Thomas Popp Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 I am curious what everyone's take is on a Sound Mixer talking to a cast member directly. For example, if an actor is somewhat mumbling their lines, or performing an action that makes noise (papers on a desk, whatever)... should a sound mixer go through and inform the actors directly, or inform the director or AD? What is the correct protocol? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 I am curious what everyone's take is on a Sound Mixer talking to a cast member directly. For example, if an actor is somewhat mumbling their lines, or performing an action that makes noise (papers on a desk, whatever)... should a sound mixer go through and inform the actors directly, or inform the director or AD? What is the correct protocol? Talk to the AD unless the show is a low budg indie with a more "democratic" set culture. In any case, couch the request respectfully--it may be something the director told the actor to do, and in any case it isn't your film.... Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 If it is something that might affect performance, like low level, then I typically will ask the boom operator to mention it to the director, or maybe ask the director myself depending on the relationship. As the show goes on, you can make decisions as to when it's better to ask the cast yourself, but that comes with experience too. If it's business with props, then I typically will have my boom op go directly to the cast. If they indicate that it's something they need to do for their performance or something the director asked them to do, I will then go myself to talk to the director if I feel it is a real problem for the editor. If the action does not change, then I write it on my notes, and will sometime ask the script supervisor to make a note too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 huge caution: talking to the actors about anything to do with their performance is the director's gig, and a sound crew could get into trouble... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundtrane Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 Like Rich says, I too have had all kinds of experiences with actors. Sometimes, talk directly to them, sometimes, through the 1AD, sometimes through the director. Sometimes, not at all, because they are so fucked in the head that it does not matter - so let them slam the door/eat with the noisy fork, drag their feet, slam the phone down on a line, etc etc etc etc... Our work is so integrated with the other departments. If only the other departments realized and respected this. -vin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 This is a very good question and a really nice change from all of the "technical" questions that usually come up. I would like to add to this thread that being able to interpret and understand the actor and director dynamics on any set, and then finding a way to not only work within those parameters but to make them work for you, is a huge part of what makes a successful Production Sound Mixer. I suppose my advice, at least at the beginning of production, would be to begin by dealing with the director. The director will usually let you know if he/she wants to mention it to the cast and in many cases will let you know that is ok for you to do so, allowing him/her to deal with the many other things on their plate. If the director is frequently on board with you mentioning it yourself, you are probably in a good position to begin taking some "liberties". Obviously, if you have made the effort to establish a good rapport with the director and the cast, you will be in a better position to accomplish your goals. But, as Richard has stated, some directors just don't want *anyone* else speaking to their cast on the set. You have to feel it out. Regarding the 1st AD, my personal opinion on this is that the 1st AD has a lot of other things to do and its both advantageous and more efficient to try not to use them as our message delivery system, in most cases. Dealing with other issues like lockups and keeping the extras quiet are examples of the many exceptions to that rule. This is only my opinion, and is the way that "I" work. Every Sound Mixer is entitled to work in a way that works for them, and that they are comfortable with, as long as the end results are working for you. Your boom operator, on the other hand, is in an excellent position to communicate your needs as, more often than not, he/she have a very good rapport with the director/cast as a result of working so physically close to them all the time. Being able to "work the set" is one of a good boom op's most important skills. The good ones are *very* good at it. Of course *everything* changes from film to film, and that often depends on the "level", for lack of a better word, of the director/cast, you are working with. Many method actors do not want to be disturbed by anyone *including* the director, if they can avoid it. The "importance", also for lack of a better word, of the actor can also have a lot to do with how approachable you can be. i.e. Are they a $15M/movie method actor with a finicky reputation, or is it a day player with one line in the whole movie? That being said, I'm sure anyone with more than a few movies behind them can probably think of at least a couple where the cast was MUCH easier to communicate with than the director! As you can see, there may be no "real" answer to your question. My best advice, for the *long* term, is to work hard to hone your set dynamics instincts so that you will be in a position to be able to rely on your own best judgement for each situation you find yourself in. As has been mentioned so many times on this board before, learning how to operate the equipment successfully is the absolute most basic part of what we do. The most important skills we have is our knowledge base and the decisions that we make with regards to everything that happens before the cameras roll, be those our interpersonal skills, approaches to the scene with regards to perspective, making a decision with regards to lav usage, microphone selections, dealing with costume/prop issues, being on the tech scouts to try to deal with locations problems before they occur, and even working with the electrics dept on generator parking plans well before they ever show up on set. Detailed attention to all of the above will make a much larger contribution to a successful sound track than having the absolute latest greatest piece of gear. Best, dB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 " ...always told me to just tell them yourself... " and " The director will usually let you know if he/she wants to mention it to the cast and in many cases will let you know that is ok for you to do so, allowing him/her to deal with the many other things on their plate. " thus letting you know it is OK with them... and even " Some AD's will tell you, or your boom operator, to tell them yourselves and some will appreciate your asking them and tell you to always do so. " however, depending on several factors, we may still prefer to deal with the actors indirectly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark