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Would a Sanken CS-1 be a smart upgrade for me?


IronFilm

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I've got my eye on a secondhand Sanken CS-1 that I'm considering buying. Wondering if it would be a wise decision for me, currently have a RODE NTG2 & Sennheiser ME66/K6 (& Oktava MK-012 hypercardiod I can freely borrow whenever from a friend just around the corner) paired with a Sound Devices 552 / Tascam DR680 combo.

I'd originally been thinking my next upgrade would be to get a RODE NTG3 (as is practically speaking almost identical to the 416, but cheaper) as it would mean a substantial upgrade from the NTG2 (or ME66/K6) and is a mic which would last me a very long time. And then next after that would be to get an Audix SCX1-HC (as the upgrade from the Oktava). 

However I have spotted a secondhand Sanken CS-1 at a reasonable price (this is the older CS-1, not the newer CS-1e), and am half wondering if that could be a smart idea to get instead/beforehand? It seems like it could also perform well both indoors and outdoors? Not sure, am struggling to find much info about it online. 

My (almost) complete gear list is here for context, if it is relevant (maybe there is some other gap I should be focusing on instead?):
http://ironfilm.co.nz/sound/

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27 minutes ago, AnuarYahya said:

I also would not bother with the NTG3.. its a good mic if you want a battle mic that can get wet or banged up.

Well that is exactly why I was originally considering it as my next microphone to prioritize, because like the 416 it is a dependable workorse mic that should always be useful to have as a back up for many years to come. 

I've already recently had a shoot which was a massive struggle because there was this few meters square patch of area which I had substantial RF interference inside that small region so I had to dance around it while struggling to pick up the actors line. As neither my NTG2 or ME66 could handle it, this situation would've been perfect with a 416 (or NTG3) as I could've used it in that interference zone to clearly pick up the dialogue. 

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28 minutes ago, JonG said:

Don't take baby steps

Agreed. The NTG3 would be a baby step from what you already have. So would the CS-1. 

Save up some more and get a 416, or a used CS3e. 

You already have two cheaper shotguns that could be used as backup or "battle" mics when you upgrade... Why get a third? Upgrade instead to something that you'd be proud to use at any stage of your career and don't look back. 

-Mike

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...basically, what the guys before me said...

I owned a couple of CS-1 mics a long time ago, but sold them when I realized they'd probably never be deployed.  

They're decent mics, but anywhere I might have used them is also prime territory for my Schoeps, and the Schoeps sound so much better. 

If you're making enough income that it's time to upgrade, get what you really need, not something you have to settle for.  If a proper purchase isn't justified yet, make your current gear work harder for you so you can afford to upgrade when the time comes.

 

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I too owned an original CS1 (ie- not CS1e). A bit of self noise, quite directional, nice and short. It was OK but I wasn't using it much, sold it to a guy who wanted a better on-camera mic that was directional and short enough to stay out of the picture (which I think was part of the original CS1 design spec). 

For your RF issues, what sort of cable were you running from the mic to your mixer? Perhaps (and just perhaps) something built with good star quad and a Neutrik EMC connector would help?

http://www.neutrik.com/en/xlr/emc-series/nc3fxx-emc-b 

I just googled up the mic and see that Ty Ford (who hangs out here) has a review. I skimmed...seems like a good review (as usual from Ty):

http://tyfordaudiovideo.blogspot.com/2012/03/sanken-cs-1-short-shotgun-but-is-it.html

Of course it depends on the type of work you do and want to do. But if it were me, I'd pass on the CS1, keep the NTG2 (not a terrible mic, especially for the price), and sell the ME66 (which I've never liked). Put the money towards a mic you can hold onto for a long time...and of course consider used if you can buy from a trusted source. 

Good luck... Let us know what you decide to do!

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3 hours ago, Jim Feeley said:

For your RF issues, what sort of cable were you running from the mic to your mixer? Perhaps (and just perhaps) something built with good star quad and a Neutrik EMC connector would help?

 

I tried swapping out with other cables, even the shortest one at hand, wasn't any help :-/ 

 

3 hours ago, Jim Feeley said:

But if it were me, I'd pass on the CS1, keep the NTG2 (not a terrible mic, especially for the price), and sell the ME66 (which I've never liked). 

I thought the ME66 is kinda a little better? The advantages of the ME66 against the NTG2: cleaner sound, more natural, more directional, higher output level, more sensitive. Plus the K6 powering unit gives me the flexibility to pick up all sorts of different microphones to use with it in the future. 

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I've always considered the ME66 as "student grade" mics, along with the NTG1 and NTG 2. The NTG-3 is wider in pattern than the MKH416, but sounds good. But I agree, your next step should be a DPA 4017, Schoeps CMIT, Sennheiser 4060. Or maybe a DPA 4018 or Schoeps CMC641. Then you'll start hearing a difference on every piece of work you do.

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20 hours ago, IronFilm said:

I thought the ME66 is kinda a little better? The advantages of the ME66 against the NTG2: cleaner sound, more natural, more directional, higher output level, more sensitive. Plus the K6 powering unit gives me the flexibility to pick up all sorts of different microphones to use with it in the future. 

Maybe it is... Maybe 15 years ago I ended up with a ME66 from someone who owed me some money... I didn't really like it and sold it. Then many years later I heard NTG2 tracks and thought they weren't as bad as expected. So my expectations were different. I think Ty's right that they're in the same general class... And my thought was that the ME66 is more expensive and could perhaps fetch more on the used market... Seems like you don't need both a NTG2 and a ME66...and though I recall some people liked the ME64 hyper capsule that works with the K6, like just about everyone here, at least consider a big step up. 

And note that an expensive mic will last you a long time and is likely to maintain value if you decide to sell it used (and hence, used prices aren't as low as you'd like). When I bought a Schoeps CMC541 years ago, it made my work better (and easier...great off axis response)... (I could probably say the same about my 416, but I started off with that so didn't experience a jump compared with what I was using earlier). 

As for which more expensive mic or mics to buy... lots of opinions and discussions here on JWS about that. 

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On 10/21/2016 at 5:04 AM, Jim Feeley said:

I think Ty's right that they're in the same general class... And my thought was that the ME66 is more expensive and could perhaps fetch more on the used market... Seems like you don't need both a NTG2 and a ME66

Ah thank you, that makes sense why to sell that one over the other.

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+1 for the Sanken CS3e.  It is a really good "longer" shotgun but still works remarkably well on interiors if you aren't shooting in a tiny tile bathroom.  But no matter what, light-years ahead of your current choices.  These were the only "film" mics I kept when I retired.  I use them for audience mics on live music recordings.

D.

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I had the CS-1E for a while and was impressed with the hot signal, reach and compactness.. I felt in needed a low cut though and ended up passing it on to a friend when I got my MKH8060.. I still kind of miss it though, with a Rycote Tacit it probably would have been a winner. I think the older CS-1 had a higher noise floor than the E?

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