

[Philip Perkins]

You should really get a mixer if you can--I like the 302 and use a pair of them all the time.  Next are the wirelesses--what you have may be OK (not familiar w/ them), but the lav mics could really use an upgrade.  However, since you have to order B6 lavs connectorized for the transmitters you are using, it would be great if you could decide whether or not you will be changing wireless systems BEFORE you upgrade the lavs, or you will have to have their connectors changed (don't try doing this on B6s yourself).  Try the suggestions made above to see if you have your current wirelesses' gain structure set up right, then do some walk-testing and see if the range is acceptable, then consider upgrading the mics.

Philip Perkins

[tim apter]

yup, love the 302, use it all the time, i wouldnt dream of shooting minus a mixer - im just sick and tired of rental.

as far as the UWP, im really confused - surely a very noticable breathing hiss in my headphones cant be normal? Im checking settings, but there really is only the attenuation option to consider so i dont really get it. Ive tried all the attenuation settings, and its just not improving.  I will only commit to mics once I commit to a wireless system, im just wondering if the breathing hiss isnt coming from the mic? is that something that could happen? it isnt a constant hiss, it climbs and dips with the volume of the audio coming into the unit.

to be honest, with the work i do, I seldom get more than 10 meters away from the person with the transmitter, and its usually line of sight too.

Philip, if you had to choose one lav, would you get the B6 or the COS11?

[larry long]

I love the Sankens BTW

[Rob Braxton]

Lav's for wireless require different powering than hardwire to mixer input.  B6 examples at http://www.trewaudio.com/catalog/subcat156.htm  -  Countryman makes an adapter to convert from 48V to wireless.  Note prices - Lemo is $50 more than XLR version.    Check Sanken web page and Countryman links from Trew Audio. "Links"      Maybe check out Tram lav too.  I have Tram, SonoTrim & B6 - like them all but want COS 11 eventually when I go wireless.  Rob Braxton

[Eric Toline]

You can order any Countryman mic as a combo set. Meaning you can use it wired or wireless. The Sennheiser G2 will work just fine for your needs. The Sanken is not "better quality", it just sounds different than other lavs.

Eric

[Ian Thomson]

hi Tim,

I'll chime in with my opinion on the sony radios.

I agree with you whole-heartedly. even with a better mic (I used 2 sets on a low-budget feature in January, mics 'upgraded' to DPA 4060) they still have horrible 'companding' noises.

There is a slight improvement though, so if you can only afford to improve the mics, I'd get those first, see if it suits your need, and upgrade the wireless later.

I can't remember if the wiring on sony UWP is the same as the sennheiser, if so - then awesome, less re-tooling costs.

as for the G2s, they work quite well for doco/news when in close proximity, run for a long time on 2 x AA batts (just like the sonys) and in my opinion sound MUCH better than the sonys.

best of luck

Ian

yup, love the 302, use it all the time, i wouldnt dream of shooting minus a mixer - im just sick and tired of rental.

as far as the UWP, im really confused - surely a very noticable breathing hiss in my headphones cant be normal? Im checking settings, but there really is only the attenuation option to consider so i dont really get it. Ive tried all the attenuation settings, and its just not improving.  I will only commit to mics once I commit to a wireless system, im just wondering if the breathing hiss isnt coming from the mic? is that something that could happen? it isnt a constant hiss, it climbs and dips with the volume of the audio coming into the unit.

to be honest, with the work i do, I seldom get more than 10 meters away from the person with the transmitter, and its usually line of sight too.

Philip, if you had to choose one lav, would you get the B6 or the COS11?

[Philip Perkins]

I have both B6s and CO11s (and a few other types as well).  We use the B6s almost all the time these days--I like the sound and the thin wire and small head make them faster to hide.

Philip Perkins

[tim apter]

Thanks for all the feedback folks... I appreciate it.

Ian - see, thats exactly the response Ive been looking for. I KNOW they have nasty companders, but this fact isnt mentioned ANYWHERE on the web. Its like a big Sony cover up. Most threads I read have alternating Sony / Sennheiser praise, but quite honestly, I hate my Sonys and cant understand why so many people use them here in SA on medium to low budget work. And as Senn/Sony wiring goes, dammit, they aint the same - reversed pins or something like that.

Regarding the mics, I think Im going to go with Sanken for a couple reasons - my next shotgun upgrade will probably be to CS3e and Ive heard they cut well together, I want to start with what seems to be regarded as the best sounding lav in the field, and size isnt a major concern right now. Ive been working with lavs the size of bricks on the Sony kit (as they havent yet been upgraded). I can always add two B6's to my equipment later this year when the Sankens have paid for themselves.

As far as wireless, Im going to take the Sonys to the Sony office here and have them checked out to ensure nothing is wrong with them. But even if I have a LITTLE bit of doubt, Im going to get a full Senn G2 kit - 2 Tx, 2 Rx, 1 Plug on Tx (at B&H they are throwing in an RE50 and a pelican for free with this, so its seems a good deal)

Hopefully I can get the Sankens to work both hardwired and wireless by use of a breakin - Im going to talk to the engineering guys at the local gear house and get their opinions, cuz ultimately, Ill pay them to do it. Im no electrical genius.

If anyone else has any feedback for me, Id like to hear it.. thanks for your advice

[ptalsky]

Hey Tim,

Don't forget that the plug on Tx in the low-level G2 kit does not provide Phantom power, so if that's important, you'll need to upgrade to the higher level Tx.  Other than that, I still say go B6 first.  ;-)  But that's just me.

Phil

[tim apter]

thanks phil, i havent forgotten. The only conceivable use Id have for the plug on is for wireless stick mics (like the RE50), or at a stretch a battery powered shotgun (like the Me66 i never use). I dont really think its worth it for me to put the (considerable) extra cash into the phantom unit, i wont use phantom on it ever really.

What wireless are you using at the moment Phil?