Richard Lightstone, CAS Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Thanks to Robert Kennedy of Coffey Sound, I'm testing a pair of the miniature supercardioid DPA 4098-BM's. Now known to be a 4081 I had a quick listen to one of them about a week ago and was blown away. First the quality of the small microphone was very close to a Schoeps 441. The size makes it ideal for concealment or as a plant microphone. In fact my real test will be in a Corvette, with two actors and I'll plant them off the visors. Their size is a distinct advantage over my preferred choice of a pair of Schoeps, either with a GVC or a collette cable. It is getting much more difficult to hide good sounding mics with the hand held camera craze inside an automobile. Here are the specs: Directional characteristics: Supercardioid Principle of operation: Pressure gradient Cartridge type: Pre-polarized condenser Frequency range, ± 2 dB: 40 Hz – 15 kHz Sensitivity, nominal, ±3 dB: 20 mV/Pa Equivalent noise level A-weighted: Typ. 20 dB(A) S/N ratio, re. 1 kHz at 1 Pa (94 dB SPL): 71 dB Total harmonic distortion (THD): <1 % up to 123 dB SPL peak; <1 % up to 120 dB SPL RMS sine Dynamic range: 100 dB Max. SPL, peak before clipping: 132 dB Output impedance: From MicroDot: 30 – 40 ohm, from DAD6001: 100 ohm Cable drive capability: 300 m (984 ft) with DAD6001 Output balance principle: Signal balanced with enclosed DAD6001 XLR adapter Common Mode Rejection Ratio (CMRR): > 60 dB at 50 Hz to 15 kHz with DAD6001 XLR adapter Power supply: 48 V phantom power ±4 V with DAD6001 XLR adapter Current consumption: 3.5 mA with DAD6001 XLR adapter Connector: MicroDot/XLR Color: Black Weight: 14 g (0.5 oz) Capsule diameter: 5.4 mm (0.2 in) Microphone length: 45 mm (1.8 in) Gooseneck length: 10cm (4 in.) Polarity: Positively increasing sound pressure produces positive going voltage at MicroDot pin (and pin 2 on DAD6001 XLR adapter) Operating temperature range: -40 °C to 45 °C (14 °F to 113 °F) Relative humidity: Up to 90 % I've attached my own photo, with a 25 cent coin for size reference. Pictured with the DPA is the micro dot Lectrosonics TA5 adaptor and the micro dot XLR connector. Also is a photo without the windscreen - to show you it's actual size. It appears to be a hollow tube and the microphone element is at the head of the cable. I'll fill you in on what the results are ASAP. But it looks like I'll be buying them to increase my arrows! Updated: Check out the comparison sound files in this post from "audio musings". Scroll down to the DPA test and listen to the recording. http://audiomusings....-the-dpa-4098h/ RL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 ...In fact my real test will be in a Corvette, with two actors and I'll plant them off the visors... Richard, Just a "head's up" about the vette. On the newest convertible vettes, there's a point where the top generates a very loud wind roar. Above 65 or so miles an hour, the sound can become almost unusable. I employed an omni planted in each visor, so I'd guess the hypers will help a bit. John Blankenship, CAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Lightstone, CAS Posted October 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 John, Thanks, but in our scene, the 'vette is caught in a huge L.A. traffic jam! It will hardly move and the top will be up. A month or so back we did several scenes ,"self drive", car to car with the top down. Now that was a challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 John, Thanks, but in our scene, the 'vette is caught in a huge L.A. traffic jam! It will hardly move and the top will be up. A month or so back we did several scenes ,"self drive", car to car with the top down. Now that was a challenge. Great, no wind noise issues at "stall" speed. As you know, the Vette has the advantage that the occupants are sitting so close to the visors -- that really helps compared to some vehicles. I'll be interested to hear how the DPAs work out for you. It would also be good to know how they do in a larger vehicle where the actors are sitting further from the visors. The directional pattern might help even more there. In my last dramatic venture with a full-sized car, I mostly used a Schoeps fastened to one visor and pointing out via a swivel from the center between the visors. Sure sounded better than any lav I've used for car rigs. John Blankenship, CAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan H. Chang Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Richard, Thank you for the test and review of the 4098! I use the 4099 week in/out during live performances and can't wait to try this when a car shot comes my way. I thought the Sennheiser 8000 series were small enough... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Thanks to Robert Kennedy of Coffey Sound, I'm testing a pair of the miniature supercardioid DPA 4098-BM's. I had a quick listen to one of them about a week ago and was blown away. First the quality of the small microphone was very close to a Schoeps 441. The size makes it ideal for concealment or as a plant microphone. RL I had a listen to these mics also at Coffey Sound a week or so ago. I thought they were pretty amazing but I could only speculate on how such a small microphone might work in the real world, on the job. I wanted to do some tests but now that Richard has actually used the mic I would love to get a brief review of how they actually sounded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DjGo Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 I very much like how they sound and how easy they can be concealed. I have two of the gooseneck-version.. I probably will be using them a lot as plantmics for the next feature I'm doing (not only carinteriors.. haha) I highly recommend them.