Jeff Wexler Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 I was waiting to post info about the upcoming Zaxcom product and ZaxNet, but I was not sure I would be able to get the reporting right. Billy Sarokin has posted on r.a.m.p.s. what seems to be a pretty good report on what we can expect from all of this. So, I am re-posting this from Billy: "1 - The mic pre gain controls on the Mix 12 and the Mix 8 can now control the transmitter input gains. So instead of either going up to an actor and changing the transmitter input gain manually, or using the ifb to individually select a transmitter and adjusting the gain remotely, you can now assign the input pot on the Mix 12 to control the transmitter attached to that channel meaning you can tweak the gains of up to 12 transmitters on the fly using the Mix 12 board. 2 - They're coming out with new little Comtek type receivers that carry time code and ifb data as well as a high quality audio feed. These receivers have a built in tc receiver/generator so it will continuously jam sync. You can connect this receiver to a slate or new slates by Denecke will offer the receiver built in as an option, so all the camera assistant has to do is turn the slate on and it will receive and display accurate time code from the recorder. The slates will also be capable of displaying meta data (scene and take) when the slate is clapped. No more jamming or drifting. And unlike using a Comtek to send tc data, if the slate is out of range the generator will continue the time code and re-jam when it is back in range. 3 - You will be able to control multiple transmitters in sync for playback. If you had radio issues on a take, at any point, even days later (depending on the size of the SD card) you can use this new software to playback all the transmitters IN SYNC so you can re-mix the scene. I've frequently been playing back individual radios to replace an rf drop out. With this I will now be able to play back all the radios at once from any time code start point. For instance, if scene 34 take 5 had multiple hits, later that day I can look up the time code start point on the Deva index and tell all the radios to play back from that point. The system will even record the original time code so the scene will appear on the DVD as the original (the original take will not be erased of course, but it will be flagged so telecine systems will use the re-recorded take, not the original). Basically, since I am already transmitting time code, ifb audio and transmitter control signals, this new 'ZaxNet' is a way to integrate this transmission with all my other gear and with everyone else on set that needs to receive time code, meta data and audio. Pretty neat. Best, Billy Sarokin" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted June 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 My "basic" package is two boom mics ready at all times and I carry 10 wireless mic systems and lavaliers for all. In order to join the Zax-Net I would need: 1) Zaxcom Mix-12 price $6,500.00 2) Zaxcom Boom Transceivers 5,990.00 2) Zaxcom RX900S Receivers 4,000.00 1) Zaxcom IFB 100 Transmitter (I think one is all you'd need, not sure about this) 1,850.00 10) Zaxcom TRX 900AA Transmitters for "body pack" applications 18,500.00 10) Zaxcom RX 900M Receivers 19,500.00 10) Zaxcom Record Options installed at a price of $295.00 per unit 2,950.00 10) Sanken COS-11D Lavalier microphones, as the old Sankens will not work with the Zax's 4,590.00 So I'm all ready to join the Zax-Net right what's the total? $63,780.00!!! RVD There will be many aspects of the just announced ZaxNet system that will be readily utilizable by sound mixers without having to replace their whole existing package --- your estimate of over $63K just to "join ZaxNet" is a little disingenuous. If you already have 10 (or possibly more) wireless from a different manufacturer (I would imagine Lectrosonics) then you already have 10 wireless sets, transmitters and receivers, that do not possess many of the features available today with Zaxcom wireless. Rather than talking about joining ZaxNet, you might consider getting one or two Zaxcom sets which could serve as you entry into the world of Zaxcom. When, and if, you discover that you must have some or all of the these features, including ZaxNet, that you have been without all these years using any other wireless, then you may have to spend a little more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobD Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 There will be many aspects of the just announced ZaxNet system that will be readily utilizable by sound mixers without having to replace their whole existing package --- your estimate of over $63K just to "join ZaxNet" is a little disingenuous. If you already have 10 (or possibly more) wireless from a different manufacturer (I would imagine Lectrosonics) then you already have 10 wireless sets, transmitters and receivers, that do not possess many of the features available today with Zaxcom wireless. Rather than talking about joining ZaxNet, you might consider getting one or two Zaxcom sets which could serve as you entry into the world of Zaxcom. When, and if, you discover that you must have some or all of the these features, including ZaxNet, that you have been without all these years using any other wireless, then you may have to spend a little more money. And when I need to have something repaired, I could send it in to them across the country, and wait weeks for it's return..... as I move to the front of the line of backlogged repair orders.... Unless of course they have started to allow repair by other facilities? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 Richard, For those of us without a Deva, please add an extra $10k+ (depending on model) to your tally. Double-Yikes!! Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 Our service at Zaxcom can range from in and out the same day to a few days depending on what needs to be done. Many dealers can and will service our gear if the problem can be fixed in the field. We just added 2 new dealers in LA for wireless so there should be lots of help available. If any repair is critical because the gear is on a show we flag it so we can get to it as quickly as possible. We are certainly not the highest price in any category of gear. Aaton Cantar, Sonosax mixers, Sennheiser wireless and Lectro IFB all cost more than our product offerings. There are products that cost less as well. All it takes to get started is a Fusion recorder and an IFB100 transmitter. The rest can be acquired as needed. We try to price our gear as low as possible in order to appeal to the greatest number of sound professionals. A basic Zaxcom Location sound package averages out to about the same cost as gear from other manufactures. The sale of an existing package will greatly offset the cost of the new gear. Glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobD Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 Tha Our service at Zaxcom can range from in and out the same day to a few days depending on what needs to be done. Many dealers can and will service our gear if the problem can be fixed in the field. We just added 2 new dealers in LA for wireless so there should be lots of help available. If any repair is critical because the gear is on a show we flag it so we can get to it as quickly as possible. We are certainly not the highest price in any category of gear. Aaton Cantar, Sonosax mixers, Sennheiser wireless and Lectro IFB all cost more than our product offerings. There are products that cost less as well. All it takes to get started is a Fusion recorder and an IFB100 transmitter. The rest can be acquired as needed. We try to price our gear as low as possible in order to appeal to the greatest number of sound professionals. A basic Zaxcom Location sound package averages out to about the same cost as gear from other manufactures. The sale of an existing package will greatly offset the cost of the new gear. Glenn Thanks Glen, Good to know..... I have been steering clear of your products due to prior only service here limitations.... I am glad that has changed.... Good luck with all your new gear.... I know it is nice stuff.... BD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 I don't think your gear is too expensive. It's competitive and full of great features. I just wish I had the money to buy it. My gear is all fairly new and does not warrant replacing, but when it does, your new features will keep your gear right at the top of my list. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted June 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 I think what may be going on here is that the announcement of ZaxNet and all the features and functions it will provide is a little overwhelming for those who have not been working with Zaxcom products, Deva and Wireless. This is why I jumped on you, RVD, about the necessity and expense of "joining ZaxNet" like it was some elite club with huge initiation dues to pay. The fact is, the very foundation of the Zaxcom product line, especially the pure digital wireless, has provided features and functionality that no other manufacturer has even come close to. Now, most may not need or even want to do their work with all these features --- I am a prime example: I am a solid Zaxcom supporter but I only use the things I need --- I use a Deva IV as my main recorder, I have 4 TRX900 transmitters and 1 plug-on, I do not own a TRX 992 (Boom Box) yet. I do not use a MIX-12 (I like my Cooper 208), I don't use wireless boom, I do not use the recording feature, I doubt that I will ever use the "re-mix" feature of ZaxNet. This does not diminish my excitement and enthusiasm, and a high degree of awe and respect for Glenn Sanders, Howy and the whole team at Zaxcom, for coming up with amazing technology. People will decide what they want, what they need, what they can afford and so on... this dynamic has not changed. What has changed, dramatically, as you point out, is the choices we have. In 1970 when I put together my first equipment package, "choice" was not an issue. Neither were things like "how can I buy inexpensive consumer gear from Guitar Center" and still do the job. There wasn't any consumer gear that could serve our professional needs, there wasn't any Guitar Center. The Zaxcom product line isn't for everyone, that is for sure, but then doing a job that requires the 10 Lecrosonics wireless you have in your package isn't for everyone either (I'm thinking about myself). Because we may not all need this new technology or possibly cannot afford it (if it means replacing our whole equipment package as you suggest), should Zaxcom not even develop it and market it? Of course not. We should all be pleased that there is a company that can do these things. I am reminded again the reaction by the established sound professionals in motion pictures to the original Nagra III. Unanimously, everyone agreed that it would not work (too small, battery operated, no sprockets, narrow tape, etc., etc.) and declared that motion picture film sound had to be recorded on film (sprocketed magnetic film) --- the Nagra would fail and will never be used for motion picture work. Should Kudelski have hung up his hat at this time ... I don't think so. Regards, Jeff Wexler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 Deva IV, V, 5.8, 16 and Fusion will all work with Zax-Net. Even the wireless remote control function only needs an IFB100 to control gain and frequency remotely and transmit time code. The whole system is best but much can be done with minimal parts. Glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 how about a version of the ifb 100 that will work with my laptop so i can control my zaxcom transmitters from there? like the idea of being able to play back all zaxcom recording transmitters (that have ifb remote. sadly my trx700 doesnt have this function) in sync to re-record a multitrack, but not sure i'd like to try and re mix it without a video monitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 " What has changed, dramatically, as you point out, is the choices we have. " what we see here is the Production Sound corollary to Moore's Law. not only are our equipment choices improving exponentially, but the technological advancements are accelerating at the same time. I suspect the computer interface suggested isn't too far off, either! so how about this: the script supervisor could update appropriate metadata ?? I believe the way we work is also going to continue to evolve... