color of sticks/slate

[Jeff New Jersey]

Basic Question....Please be nice....

Even with working for 15 years as a soundie and making a good enough living I have never owned a slate.

If I was to have only 1. Looking at denecke ts-c would people suggest color stix or black and white.  I assume black and whit is easier to see in lower light.....

Thanks all......

[studiomprd]

this has been discussed here before, try a couple of searches...

so: which do you like better??

[Eric Toline]

Basic Question....Please be nice....

Even with working for 15 years as a soundie and making a good enough living I have never owned a slate.

If I was to have only 1. Looking at denecke ts-c would people suggest color stix or black and white.  I assume black and whit is easier to see in lower light.....

Thanks all......

While the colors look pretty they are not "color bars". Either one works for it's intended purpose.

Eric 

[Jeff New Jersey]

Did searches here, and I guess that I understand. black and white seem to be more helpful for editors.

Color seems to be helpful for very basic color check (but not really counted on) instead color chart should be relied on.....

So I guess color stix just look cooler, but black and white are most useful......

I guess then the question is anyone ever get shit for having one version then the other.......

[studiomprd]

" ever get shit ... "

never!

[John Blankenship]

Did searches here, and I guess that I understand. black and white seem to be more helpful for editors.

Color seems to be helpful for very basic color check (but not really counted on) instead color chart should be relied on.....

So I guess color stix just look cooler, but black and white are most useful......

I guess then the question is anyone ever get shit for having one version then the other.......

In my experience it's been a total non-issue.  I've never given it a single thought while on set and no one's ever said a word.

I think both of mine are B&W, but it's such a non-issue that I'd have to check to confirm that.

John B., CAS

[Jeff New Jersey]

Thanks for your opinion guys, from your helpful responses it seems  what ever I choose I shouldn't loose sleep over it.

Love this board.....

happy holidays all

 

[Eric Toline]

Thanks for your opinion guys, from your helpful responses it seems  what ever I choose I shouldn't loose sleep over it.

Love this board.....

happy holidays all

B&W is very "Film Noir" if that helps you make a decision. ;-))

Eric

[maplecap]

I despise color sticks, but my background is primarily camera dept/cinematography. I would not want anything in front of the camera that might be perceived as or misused as a color reference by someone in post - just proper charts with notes. Old school, simple, high contrast B&W sticks are, IMO, the established professional standard.

A mixer is not likely to hear any moaning on set for supplying a TC slate with color sticks. In fact, I believe Denecke sells far more slates with color sticks than B&W. Lots of people think they are "cool," and that's why they make them. But there are those who frown on them, particularly in post, based on what I've heard/read.

[Marc Wielage]

Maplecap above is 100% right. Nobody at the lab or in digital dailies wants to see colored sticks (or, excuse me, "sticks of color").

B&W sticks are great, and I've used them before as a neutral reference for dailies when we couldn't get a grayscale chart on camera in post. That's assuming they weren't using gelled lights on the set.

The reality is that post is happy if the TC numbers are right, they can read the slate, and see and hear the clap!

--Marc W.

[Jeff New Jersey]

ok so I did loose sleep over it anyway, I should get some more hobbies, so waking up this morning and reading marc and maplecaps post the question.......

Then with the logic you guys have given me  I surmise that a dumb slate should always be black and white, easier to see bottom line .........

And a smart slate being black and white would make everyone happy-  but it wouldnt truly matter color is fine-but if you want your editor/lab to be happy go b&w....Why did they make color......does any production workflow ever request it.

[johngooch]

ok so I did loose sleep over it anyway, I should get some more hobbies, so waking up this morning and reading marc and maplecaps post the question I now then have.......

I understand  that editors like B And W for syncing.....And a camera department doesnt want  color stixs to be used for color correction in any way.............So........With a smart slate even if the code is not correct wouldnt the clap trigger a code indication that the stix have closed so would that be almost an easier way to sync the sound rather then visually trying to figure out the clap......Or in practicality is the stix closing a  better way to syn when the code is not syncing .....(I am absolutely not a post guy

just trying to learn more from you guys.)

And I sumise that a dumb slate should always be black and white .........

Clap is always helpful.  Code or no code.  Some modern systems can work via the clap only. Pluralize needs no code or clap however, i have heard editorial say that the clap helps the pluralize process.  When in doubt, get a nice solid clap.  It works.  B/W vs Color sticks.  It does not matter.

[Marc Wielage]

When in doubt, get a nice solid clap.

Dailies are one of the rare instances where I would say "it's good to get the clap."

--Marc W.

[Jim Feeley]

DSC Labs, who make the industry standard charts, have a product called SlateMate that lets you add some color bar and grayscale references to your slate. Interesting idea, though I don't recall seeing a slate with SlateMate in the wild...

More info and a picture:

http://dsclabs.com/slatemate.htm

[maplecap]

DSC Labs, who make the industry standard charts, have a product called SlateMate that lets you add some color bar and grayscale references to your slate. Interesting idea, though I don't recall seeing a slate with SlateMate in the wild...

I suspect you haven't encountered that item because it would not be particularly useful or practical in most professional "artistic" production. Generally, the point of shooting color or other exposure and test charts is to use them as a point of reference and calibration in post; analogous to a 1K tone in sound. During actual shooting the DP or videographer purposefully alters exposure, employs filters or camera settings affecting color accuracy, uses lighting of varying color temperature, etc. Slates are usually shot in the process of "creativity" and are not shot "accurately," like a properly lit chart in prep or on the head of a roll or whatever. Just being able to read a slate in post is success. In focus, well lit, perfectly exposed, and so on? Sure

If one was shooting run and gun doc style work, something like that might be of benefit. Or if you just want color sticks and you want them to mean something, of course.

[studiomprd]

if the camera dept, or post, wants something like that (the DSC), they can purchase it!

[Jim Feeley]

DSC charts are great and we work with them a fair amount. But since I work in professional "artistic" documentary production, there's not always the will, time, or possibility to consistently shoot a chart. Of course, in many of those situations, we're not working with a slate, either.

But the OP was asking about color slate, and that reminded me of seeing the SlateMate at NAB, so there you go.

Jim

[maplecap]

Jim, just to be clear, I chose the word "artistic" and put it in quotes to use in the context of typical narrative or creative cinematography or videography, where the look is not necessarily supposed to be photo-realistic or what the human eye sees. Slates are usually shot during that process, with filters in place and dramatic lighting, etc., and thus any color calibration or reference chart captured while shooting a scene is often pointless for its conventional use. And, as I said in my first reply, potentially dangerous.

[Jeff New Jersey]

Hey Guys,

You converted me I sent back my new color stix, for B and W.  You can know your influence  gave a win for the labs.

Now I can sleep.

Jeff