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Etymotic ER4S in-ear monitors


Damien Looney

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Does anyone have any location experience with these buds http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er4.aspx ? I was thinking of getting a pair of lightweight, in-ear monitors for use in hot environments when I don't want my 750's making my ears uncomfortable from the heat. The other pair that I was looking at are the IE7 from Sennheiser http://is.gd/ZezE

Any thoughts and feedback (do I really want to use a word like that when talking about headphones?) would be very much appreciated.

Damien

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Frankly, I doubt the difference between these and a $30 pair of earbuds will make any difference when listening to the spoken word on a Comtek or IFB.  When it was hot, I boomed with a $20 pair of Sony earbuds, and I like to believe I did just fine.  And I had extras in case they broke.

The actual advantage to the cheap pair also, is that if there is spike in the level, there is some room for the sound to escape.  With the "fancy" ear buds, you can really damage your ears with an unexpected peak.

Robert

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Sweaty earphones are a part of the game. Learn and trust your monitors. Make them good ones. Sweat and good sound go hand in hand. The bad news is that you can sweat and do bad sound. I would never use in ear for the reason RS stated. Personal comfort is great, but the job and your hearing are the main thing. You can hear words on any set of phones, but to hear and use the mic to it's fullest, you need to hear it right. Just my opinion. Wear whatever you want, but realize what you are loosing/missing.

CrewC

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I hate to disagree with you Crew and Robert, but I've been using Etymotics for 4 years and absolutely love them.  Cheap earbuds don't even come close for isolation and sound quality.   You know when you're hearing a truck go by and you can't tell whether you're hearing it in your mix or it's shooting through the sides of your headphones?  Now you can tell.   And the isolation lets you  keep your listening volume quite low to save your hearing, so spikes (especially in conjunction with the nice limiting on modern mixers) don't blast you.

Other benefits - no bald spot from headphones and, you can wear whatever headgear (top hats, helmets) you want.  

I've run to the top of mountains with them, dripping sweat and they kept working fine.  

The Negatives.   You have to keep your ears religiously clean.   If you have a lot of wax in your ear you will clog the earbuds, which usually manifests itself as a noticeable loss of gain on one of the sides.  The buds come with a cleaning kit, but when you're using them every day, you don't want to be messing with them.  I find it easier to keep my ears clean, and then I clean the earbuds when necessary - usually once a month.

You can't hear the director any more if your mic isn't pointed at him/her.  The isolation is that good.

Mechanical noise propagating from movement of your body against the wire (and also some jaw movements) can be distracting.  I've learned to recognize the distinctive sounds of these movements,  but I still get tricked now and then and think - what the heck is that noise?  Oh yeah, goretex and zippers rubbing on headphone cabling when I turn my head.

So they are a little different to use than regular headphones, but I'm never going back!  All my old headphones are hanging on nails in the basement- they don't even come on jobs any more...

cheers,

Brent Calkin

Ps I mainly do documentary, so my requirements are a little different from a feature boomer, but I would use the etymotics for booming or mixing anything, feature, or run and gun...

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You can buy headphone covers for your headphones that help to keep the leather pads from getting all sweaty or keep your ears warmer in the cold. They are like a scarf thats covers the earpads. I have em but I dont always use them.I think they cut out some of the isolation of the phones because they prevent the cupping over your ears. I was thinking of getting some ER buds at one time, so I asked My friend Marcus Ricaud who Uses the Etymotic Rs and he really like them and says they are worth it.

Its your ears and

Its up to you.

Matthew McGowin

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I use the DT250's to mix.  They are comfortable and sound very nice.

I also know of several people using the ER buds, having seen them first on Kevin Santy on "Scrubs" a few years ago.  He swore by them.  If you want to go in that direction of high-end in ear monitor, then they seem to be the right choice.  I just didn't find the need when I was booming (perhaps my work suffered, but I like to think not), and I have been very happy with boom work by some very good boom guys who use all different kinds of monitoring.  It's a personal choice.

But... if you are planning for these as an option when it's hot, but plan to use full-size phones otherwise, then it might be difficult to adjust back and forth.  I find that when I am mixing, it throws me off a bit if the headphone volume is not exactly where I like it (wishing SD had numerical value for HP output) or if I am using headphones I am not used to.

Robert

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The DT250s were my first set of "pro" headphones and I thought they were great. I had tried the 7509s and the HD25s but the DTs were the best feel and sound. I still break them out when I'm working run and gun and know that I'll be moving about all day. I changed to the Ultrasone 750's when I bought the CMIT-5U because I thought they were the cans that complimented that mic the best and it's the mic that gets the most use.

The DT250s and the 750s both have the fabric pads and I just find that my head can't 'breathe' when I'm wearing big cans in the heat, hence the interest in the earbuds.

As for the bald spot from the headband-not a worry for me. My head is shaved to a nice smooth shine everyday so baldness is more than embraced here. Sunburn and suntroke on the other hand.....

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How do performers protect their ears? I see the molded ear pieces all the time and live stage is notorious for terrible peak control?

To the best of my knowledge, the In-Ear monitors used by performers on stage is a good use of the technology. First, they provide isolation from all the excessively loud sound from conventional stage (loudspeaker) monitors and amps, so they actually are protecting a performers hearing. Secondly, the monitor signal that is being sent to each performers ears is a carefully controlled and highly processed signal coming from the monitor mixer's board. So, this protects the performer even further, though it must be said that ANY sort of performing and monitoring at high levels for extended periods of time is unquestionably a hazard.