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted June 28, 2009 Report Share Posted June 28, 2009 From my experiences, Zaxcom makes great recorders. I have considered other offerings from them as well and the ones I demoed were of pro quality. They continue to innovate and for that I applaud them. This new integrated Zax-Net is wow x wow. The main question for me is my needs for a system, for my type of work. Do I need an all Zaxcom system with this much integration and redundant recording and remixing ability? No. Not really needed. Now mixers like Billy Sarokin, Marc Ulanno, and a few others? Sure. Seems like just the ticket for larger than life, many radio mic productions. It seems like an ideal system for large multi track TV shows as well. As far as my world goes, I'm sure more Zaxcom products will be in my future, but not my whole system. Thanks to Glenn and his company for their hard work. More tools, better tools make me happy. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 From my experiences, Zaxcom makes great recorders. I have considered other offerings from them as well and the ones I demoed were of pro quality. They continue to innovate and for that I applaud them. This new integrated Zax-Net is wow x wow. The main question for me is my needs for a system, for my type of work. Do I need an all Zaxcom system with this much integration and redundant recording and remixing ability? No. Not really needed. Now mixers like Billy Sarokin, Marc Ulanno, and a few others? Sure. Seems like just the ticket for larger than life, many radio mic productions. It seems like an ideal system for large multi track TV shows as well. As far as my world goes, I'm sure more Zaxcom products will be in my future, but not my whole system. Thanks to Glenn and his company for their hard work. More tools, better tools make me happy. CrewC Not to mention live shows or reality TV etc.... Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Philip, you are absolutely correct and no disrespect to those who toil in those worlds. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobD Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 From my experiences, Zaxcom makes great recorders. I have considered other offerings from them as well and the ones I demoed were of pro quality. They continue to innovate and for that I applaud them. This new integrated Zax-Net is wow x wow. The main question for me is my needs for a system, for my type of work. Do I need an all Zaxcom system with this much integration and redundant recording and remixing ability? No. Not really needed. Now mixers like Billy Sarokin, Marc Ulanno, and a few others? Sure. Seems like just the ticket for larger than life, many radio mic productions. It seems like an ideal system for large multi track TV shows as well. As far as my world goes, I'm sure more Zaxcom products will be in my future, but not my whole system. Thanks to Glenn and his company for their hard work. More tools, better tools make me happy. CrewC Wow, Well said.... Good job Crew... I agree.... Just did a 7 radio mic gig this week, NOT the norm for me... My Lectros worked perfectly, as did my PD 606..... This nice gear from ZAX has a home, and are all great tools, but for what I do, and how I do it, I am now content with my current package. LOVE the 606 so far.... I prefer the less complicated path, makes for a more pleasant work day for me at least... If I ever need radios that record as well, I know where to go, that's for sure... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Timan Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 There will be many aspects of the just announced ZaxNet system that will be readily utilizable by sound mixers without having to replace their whole existing package --- your estimate of over $63K just to "join ZaxNet" is a little disingenuous. If you already have 10 (or possibly more) wireless from a different manufacturer (I would imagine Lectrosonics) then you already have 10 wireless sets, transmitters and receivers, that do not possess many of the features available today with Zaxcom wireless. Rather than talking about joining ZaxNet, you might consider getting one or two Zaxcom sets which could serve as you entry into the world of Zaxcom. When, and if, you discover that you must have some or all of the these features, including ZaxNet, that you have been without all these years using any other wireless, then you may have to spend a little more money. Respectfully, I tend to disagree with Jeff and agree with Richard here, and don't agree that Richard's financial estimate is disingenious, particularly since it omits the purchase of a Zaxcom recorder for those of us who don't have one (he already does) and the $10-15,000 that adds to the package once the recorder and all attendant accessories (bag, cables, etc) are bought. That could bring the list price to $80,000 to take advantage of all these new and heralded features! Even if one was to "whittle down" from there (and I have my reservations about that, as I will get to shortly), one is still talking about a pretty major investment. The idea suggested that one get a "starter package" with just a recorder and a few wireless is an absurd one. For those who really might need all of the features touted by the "Zax Net", one would not be able to take advantage of those features unless they possessed most or all of the elements in the system. Furthermore, it seems as if it would be more maddening to mix and match within a system where two of the ten wireless out there have internal control from the board, and the other eight require the third to run around with a greenie and adjust Audio Ltds or Lectrosonics, and to have to keep track of which of whose are. That's a workflow where I can already see a million frustrations and errors due to confusion. Finally, is one really going to buy a Zaxcom recorder, Mix 12, and 2 Zax wireless systems (we're already talking about $30K+) just to "check it out"? Really? The other thing that seems intimidating from a financial perspective is that in the ten-ish years that the Zaxcom products have been prominent in the marketplace, we've seen a lot of new versions of the equipment in a short period of time -- Deva I, II, III, IV, V, 5.8; Zaxcom Cameo I, II, Mix 8, Mix 12; and many variations and upgrades and changes with the wireless stuff. