Judging a mixer by his gear....

[John Blankenship]

What Eric said!

I'm not sure what you think you need from any of us at this point.  Many, if not most, prophesies are self-fulfilling.  If you constantly point out to everyone that you have a Mackie and ask if they're looking down on you because you do, they will.  Not because of the Mackie, per se, but because of your focus on it instead of focusing on how well you do the job.

In the past I have done cart jobs with my Sound Devices mixers and got the job done fine.  I then felt the need to move to a fully configured cart.  I currently use a Soundcraft GP-1 which was purpose-built for our use, DC power, multiple headphone circuits, talkback circuits, output limiters, etc.  Just before I got it, I had purchased a used Mackie with the DC conversion.  I was planning to give that a try for my cart rig.  Upon putting it through its paces I felt I could make it work but also felt its limitations.  After comparing them, I didn't like the preamps and planned to use a Sound Devices mixer for the low level preamps (and limiter) and only use the line inputs on the Mackie.  My decision does not reflect on someone who uses the Mackie -- preamps and all.  It reflects on my comfort level.  However, before I had the Mackie implemented, I purchased the Soundcraft.  I like it better for many reasons:  better preamps, greater headroom, long throw P&G faders, output limiters, talkback capability, two separate boom op headphone feeds, less crosstalk, less power consumption, etc.

Now, a big HOWEVER:  Given the real world conditions of noisy locations, background traffic, head turns, varied delivery, et al, I'm sure it would have been difficult for any client to tell the difference between the two on final tracks.

I guess my point is that I went with the Soundcraft because I'm much more comfortable with it in my total setup.  I've since done a number of modifications to it to be even more comfortable.

So, in my mind, you have answered your own question.  You have integrated the Mackie into your rig in a manner that works really well for you and, hearing you describe it, you sound extremely comfortable with your setup.  That's key.

If all it took to be a big time sound mixer was the mixing panel itself, then whoop-te-do, a no brainer -- buy a killer panel and get rich (humor)!  A good cart setup has so many requirements beyond the mixing panel.  It's that total package that speaks loudly, not just some part of it.  "How efficiently can you work with that package?" is the critical question.  Plenty of Comteks for the suits?  Feeds to and from vid village.  Several channels of wireless.  Good sound logs (okay, maybe just adequate given a director who rolls take after take without a whisper in between).  It's the sum total of you and your gear, how you integrate into the production, and how well the job gets done that makes the difference.

But if you direct everyone's attention to the Mackie, they will notice it.  If you direct everyone's attention to your work, they'll notice that.  The answer is up to you, not us.

Just my .02.

John B.

[RPSharman]

I'm not sure what you think you need from any of us at this point.  Many, if not most, prophesies are self-fulfilling.  If you constantly point out to everyone that you have a Mackie and ask if they're looking down on you because you do, they will.  Not because of the Mackie, per se, but because of your focus on it instead of focusing on how well you do the job.

But if you direct everyone's attention to the Mackie, they will notice it.  If you direct everyone's attention to your work, they'll notice that.  The answer is up to you, not us.

John,

Thank you.  You are absolutely right.  This is really the answer I was looking for.  I am happy with my board and the results it gives me, and I expect that anyone who knows me will trust my judgment and my results.  If they don't trust me, then it wouldn't matter what mixer is on my cart.  Enough said.

Thanks again,

Robert

[GrahamTimmer]

5 pages to get to this?

hahahahahahaha

[Michael]

Wow and for a while there I thought i had accidentaly gone to RAMPS....

[studiomprd]

" buy a killer panel and get rich "

There is one at LSC, around $25k

" Plenty of Comteks for the suits?  Feeds to and from vid village.  "

these will have more influence on your income than a cool mixer.

[Scott Smith]

Hey, given the real estate market, maybe we could actually afford one!

--Scott

If someone wants status in the film production world, don't buy a mixer, buy a house in the Hamptons.

Glen Trew

[Donavan]

There is a sad thought through many of the posts here, it's that we as sound mixers would use tools that are good enough to fool the producers or good enough to just get by, I think this is bad for all of our futures.  We should strive to record the projects we are hired for to the best of our abilities and part of our abilities is using complicated and filmcentric equipment.  We must look at ourselves as craftsmen with the best tools possible to do the best job possible.  Otherwise we are just unskilled labors breaking rocks. We have a responsibility to our craft and to our peers to use the best equipment and command the best prices for it.  One thing I learned from booming for many of the best mixers on the biggest shows was that they all had a sense of responsibility to the craft and they all used the best equipment possible.  Do the best mixers have the best equipment because they are successful, no they are successful because they have the mindset that they want to capture every performance as perfectly as possible.

Donavan Dear

[RPSharman]

There is a sad thought through many of the posts here, it's that we as sound mixers would use tools that are good enough to fool the producers or good enough to just get by, I think this is bad for all of our futures.  We should strive to record the projects we are hired for to the best of our abilities and part of our abilities is using complicated and filmcentric equipment.  We must look at ourselves as craftsmen with the best tools possible to do the best job possible.  Otherwise we are just unskilled labors breaking rocks. We have a responsibility to our craft and to our peers to use the best equipment and command the best prices for it.  One thing I learned from booming for many of the best mixers on the biggest shows was that they all had a sense of responsibility to the craft and they all used the best equipment possible.  Do the best mixers have the best equipment because they are successful, no they are successful because they have the mindset that they want to capture every performance as perfectly as possible.

