ProSound Posted May 14, 2010 Report Share Posted May 14, 2010 What Timecode should I use if RED Camerais recording at 24fps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted May 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2010 Thanks it is TRUE 24 fps Does everyone else record 30NDF if it is a True 24FPS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted May 14, 2010 Report Share Posted May 14, 2010 " everyone else " ?? impossible to say, but lots of us; best to ask post what they want! confirming tests are a good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 Why on earth are they using TRUE 24? Films (actually shot on film) are commonly doing HD transfers and using a 23.98 work flow. It seems crazy to me that a RED show would choose 24 as a work flow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted May 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 Why on earth are they using TRUE 24? Films (actually shot on film) are commonly doing HD transfers and using a 23.98 work flow. It seems crazy to me that a RED show would choose 24 as a work flow. I agree 100 percent no one could give me a straight answer I asked twice to make sure that it was true 24 and it is. It is for TV too and cable at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobD Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 That's why Mike's advice is so dead on.... Because there is a hundred ways things are being done now... Cameras, work flows, on and on.... there is STILL no real protocol... WRITE post the question on what they want, then keep the email on file... Who knows what they're up to... My constant teaching on set has become laborious.... I went into a " I'll do whatever your post wants me to", unless it is plain stupid... M.O. So far so good.... I always run it by them.... always... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 I agree 100 percent no one could give me a straight answer I asked twice to make sure that it was true 24 and it is. It is for TV too and cable at that. Is this something new, because discussions I've had w/ DITs re the RED have had the DIT telling me that true 24 was not avail on the RED? More than one guy... Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MT Groove Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 I've been on a few RED shoots and I always notice this. The outboard monitor on the RED shows 24FPS while the tiny LCD screen on the back of the camera body shows 23.98. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Lezynski Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 True 24fps is available on RED.... However it would be a blunder to do so...... Unless SOMEBODY HOLDS A REALLY BIG GUN TO YOUR HEAD it shall be in EVERYONES best interest to record at 23.976...... No Foolin'..... Teeth gnashing and tears will result...... if the gun comes out then either record at full integer 24 or 30 ndf Dave Lezynski Video Engineer Oakland CA lezynski@mac.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted May 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 However it would be a blunder to do so I agree 100 percent every RED Project I have ever done but this was at 23.98 with my timecode at either 29.97 or 23.976 whatever post requested. This project was a series of blunders so it doesn't surprise me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted May 17, 2010 Report Share Posted May 17, 2010 If they demand 24.00 TC, I would get it in writing so there's no blame game later on. The last few Red projects I've done, I stick a "23.98" P-touch label on the left side of the front of the slate, where it says "FPS." Every crew I've worked with has automatically gone with 23.98 -- so far. BTW, note that the current big-budget Adam Sandler comedy, Grown Ups, was shot at 24.00fps and 24-frame timecode! In all my post experience, this is the only major project to do this so far (that I've seen). It works fine as long as the camera crew, sound crew, post crew, and editorial crew are all on the same page. (Note that Grownups was shot on Panavision Genesis, but the principle is the same.) --Marc W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Luis Diaz Posted June 8, 2010 Report Share Posted June 8, 2010 Hi, I've done all my last feature films with RED cameras running in real 24fps and TC was 24fps in both camera and sound recorder. No problem at all. All those movies were edited in FCP with a real 24fps Time Line. Sound post was done at the very same 24fps. Both FCPs and ProTools had 2 computer displays, no NTSC/PAL TV sets, so they could play perfectly well QTs @24fps. Once image was locked a transfer at 25fps (yes, PAL) were asked. Then digitized. That QuickTime was conformed to 24 fps (speed change) with Cinema Tools. So a one to one relationship between negative frames and QuickTime frames was obtained. The very same amount of frames in the neg were found in the QuickTime movie. No problem at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristotle_kumpis Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 Has anyone just ran audio right into the RED camera? If so, how did it turn out? I'd think for small productions that would work fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Palmer Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 >>>snip BTW, note that the current big-budget Adam Sandler comedy, Grown Ups, was shot at 24.00fps and 24-frame timecode! In all my post experience, this is the only major project to do this so far (that I've seen). It works fine as long as the camera crew, sound crew, post crew, and editorial crew are all on the same page. >>>snip I've done several things with 24 frame time code. In fact it's getting requested frequently. Not that unusual for film. But for video, that's a bit of a different story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Toline Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 Has anyone just ran audio right into the RED camera? If so, how did it turn out? I'd think for small productions that would work fine. I do that all the time for a particular client by their choice as they don't want to be bothered syncing up audio. For their internal corporate use it sounds fine using the camera audio. BTW, I feed the RED via hardwire. If they're happy, I'm happy. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristotle_kumpis Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 I do that all the time for a particular client by their choice as they don't want to be bothered syncing up audio. For their internal corporate use it sounds fine using the camera audio. BTW, I feed the RED via hardwire. If they're happy, I'm happy. Eric Thanks Eric. I just didn't know how the quality is going in with a hard line. For simple projects, I will try that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisnewton Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 I recently finished a RED true 24 production for a film out. 24 frame timecode was requested and that is what I delivered.I received written (e-mail) confirmation from the appropriate authorities (audio and picture post supervisors). I fed the camera guide track which was specified for editorial use only. All went well and the cheque didn't bounce. Chris Newton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 " Has anyone just ran audio right into the RED camera? If so, how did it turn out? " this has been discussed here before, do a search... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Toline Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Thanks Eric. I just didn't know how the quality is going in with a hard line. For simple projects, I will try that. Hardwire is always going to sound better and be more reliable than wireless and without any potential rf problems. As long as you adjust the input sensitivity on the camera to match the output from your mixer you should be fine. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Toline Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 " Has anyone just ran audio right into the RED camera? If so, how did it turn out? " this hasd been discussed here before, do a search... Another non-answer to the question asked. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Anderson Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Searching through the discussion is a great tool for finding not just the answer to the question you have but also for other potential issues. But I wonder if it would be possible on this board to have some sort of section of "white papers" (is that the right term?). A collection of reference guides. If that were possible, it would be a nice addition to the conversational education found in the message boards. It would also give Senator another auto-type answer "Check the reference section, peon." Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Searching through the discussion is a great tool for finding not just the answer to the question you have but also for other potential issues. But I wonder if it would be possible on this board to have some sort of section of "white papers" (is that the right term?). A collection of reference guides. If that were possible, it would be a nice addition to the conversational education found in the message boards. There is a section already, "Technical Reference" with the idea that it could be the repository of exactly what you are proposing (and "white papers" is a good term, though in the Internet age these sorts of compilations are often referred to as Wikis). The section here has been under-utilized to say the least but it isn't really anybody's fault, it is just that a forum-type site like this does not lend itself so much to this sort of library collection. Also, it would be a lot of work for someone to go through posts here, thousands of them since 2006, and extract, categorize, edit and publish this info into a special section. If individual members, on a post by post basis, could put things in this Technical Reference, Wiki area, then it would build itself. It is an excellent idea and I will look into what could be done. The other sites that I have, CinemaSound (and the new form the site might take in the next month) would allow for this sort of thing, but nobody seems to want to move anywhere off this site. Regards, Jeff Wexler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Anderson Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Oops. I tend to keep the main sections closed so I can easily get to the latest posts section. So I missed that. I would love to read "full length" reviews by members about working with certain cameras or equipment. But you're absolutely right that it would be a lot of work. And who wants to think about writing all of that after the job is done anyways? Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Oops. I tend to keep the main sections closed so I can easily get to the latest posts section. So I missed that. I would love to read "full length" reviews by members about working with certain cameras or equipment. But you're absolutely right that it would be a lot of work. And who wants to think about writing all of that after the job is done anyways? Josh You have to be careful w/ a section like Tech Ref etc though. The RED camera, among many, is a moving target and aspects of it are updated all the time, so the MO for us soundies changes too. Jeff can't be expected to update that section to the latest spec every time there is a change, so it is important to look at the DATE of any post there, and then search and see if there have been threads posted on the subject that are more recent. This state of constant change in video technology is one of the reasons why JWSound has become a minor "hobby" for a lot of us--it takes a lot of attention to keep up these days. Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glen Trew Posted June 25, 2010 Report Share Posted June 25, 2010 Unless post requests something different (in writing, by email), when a camera is shooting an actual 24 fps, your timecode should normally be 30nd. Your sampling freq should normally be 48.048 (though be careful with this because some recorders automatically adjust timecode when 48.048 is selected). These settings are to accommodate the pulled down target specs of 29.97 (or 23.976) and 48k. However, if possible, a conversation with post is always best, getting them to sign off on the specs (in writing). Glen Trew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.279748a58a2b862b7aa5f3b84126e232.png)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.