JeffWWaldrop Posted November 21, 2019 Report Share Posted November 21, 2019 I am relatively new to recording dialog voice sound for video with a DSLR. I am using a Zoom F8n and a Zoom F6 to capture sound independently to an SD and also patch it in to the camera. I have read the importance of room tone for use to repair splices in the audio (?). I am using Audition for editing of the WAV files and I am using IMovie on the Mac to edit video and rendering. Where can I find some examples of how room tone is used in editing sound preferably with Audition since that is what I am using for a DAW? Any recommendations on a good YouTube video explanation on it? Just a newbie, Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonG Posted November 21, 2019 Report Share Posted November 21, 2019 Research dialogue editing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Feeley Posted November 21, 2019 Report Share Posted November 21, 2019 I don't know what YouTube video to recommend, but here are two books worth digging into: Producing Great Sound for Film and Video by Jay Rose, CAS http://www.greatsound.info Dialogue Editing for Motion Pictures A Guide to the Invisible Art, 2nd Edition By John Purcell https://www.routledge.com/Dialogue-Editing-for-Motion-Pictures-A-Guide-to-the-Invisible-Art/Purcell/p/book/9780415828178 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 13 hours ago, JeffWWaldrop said: I am using Audition for editing of the WAV files and I am using IMovie on the Mac to edit video and rendering. Maybe consider a proper DAW rather than Audition? (ditto a different NLE than iMove....) Reaper and Pro Tools are two DAWs to consider instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Rose Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 ...maybe a mandatory plug for Nuendo as well...? -- Anyway, OP, the biggest issue is that roomtone edits (or any really clean dialog or music editing) seldom falls on frame lines. 1/24th of a second is long enough to totally miss some common phonemes such as /d/ or /t/, which can be as short as 1/100 second. Ditto, you can miss a 16th note in music at a moderate 120 bpm tempo. Audio programs, from the incredibly powerful ProTools and Nuendo to the simplest free open source Audacity, let you edit with much more precision. There's a lot more about this in my book (which Jim was kind enough to mention) and the tutorials on my website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffWWaldrop Posted November 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 Ok, Thanks all. I am trying to learn the ropes. I will look into the books. I also have Final Cut Pro, just the iMovie isn't as difficult to understand. Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Reineke Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 I doubt iMovie can edit audio to the sub-frame level. FCP sucks as well for audio work in general. Most DAWs allow editing audio down to the sample level. Which may or may not be needed for inserting RT depending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmRR Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 I don't know if iMovie has gotten any better, for a long time it continually got worse so far as what you could and couldn't do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decay Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 22 hours ago, Jim Feeley said: I don't know what YouTube video to recommend, but here are two books worth digging into: Producing Great Sound for Film and Video by Jay Rose, CAS http://www.greatsound.info I am reading through Jay Rose's book right now- it should be a must-read for anyone on set, especially if you're touching audio equipment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TVPostSound Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 No offense to Jay (Im sorry, I haven't read your book) Jim Purcell's book has a chapter dedicated to room tone, very good read. I have all my assistants read that before they even start working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johngooch Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Strongly suggest getting the paper version of Purcells book. Some of the diagrams- screen grabs--- non text info a little hard to grasp in the E-book version.. At least the version i read. j Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Westgate Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Room tone or background noise can be useful in sound post. Less so if music is being floated over the scene or interview. Use the microphone you used When in doubt just do it straight away! mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corbin Posted December 11, 2019 Report Share Posted December 11, 2019 On 11/21/2019 at 4:05 PM, JeffWWaldrop said: I am relatively new to recording dialog voice sound for video <snip) You want to get Jay’s book if you’re a relative novice. I did. It is very comprehensive and beautifully written and organized. You won’t know what you don’t know until you read his book. If you have questions about room tone, you’re likely going to have questions about other things too. Rather than getting your information piecemeal, get this book. The other book suggested seems a bit advanced and perhaps overly-narrow in scope for what you want and need right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Rose Posted December 12, 2019 Report Share Posted December 12, 2019 On 11/23/2019 at 5:34 PM, TVPostSound said: No offense to Jay (Im sorry, I haven't read your book) Jim Purcell's book has a chapter dedicated to room tone... No offense taken. Jim's book is the bible of dialog editing for narrative feature film, and it's well written besides. He devotes a whole book to to the subject. My book is bigger... but it has only one chapter on dialog editing, because it covers the entire soundtrack process from prepro to mix, for all kinds of films and budgets. I'm also sorry you haven't read my book. Jim and I take completely different approaches to figuring out exactly where to make the cut in a spoken line. Both are valid, both are fast and reliable in the heat of editing, and a good editor learns to use both... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berniebeaudry Posted December 12, 2019 Report Share Posted December 12, 2019 On 11/22/2019 at 4:43 AM, IronFilm said: Maybe consider a proper DAW rather than Audition? (ditto a different NLE than iMove....) Reaper and Pro Tools are two DAWs to consider instead. Actually Audition is pretty capable and if used in tandem with Premiere its a decent workflow. On 11/22/2019 at 1:07 PM, Rick Reineke said: I doubt iMovie can edit audio to the sub-frame level. FCP sucks as well for audio work in general. Most DAWs allow editing audio down to the sample level. Which may or may not be needed for inserting RT depending. He mentioned he's using Audition to edit the audio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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