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Interesting tool. Can't wait for a review or 2 or 3. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Visser Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 How is the 4098 different than the 4099? Is it just sensitivity or is there a qualitative difference too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Please let us know when you use these, and how they work out. I bought an MKH8040 in the hopes of using it for car work. I was disappointed, and actually just sold the mic because I found it was only useful in the same way my 50s were useful, and I was not pulling it out often enough to justify owning. I was hoping to reinvest the money in another option, and a pair of these DPA mics might be the ticket. I have been using COS11s or MKE2s in the visors, or wiring actors, because of Richard's noted issue with hand-held cameras, often on zoom lenses. While these can often be perfect, cars are a weird environment and having another good tool would be great. Proximity to the mics are a real issue in some circumstances, but I fear head-turns could be a problem with the supercardiods. Car work seems to be increasing these days for some reason. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Lightstone, CAS Posted October 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2010 I did do a very quick test of the DPA 4098, and Jeff posted my audio files in another thread here: http://jwsoundspace.weebly.com/media.html The two recordings are 1: A comparison of a Schoeps 6-41 on Left Channel and the DPA 4098 on the Right 2: DPA plugged into a Lectrosonics Sma transmitter (powered by that transmitter) Aside from the incredible quality for such a small microphone, I really enjoyed the ability to quickly connect it to the microdot XLR and plug it into a hardline cable (the way I prefer to work) into a 48v phantom input on my mixer. Then into a microdot TA5 adaptor for the Lectrosonics and have it work there without a hitch or the need for a Denecke 48v PS (or other brand) as an added box. It is even easier than the famous 48v phantom Audio limited “Cigar†that we all used to use and rave about! This is a great new ultra miniature, wonderfully sounding addition to our “toolboxâ€. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted October 28, 2010 Report Share Posted October 28, 2010 Thanks Richard. Sounds good through my headphones on the set. I want to listen in my studio later. Seems like it would come in handy. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter775 Posted October 28, 2010 Report Share Posted October 28, 2010 I´m confused. Where did you get this mic? It´s not even mentioned on the DPA website. Is it some kind of prototype or are you talking about the hanging mic 4098H? The one on your pics looks like the 4081 (cardioid) http://dpamics.com/?p=194 Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted October 28, 2010 Report Share Posted October 28, 2010 I´m confused. Where did you get this mic? It´s not even mentioned on the DPA website. Is it some kind of prototype or are you talking about the hanging mic 4098H? The one on your pics looks like the 4081 (cardioid) I believe it is the 4081 which uses some of the same technology as the existing "hanging" gooseneck mic. Coffey Sound had the stereo kit, 2 matched microphones and all the accessories, and this is what I think Richard was testing. Regards, Jeff Wexler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 I think we all know it is actually the DPA 4081 that we have been testing. Don Coufal and Moe Chamberlain did some testing with the DPA and a Schoeps mounted together in car --- one mounting scheme was your typical visor mount, the other was low on the console, about chest height. I have posted the files on the JWSOUNDSPACE website under the "Media" heading. I put up poly files with the DPA on the left and the Schoeps on the right. You will need to have a balance control on playback to evaluate this test since the microphones were placed very close together. I also put up the mono files to listen to just each microphone individually. Later I will put up the tracks while driving. - Jeff Wexler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 Later I will put up the tracks while driving. Please don't -- that's dangerous! Pull over and stop first. JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted November 9, 2010 Report Share Posted November 9, 2010 I think we all know it is actually the DPA 4081 that we have been testing. Don Coufal and Moe Chamberlain did some testing with the DPA and a Schoeps mounted together in car --- one mounting scheme was your typical visor mount, the other was low on the console, about chest height. I have posted the files on the JWSOUNDSPACE website under the "Media" heading. I put up poly files with the DPA on the left and the Schoeps on the right. You will need to have a balance control on playback to evaluate this test since the microphones were placed very close together. I also put up the mono files to listen to just each microphone individually. Later I will put up the tracks while driving. - Jeff Wexler Thanks for this Jeff. I wish that you had included an omni lav in the test, since that's what many of us use, and I'd love to hear it side-by-side. But this test is very revealing. I must say that the DPA is pretty darn good (listening over speakers), and I found it better for the yelling back at the kids. I also found the overhead DPA to be more agreeable than the low-mounted Schoeps. It's not as warm and lovely as the overhead Schoeps when directly "on mic", but it's impressive for sure and much easier to hide and cheaper. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Lightstone, CAS Posted November 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 Jeff thanks for posting the latest test performed by Don Coufal and Moe Chamberlain. I did purchase the DPA 4081 (it sells as a pair) and the first day back from hiatus we used it in a truck scene on the backlot. Yes the windows were open and they drive in talking, stop, talk and then drive out. I was happy once again. In response to Robert's queries, I'd like to say that first, why compare the quality of an omni microphone against the obvious superior pickup of either cardioid microphone like the Schoeps or the DPA 4081? The reason I did my first comparison (very rough) with a Schoeps CMC641 and the DPA was to see how close they were in quality. Yes, a Schoeps does sound much warmer and fuller, however these tests and then practical use for me is about getting a similarly close audio quality with a markedly smaller microphone. Contributing to my decision to purchase the DPA 's was the speed to mount them and the simplicity of powering them as well. In my case plugged directly into Lectrosonic SMa's, with no added power supplies needed (i.e Denecke 48V or other brands). DPA has microdot adapters for all the popular brands of wireless - what a terrifically simple and effective concept. Now that you have had the opportunity to listen to mine and the Coufal-Chamberlain audio tests - go to your favorite audio dealer and try them out your self. To me it's not the price point, but the peace of mind to be able to hide a good sounding microphone with far less effort; that makes any price worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthias Richter Posted November 10, 2010 Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 Anyone tested the DPA 4081 on a Zaxcom TRX 900AA directly? Specs saying it needs 5V and Zaxcom outputs 3.3V ... Matthias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted November 10, 2010 Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 " Specs saying it needs 5V and Zaxcom outputs 3.3V " that would lead me to believe it would not work well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPSharman Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 In response to Robert's queries, I'd like to say that first, why compare the quality of an omni microphone against the obvious superior pickup of either cardioid microphone like the Schoeps or the DPA 4081? I don't doubt the superiority, but since cars are a weird acoustic environment to begin with, and since half of the omni pattern is typically eradicated in the headliner, I thought a comparison might be interesting. Sometimes I find the results of my MKE2s to be rather remarkable. Sometimes not. I am also curious about the planting possibilities of this mic outside a car. I bought an 8040 with hopes of planting the mic, but found the pattern too easily picked up the reflection of sound from surfaces near the mic, making the sound unacceptable to me. Wondering if the 4081 is better at that too. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffmjones Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 So you bought and used the 4081's and not the 4098H Hanging Choir Mikes... Why did you go 4081 when the 4080 Cardiod is available? I have switched over to Zaxcom Zaxpaq's with QRX100's and Mutliplexor and the CUB's don't wire/wirelessly to the 900LTH .... Since I use 4071, 4060, 4006, 4007, 4023, 5100 DPA Mike, 4099 Series mikes on all sorts of things... The Cardiod 4080 which we use on Exec's for Events sometimes, seem like a better pattern choice... And these 4098H Choir Mikes look interesting too...has anyone tried these? And has anyone used any of these mikes with Zaxcom RF TX units? Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffmjones Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 Also the D-Fine Cardiod headsets are fantastic....sold the 4088's...though 4088's are better for singers that move around.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffmjones Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 Has anyone tried the MMC2011 Twin Diaphragm Cardioid Microphone Capsule With their "collette" type cable and compact preamps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boomboom Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 "I've attached my own photo, with a 25 cent coin for size reference. Pictured with the DPA is the micro dot Lectrosonics TA5 adaptor and the micro dot XLR connector. Also is a photo without the windscreen - to show you it's actual size. It appears to be a hollow tube and the microphone element is at the head of the cable." I can't find these pictures Richard... ? A pic of the actual 4098-BM would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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