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Cinela MS Windshields for Schoeps CMC


Davinzzie

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Hi, this is my first post on this forum. I am a sound designer for over 20 years, and I am a little late to the wonderful world of Mid/Side recording.

I recently purchased a Schoeps CMC XT Mk41 and Mk8 pair for exterior recording. To my knowledge the best way to properly record M/S is with the shoulders and the capsules of the mics as close together as possible. 

 

Reading a lot of reviews and comments on this forum, I find the Cinela Zephyx or the Piano system with the double suspension really attractive. However, when I look at the pictures on their website I find that the verticale distance between the two mics is significant.

 

Is there anyone that has some experience with this system from Cinela and what is your opinion on this? Is this optimal or does this not really matter? And do you have experience with the Rycote Cyclone system or the "normal" system as well and what are your findings with those?

 

We are all aiming for the highest audio quality as possilble, but I don't want to make a $1000+ dollar mistake, so I hope you can help me out.

 

Cheers,

Vincent

 

 

 

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Zephyx have a removable basket, so you can use it naked, inside cars,  interiors or reduced spaces, piano or pianissimo have fix basket.
the vertical distance is not a problem.
I'm a Zephyx ccm ms user for many years
with amazing results on the field, incredible wind protection.
fully recommended !!
Cinela also has an excellent customer attention , you can contact them for any replacement parts or doubts
also they have _Kelly_ for rain situation
something useful for designers.

the very best!!

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Just going by the pictures, the capsules are aligned much better on the Rycote Cyclone, I think. Vertically and horizontally. But I can’t tell you if that makes an audible difference. 

I used a Rycote size 4 kit as an MS rig for years and liked it a lot. The main advantage for me being that I had a lot of flexibility of the mic arrangement and mic type inside that basket. I would use a CMIT with a CCM8 or even just a CCM4 with a CCM8, it all works great in there. 

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Hi Davinzzie, welcome!

 

Mid - Side in its essence (and maths) is a coincident technique so, yes, the capsules should be exactly aligned, as in occupying the exact same space. Since sound reproduction over the century has (generally) been a stereo system on a horizontal plane it has generally taken the compromise to be vertical - the further the distance, the further the compromise, so to speak. Which translates to high frequency wavelength, but on a vertical plane in this instance. Since MS is hardly a measurement standard it is up to the user how exact they want or need the result to be.

 

Personally I would tend to use MS for recordings where I want a definite mono central image but where an ambient side image could or would be advantageous for presentation. In my case the vertical compromise is already accentuated in that I would probably be recording MSM or double MS if I was recording MS at all. The obvious and newly common situation for MS coincidence necessity is ambisonics where the vertical is or can be more necessary for the release format.

 

So really it is up to your needs whether to record MS at all, whether you can sacrifice high frequency definition or if you need the vertical aspect?

 

Best, Jez

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Thanks for your replies guys, really appreciate it!

 

I’ve emailed Schoeps the same question and this was their answer.

 

Hello Vincent

You are right the microphones are mounted above each other and at the Cinela suspension this is realized with a slightly bigger space between the microphones. But we would not see this as a disadvantage. As you are pointing the MS basket towards your sound source the sound waves will still reach both diaphragms at the same time (as long as you mount them exactly one above the other). The same is given for sound coming from left or right. So the stereo image is correct. For sound from above or below indeed there would be some slight runtime error but this does not matter for MS, such a recording would require some 3D setup like our ORTF-3D system. Finally the only thing that you should take care for your MS setup are two things:
- mount the diaphragms exactly one above the other
- keep the basket upright during recording

Kind regards,

Bernhard Vollmer, Sales&Technical Support”

 

 

8 hours ago, Rafael said:

Zephyx have a removable basket, so you can use it naked, inside cars,  interiors or reduced spaces, piano or pianissimo have fix basket.
the vertical distance is not a problem.
I'm a Zephyx ccm ms user for many years
with amazing results on the field, incredible wind protection.
fully recommended !!
Cinela also has an excellent customer attention , you can contact them for any replacement parts or doubts
also they have _Kelly_ for rain situation
something useful for designers.

the very best!!

That’s great, I will definitely go for the Zephyx system then. 

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