Donavan Dear

I think the question has simply become, "Is one tool BETTER than another, or simply different than another?"  The answer to this has changed in the last few years, with the improvements in technology, the availability of new accessories, and the lower cost of components.  After going to David Waelder's house and listening to various boards perform the task of outputting an audio signal from an audio source, it became very clear to me that the type of mixer one chooses to use should be the result of the way one chooses to work, or perhaps the way one has become accustomed to working.  You wrote in another thread that perhaps a major difference you noticed when using your back-up mixer was due to the fact that you weren't as familiar with using the mixer, and therefore mixed differently.  I am VERY proud of the effort I put forth on every project, and if I truly felt I could do my job better with a Solice or a Cameo or a Cooper, then I would buy one for the next job.  I have bought a LOT of gear over the years to make my job and that of my crew as simple as possible, by providing multiples of new gear set up in a way that was efficient and logical.  This, I feel, is more important than using a particular model of mixer.  I cannot tell you the number of times I worked for mixers in the past whose gear required so much attention just to keep it working, that it was almost a job on its own.  Bad mics, old cables, poor wireless, technology the mixer didn't understand, but all running into a Cooper.  By being properly equipped with new and reliable gear, and using a mixer with which I am very comfortable, I am able to focus my attention on the task at hand, recording "every performance as perfectly as possible".

Robert

[Izen Ears]

  Hey Robert, I asked pages back but never heard a reply so I'll ask again.  Have you ever used a Cooper or Sonosax for a whole job?  Just for kicks or to see how the other half lives.

  For my second feature, which was an ultra no-budgie non-union disaster, I used another person's entire sound kit which included a Cooper 106.  My ears had never heard such clarity especially with the Schoeps this kit also contained.

  After that I compared all other mixers I'd ever used to that, which included a bunch of different Mackies, several Sampson boards, Soundcrafts, Shures, etc., you know the usual 'decent' stuff.  None of them compared to the Coop.  Maybe it was because I liked those little things like the ext slate mic/PL and smooth faders, or maybe it was the sound and super low noise I heard for the first time.  (I remember thinking the gain was set wrong because I didn't hear the component noise/hiss I was so used to, then someone spoke and I quickly realized I had the mic up too hot!)  I have fantasized about owning a Cooper since then, now out of reach...

  Ignoring the technical aspect to your question, it just feels cool sitting in front of a super fancy mixer, like riding in a fancy car, you can't help but feel it!

  By the way I completely agree there might not be a solid technical reason to get a $10k+ mixer, I totally believe people can get great sound and win awards with less expensive boards.

  Dan Izen

[Matt McGowin]

------------------

You know some say.... Its Not What You Use...Its How You Use It.

I have to agree.

I also think that When you have to work with gear alot, that you should work with gear that you like and that feels right to you. Even If it costs more than what production is paying for.

I do love a clean Audio signal

Matt

[Brian]

Just my two cents.

I know a fellow here who works commercials and does great sound.  He uses a Mackie, Although the pre's he uses for the main booms are sound devices mix pre.  He uses boomrecorder for the multitracks and a mac mini....

No one bats an eyelash about the gear because of what he delivers.  He recently is looking for a more friendly setup for power reasons and mobility.  When you buy "A dedicated piece of film equipment"  you are buying gear that is engineered for our type of work.  The market is smaller and yes, the gear is more expensive.  I have never looked back on my purchases to date.  Some have been inexpensive, but also a great deal.  I bought a used filmtech in 2000 for 4500 with fader pack, remote fader and all the cables.  I mixed everything thru that son of a bitch and it was beautiful!! Low maintenance, not power hungry, built like a tank, really nice pres.... and Oh, ummm, never really had to do many expensive repairs.  I sold it for 1800.  That was the best return on investment.

I still have my used neumann (my one and only shotgun) that I love and I bought that for 1300.00  Still in great shape.

Lectros I bought new and never looked back.  Then I bought a used Cantar....  Soon as I bought that, it changed the direction of my career.  No joke.  It sounds better than a lot of the gear I've owed and rented.  It's that Step above the rest.  But it is a symbol to some people.  There is a "Bling" factor to it.  It replaced a board, and seperate mixer situation.  I am more compact then most.  Some are very happy to see that I can get into a car rig within minutes.  I have D.Ps, directors, AD, and even yes, clients asking about this strange looking machine.  And I get, "where is your mixer" For me it is the best of both worlds.  They see that I am at the top of the game and have the latest technology for the job.  Yes I spent money on the Cantar, and I could have got something else, but that would have been crazy.  It has brought me loads business from others who own hi-end gear, and in the end it makes me more money and profit then the money I would have saved on another "less expensive setup"  I did not buy the cantar for it's perception.  I bought it because it's what I perceive as the best tool to do my work.  I love what it does for me, and is a joy to work with.  It's built to last.  And so it will.

I do believe the Mackie may have something to do with it.  We are in Film.  Perception is everything.  Yes I strive to deliver the better sound than most, but for the most part,  I am there because along with my cantar, I have a winning attitude, I work hard at staying knowledgeable about my craft,  and get along with the rest of the crew.  I can communicate to others, such as producers and P.M about my choices for equipment, and what it does for their production.  And yes, they want to know what is in the kit. I have a full list.  I am proud of that list, but also it works for me.  I don't care what everyone else is using...   I would never say I am better than so and so because of my gear.  Your work should speak for itself.  Don't buy a Cooper because you think it will get you more work.  Buy a Cooper because you adore it's sound and you want to work with the best.  I sometimes smile when I am mixing on my Cantar.... I just can't believe that I get to record with it.  I would not have this feeling if it were a Mackie.  Just my opinion.