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there with "old" Deva IIs and Cameos still doing fine, and I'm sure the factory still supports repairs of those items, but wow, I gotta admit that it seems like a lot of quick obsolescence for me. I know the era of the Nagra is long gone, but even that notwithstanding, I still got a good nine years out of my Fostex PD-4 (and now three and counting out of my Fostex DV824, which cost very considerably less than any of the Zaxcom offerings). Say one was to plunk down fifty to eighty grand on completely new Zax kit -- how often thenafter is one going to have to then update/buy completely new stuff at a similar price point? Every couple of years? I applaud Zaxcom for coming out with products with so many innovative features, and applaud Billy, whom I am guessing is probably fueling their "think tank" with great and thoughtful ideas from his own experience on the front lines. But I question how constant changing of software and hardware provides for the time and thoroughness of "bomb proof" testing before we bring this equipment out to the front lines, and whether or not the expense of such a system can really correlate and fit into the financial plan of most of us (who continue to work for scale and nominal kit values). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 The Deva product has only gone through 2 changes over the last 12 years. The Original Deva II was out for about 5 years (A Deva I was a Deva II in a black case). Deva 4,5,5.8,16 and Fusion are built on the same hardware platform and have been out for about 7 years. The fact of the matter is that the current Deva hardware shows no sign of going away any time soon. It is the heart of our system and there is nothing better to replace it with. We may offer different variations of the Deva but the basic platform is here to stay. Glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glen Trew Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Respectfully, I tend to disagree with Jeff and agree with Richard here, and don't agree that Richard's financial estimate is disingenious, particularly since it omits the purchase of a Zaxcom recorder for those of us who don't have one (he already does) and the $10-15,000 that adds to the package once the recorder and all attendant accessories (bag, cables, etc) are bought. That could bring the list price to $80,000 to take advantage of all these new and heralded features! Even if one was to "whittle down" from there (and I have my reservations about that, as I will get to shortly), one is still talking about a pretty major investment. You don't have to have a mix 12 or a mix 8 or even a Deva to have some of these unique benefits. The wireless system with the remote control function of the IFB can be used with a Nagra IV-STC and a Cooper 106. A single wireless boom rig (TRX992 and IFB) is all that's needed. The next step would be to add a Deva or Fusion recorder to more easily manage multiple wireless channels. The Mix 12 or Mix 8 is not needed to control the input trim at the transmitter. This is a function of the Deva/Fusion. Having the Mix 12 or Mix 8 makes doing this faster and easier because they provide a dedicated trim knob, but the function is the same with or without the Mix 12 or Mix 8. An important point in all this is that, when using wireless microphones, the proper place to make a trim adjustment has always been at the transmitter, but this has been impractical until the Zaxcom system. The Zax net system allows transmitter trim to be happen remotely at the mixer (or at the Deva) by turning the trim knob like we always have. Glen Trew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacysound Posted June 29, 2009 Report Share Posted June 29, 2009 Unfortunately the Zaxcom Cameo mixer won't control the receivers or transmitters, even tho there's a "wireless" menu on the Cameo that was never implemented. A non-functioning "Deva" menu as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 So I was at Coffey sound today, meeting another mixer and picking up a couple of little bits, and Glenn was there with his latest Zaxcom gear. I'd never met Glenn in person before, and I was impressed with his pride and enthusiasm as well as being impressed with the gear. In a very brief demonstration, he showed me the function of adjusting the transmitter gain, available on the MIX12 and/or the DEVA itself. We also recorded on the DEVA with several wireless packs and mics, and then we played back from those same packs, being able to pot up packs that were not potted up on the "live" record, and vice versa. Really cool and very easy to do. There are so many possibilities for these functions, and although I probably would drive myself nuts remixing on set, it's nice to know that I could, or that I could re-record a mic that was out of range (the whole car-to-car thing we discussed in another thread). Pretty fantastic. There was also a demonstration of the IFB to slate for scene and take information, which I confess would not be all that useful on properly staffed narrative projects, but would be a very useful tool on projects without the luxury of sufficient staff. Glenn also shared with me some other details on IFB, TC, and other cool bits, but it was only a brief meeting so it all got very compressed in my brain. It is also worth noting that these functions are available from any new DEVA, so while I was thinking about buying a 788T for my next "proper" job, I am seriously considering buying a DEVA so that I have the anchor for subsequent wireless upgrades/additions to my kit. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy P Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 So did anyone here make it to the seminar on Saturday? Any opinions formed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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