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Derek H

Lavs for ties

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The tie knot rig... we do it all the time and it often sounds mediocre. I guess this is a two part post. 

 

One: what’s your favorite lav for mounting in a tie knot? That is, up near the throat, pointing down. For example, at some point I remember reading that someone really liked Sennheiser MKE2s in ties. (Robert Sharman maybe?)

 

Two: lav designers/manufacturers... why not consider making a special lav just for tie knot rigs? Something small and with a well designed sound to compensate for the generally terrible sound that the tie knot placement produces. I know lavaliers are not generally designed for stuffing in a tie right under a guy’s chin but that’s what we’re doing with them. 

 

Thanks.

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I think a DPA pointing down can actually sound really nice. It sounds good if the mount if ok, but it depends more in the material the tie is made of. Also if the guy is quite large and has his chin (or worse stubbly chin) rubbing on the tie there‘s not much to do. 

On really small ties I‘ll use a B6. I don’t think a special tie mic is required. A good tie mount and a friendly wardrobe dept (to get good ties) is far more useful. 

Some like the hide-a-mic tie mount, but so far it was always too large for me

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Let that baby stick out a bit.  No one but the DP is ever gonna see it, and that is because he is looking from 10" away.  I would always say, if someone was seeing the lav in the tie, the rest of you guys weren't doing your jobs very well.  Well, except for sound guys.  I'm ALWAYS looking and the giant pimple under a t-shirt drives me nuts.  Oh and don't even think of pushing it up in the knot just before we roll Ms. Wardrobe.  I'll cut off your fingers.

 

D.

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1 hour ago, tourtelot said:

Let that baby stick out a bit.  No one but the DP is ever gonna see it, and that is because he is looking from 10" away.

It was always my practice to rig a tie-knot mike so that the microphone would protrude just a bit, typically about two millimeters.  Then, when moving in for close-ups, I would push the mike back into the knot and get the recording with a boom. 

 

Times have changed and I acknowledge that current production practices, with wide-and-tight cameras, make it difficult to carry out this plan. 

 

David

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I've long use a B6 with it's very crisp cap.

Use a small piece of tape to keep in place and if possible use the cleft in the tie.

 

Viewing most films and big TV dramas currently, that's how it's done and it sounds good.

- but you do have to experiment!

 

mike

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2 hours ago, tourtelot said:

Let that baby stick out a bit.  No one but the DP is ever gonna see it, and that is because he is looking from 10" away.  I would always say, if someone was seeing the lav in the tie, the rest of you guys weren't doing your jobs very well.  Well, except for sound guys.  I'm ALWAYS looking and the giant pimple under a t-shirt drives me nuts.  Oh and don't even think of pushing it up in the knot just before we roll Ms. Wardrobe.  I'll cut off your fingers.

 

D.

This....  All of it...

 

 

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Hey David.  Even today (or not too many years ago anyway) I got away on a lot of TV episodes putting a B6 in a tie knot.  It hid in the shadows and even the B (or C and D) cameras on the ECU didn't see it.  The more cameras they put up, the less I cared :(

 

D.

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"I'm ALWAYS looking and the giant pimple under a t-shirt drives me nuts.  Oh and don't even think of pushing it up in the knot just before we roll Ms. Wardrobe.  I'll cut off your fingers."

 

Good to see retirement has not dimmed your passion for sound Doug, carry on.

Al

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By a special lav I’m thinking something along the lines of the DPA 4071 which was purpose built for chest mounting under clothes. Something that has a natural EQ curve to correct for the weird placement under the chin. 

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Another vote for the DPA 4071 here, especially when it has to be entirely inside the knot. Cos11s also work well, and are a little more forgiving in terms of hearing clothing rub IME than most of the DPA options. 

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I've used COS-11s with a hush lav foam (cut in half) in the tie knot pointing down. Usually pretty good indoors (wardrobe dependent, of course). 

I have also used an RM11 in the knot as well. Depends on the knot/tie.

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