LeBlanc Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 Something out of the ordinary happened on day 1 of the show I'm on now. The lead actress is from South America and speaks very good English. But, every now and then she gets a word wrong. She asked me to be on the "Lookout" for any strange pronunciations and inform her directly. A few times after a take I would let her know and she was grateful, not mad and would ask for another take. She listens back and corrects the mistake in an almost Dialog Coach kind of way..Never had that happen before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 This is not uncommon at all. Isn't it great to be so appreciated? Something out of the ordinary happened on day 1 of the show I'm on now. The lead actress is from South America and speaks very good English. But, every now and then she gets a word wrong. She asked me to be on the "Lookout" for any strange pronunciations and inform her directly. A few times after a take I would let her know and she was grateful, not mad and would ask for another take. She listens back and corrects the mistake in an almost Dialog Coach kind of way..Never had that happen before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark LeBlanc Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 Well, here's the rub. The director is from Bulgaria!! English is his third language.. So he is cool with it.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Popp Posted October 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 It definitely feels like it is a case to case scenario. I have seen some actors that have been frustrated, and given "too many things to remember", to which we give then an instruction that puts them over the top - and in turn makes them overwhelmed. It then leads to the sound team being thrown under the bus. I myself do mostly go through the protocol of using the 1st AD, or a director if it deals specifically with enunciation issues. Thanks for all the input! I wanted to make sure I wasn't out of line! ~Thomas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 I have enjoyed this subject. Good advise from most. This is the Zen/Black Art of the job. Kind of like 'Screwing'. Many aspects are universal, the results varied. Good luck and hard work are also universals. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 I agree it varies by job, personnel, and circumstances. I recall one commercial gig where the on camera talent consistently mispronounced the client's name. The director and the gallery of client reps never said a word. I'm thinking, "Don't these people care if the name is correct?" I picked my moment during a break in the shooting and discreetly told the director that in my headphones it sounded like the person said ____, instead of ____. The director thanked me, and as we resumed shooting, so did the mispronunciation. I didn't concern myself with it from that moment on. At the end of the day (as they say), I'd done my job... and the check cleared. John B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 as for the mispronunciation of the sponsers name: I remember doing Mazda commercials with James Garner, and shooting to versions of everything: in Canada it is pronounced Mehzda... eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 as for the mispronunciation of the sponsers name: I remember doing Mazda commercials with James Garner, and shooting to versions of everything: in Canada it is pronounced Mehzda... Uh.. ya... sure it is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptalsky Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 It is definitely a case-by-case basis. On the last feature I worked on, many of the leads would actually pop over to my cart between takes to make sure that things "sounded" good. (Not the performance, just the sound). Of course this is the same shoot where one of the actors actually requested that we hold the roll for an airplane that no one else heard (this only happened once...the director had a brief chat with him). But, I've also worked on projects where I followed protocol and made a request to the 1st AD that a line be said either before or after a door close (it was being delivered on the slam) and was told to get back behind my "fucking cart" and not ask stupid questions. Oh well, note made on the sound log and I didn't say a word the rest of the shoot - just noted everything very carefully in my logs. Phil Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundtrane Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 <<get back behind my "fucking cart" and not ask stupid questions>> Sorry Phil, it may just be me.... If someone said that to me, he/she would have a BIG problem - NO matter who it was and NO matter if i was still going to do the job and NO matter ANYTHING. I have not had anyone talk to me that way yet, so far, but it better not happen, or else the other side will really regret it. -vin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptalsky Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 Vin, that happened to me fairly early in my mixing career and since I wasn't feeling as comfortable about my standing I basically shut up and sat. Now I would handle things much differently. And, from what I understand, this AD has a pretty bad reputation and doesn't work much any more. And, shortly after the AD had berated me, one of the producers came up to me and apologized (apparently the rant was heard via the boom). That same producer has hired me numerous times since due to my professionalism under strained/poor circumstances. I've grown a lot in my life and my career and now tend to take the attitude that your bad day can't make my day bad unless I let you. It really boils down to some sets are very collaborative and some are dictatorial and that's just a part of this business. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 " was told to get back behind my "fucking cart" and not ask stupid questions. " obviously, not a pro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasony Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 "your bad day can't make my day bad unless I let you." Good advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Timan Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 I am curious what everyone's take is on a Sound Mixer talking to a cast member directly. For example, if an actor is somewhat mumbling their lines, or performing an action that makes noise (papers on a desk, whatever)... should a sound mixer go through and inform the actors directly, or inform the director or AD? What is the correct protocol? If you have a really good relationship with the actor, talk to the actor. If you don't, but you have a good relationship with the director, talk to the director. If you have neither, talk to the AD. .02 nvt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason porter Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 LOL, clever. But it would actually be "Mehzda, eh" as for the mispronunciation of the sponsers name: I remember doing Mazda commercials with James Garner, and shooting to versions of everything: in Canada it is pronounced Mehzda... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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