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I have a set, but only use them for music, when I'm mixing in a noisy venue, or even when I'm recording orchestras, I use the ER4S monitors over my Senn HD-25 headphones. I find I can pick out thing much better with the earphones over the headphones in these environments. However, I don't like using them on-location. I have custom molds for mine, and even with them, it takes longer than I want to (or can) spend getting them seated properly.

However, as previously mentioned these sound gorgeous. These are not some cheap $30 earbuds. They actually have a great audio range and represent it very well.

Wayne

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How do performers protect their ears? I see the molded ear pieces all the time and live stage is notorious for terrible peak control?

What Jeff said.

Aphex Dominators are the norm for peak protection

NINFrontOfHouseRacks.jpg

I have a set of Ultimate Ears UE-5's I use from time to time on my ENG rig.  They're nice because of the complete isolation they provide.  I find I set my headphone volume much lower with the in-ears than I do with the Sony's.

The fact that they block out all the random people that seem to think you're the guy to ask about what's going on is just an added bonus. :)

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Does anyone have any location experience with these buds http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er4.aspx ? I was thinking of getting a pair of lightweight, in-ear monitors for use in hot environments when I don't want my 750's making my ears uncomfortable from the heat. The other pair that I was looking at are the IE7 from Sennheiser http://is.gd/ZezE

Any thoughts and feedback (do I really want to use a word like that when talking about headphones?) would be very much appreciated.

Damien

I tried out the ER-4B on the recommendation of several people a couple years back.  I didn't like them -- I thought the LF response was very poor and unsuitable for our work.  I didn't get to listen to the ER-4S -- maybe it's better.

On a side note, I have never used earbuds for work myself, but have had a couple of operators who like to use them from time to time.  I have noticed that when they do, the quality drops slightly in terms of their really finessing the sweet spot as compared to when they use normal headsets.  (One told me that when he works for another mixer we know, that mixer won't allow him to use the earbuds any more for the same reason).  It isn't that the operators are suddenly doing a terrible job, missing cues etc -- but sometimes, particularly with our work, the devil is in the details.

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Noah-I think I may have hit you up when you were selling your buds last year. I was interested in getting some information on them at the time but then I let it slide and ended up forgetting about them.

I'd like to be able to go head to head with them and a few other cans like the 750s and to throw some different mics in too just so I could hear the comparisons but the disadvantage of wanting earbuds is the lack or 'try before you buy' that you could get with regular cans.

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  I just worked with a third/boom op who sprung for the Shure in-ears cans, almost double the whopping price of these ER4S!  He had just got them and was figuring out stuff like where to set volume for peaks and such (much softer than 7506s).  He swore they sounded amazing, that they had 3 elements or drivers (or something) in each ears.  But, the earwax plugged up one side and he went to scoop it out and damaged the damn things!  He was rabid about telling me how great and clear they were, the best cans he'd ever heard.

  As far as the axis thing goes I can say that this man's performance wasn't affected at all, and he was using the CS-3e which is instantly noticeable when it goes off-axis.  (Timan you know the dude he was your third last time you were in NOLA.)

  I love the idea but I can't see spending that much for something so fragile and easy to mess up.  I use the HN-7506s and deal with the sweat and bed-head.  It throws my style off way more than my product.

  Dan Izen

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yeah - the SHURE high end is about 500$ list. the guy fucked up - there is a proper method to clean the thingy that sits inside the ear...

i - who has never used these or any others - am wondering if i can get a chance to hear them in real world circumstances (not some stupid expo) sometime.

having said that, and having borne the brunt of the beads and rivulets (of sweat) at times, i would still not give up the headphones.

-vin

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Years ago, I briefly chatted with a guy who works on a Nascar series called...I forget :)  He says they are absolutely necessary in loud SPL situations and couldn't imagine working in the "paddock" without them.

I considered picking up a set for "hardhat" situations or where I needed high isolation, as well as for personal use, but have yet to try them.

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B&H let me try them before buying.  I was kind of shocked.  I was looking at them and made some humourous comment about trying them out to the kid behind the counter.  He pulled out a sealed set, gave me an ipod and let me use them for half an hour.  I don't know what he would have done with them if I hadn't bought them....

cheers,

Brent Calkin

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I'd like to try them, but the $$$ !!!!

I have used cheap in-ears for doing industrial and offshore oilfield stuff, for when they get strict and enforce the hard hat thing.  I now carry a cheap pair in the bag just in case.

I've mostly used the in-ears to listen to my iPod while mowing the lawn.  Way better than the headphones in this heat.

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I would have loved a chance to use these (or any other isolating in ear cans) this past weekend.  I was working on a doc and we were shooting at the Puerto Rican Day Parade in  NYC.  We were shooting two people riding in the parade and then just general b roll up and down the parade route.

It was so loud that I couldn't hear the cans- I was mixing strictly through the meters.  I was using the cans more for hearing protection than anything else.  When I listened to playback, things sounded better than I thought they would, and much different than when I was listening live.

Perhaps a set of these should end up in my bag.

Marc

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Hey Jason,  I use the ER4P  - I think you need a power amp to drive the "s"

I use the 4S model quite successfully with the Deva. I think pretty much any of the recording devices/mixers we have, have a powerful enough built-in amp to drive them. I have used them on a plane with my ipod and while it does work, you really have to crank up the iPod to drive the ER-4S.

Wayne

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