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Help with my first Documentary


Ferdi

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Dear Sound guys and girls,

I'm about to start working on my first Doc. It  will be shot with the DVX-100A. I owe a small audio package,

(2x411 lectro,2x sennh G2, 416 and 816 mics, an X5 wendt mixer).

The producer wants to record Audio straight to camera. My question is, should I have a backup system, if so, what are my options? Any other gear I should get my hands on?

Thanks for your help.

Ferdi.

Ps. Mr Wexler, Thank you for putting this discission group together, I'm new to sound mixing and a discussion group like

yours is a dream come true.

Best regards.

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Your package sounds complete enough for a doc, I certainly had less on a few of my early shoots, but for sure back up your tracks to some recorder if you have one. The A2D and mic pre's on the dvx cams are better than most, but to be safe and not sorry later, back up your tracks to at least a dat. My 2 cents. Good luck and let us know how it works out.

Max. Respect, Old School

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Old School,

I don't understand this. If one is using one video camera, on which the sound is being recorded, what is the purpose in having a backup sound recorder? If there is an argument for this, doesn't it lead to an argument that there should be two cameras? Personally, I would have thought that the better argument would be that there should be a decent stand-alone sound recorder, which could also be used to wild sound (including voice), and that the video sound track should be the backup. No?

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Ideally (at least in my world) there should always be a stand-alone recorder and any sound elsewhere (ie camera) is the backup for THAT.  However, that's my world.  In reality, oftentimes when there's a one-person sound team the request (production's desire) is to just record straight to the camera.  However, as we all know cameras were not built for sound but for picture.  Sound was an afterthought added (in my mind) so the consumer could record family videos at home.  That we now consider doing professional work this way doesn't mean the sound recording capabilities of the cameras have drastically improved and are now the equal of our stand-alone machines.  While some manufacturer's have improved the sound recording abilities of their cameras that function still remains in the afterthought category.  I've heard enough horror stories (and been through some) where the fact that the mixer took it upon themselves to talk production into at least a DAT is what saved the day.  So, roll with the doc shoot, accept you are being forced to record audio onto a camera, but ALWAYS record to an alternate source that you have total control over and feed that to the camera.  After all, if the camera man switches the input from line>mic or knocks the inputs level settings way up without being aware of it the audio on the camera is most likely toast.  Also, make sure you have a slate in there so if you do have to reference your "back-up" your editor will be able to do a head sync instead of having to sync to production sound.  They may grumble a bit but just remind them you're doing it for them and most of the time they'll get over it.  Also, try and bring an extra pair of comtek headphone or an earbud to plug into the camera's headphone jack.  Sometimes you can talk the cameraman into wearing an earbud.  He may not be listening the way we do but if a switch gets knocked and the audio is distorting they'll usually notice that.

Good luck!

Sara

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Hey Redge, hows it going? The advice I gave was from my own experience's with prosumer cams, they record well enough if the dynamic range of your shoot isn't to great, but the recordings go south pretty fast when things get wild and loud. As to back up, I always concider my recording the master and the cameras audio a scratch track, I'm sure I could of explained my thoughts better, but since I hate to type and all I get lazy with my comments. I think producers and directors just want to load the video and audio in one pass into FCP or whatever and start putting their masterpiece together, which is ok, but with sound, like sex, protection is not a bad thing. It is hard to monitor the camera's audio(crappy headphone monitor) and one can make better judgements with a pro mix panel and or record deck. These are the reasons I suggested to Ferdi to back up the Dvx camera.

Max. Respect, Old School

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Ferdi,

The other thing to keep in mind is that the headphone jack on the camera is (as far as I know) a pre-tape monitor.  So in order to make sure everything is okay on the camera you will need to playback the tapes throughout the day (last take or whatever) in order to actually know whether or not you have a problem.  I would recommend doing this right after sending tone to the camera in the morning before the first take and then spot check throughout the day.

If you decide to use the G2's to transmit to camera you can set them up to have a -20db pad coming out of your mixer.  When you send your tone out of your mixer through this pad to the camera you can set your levels on the camera accordingly.  This is a neat trick when you're in an environment that may not be consistent with it's levels.  It's also an easy way of watching your back.

Sara

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  • 2 weeks later...

Dear friends,

I'd like to apologize to all of you that were kind enough to reply to my post ("Help with my first Documentary"),

for not getting back to you any sooner.

A BIG thanks to old school, redge, Sara Glaser, RVDMIXER, and Scott. Your observations, tech tips, and your wisdom were "are"

a big help. We start shooting the Doc in a week, and I'll keep you all posted.

Best regards,

Ferdi

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