Zoom F8 Mixer/Controller Options

[DHB]

"..Of course if you change the values of them by any other method (would also be true if you changed it via the iPad)  [my emphasis] then the position they're on would no longer be an accurate reflection of what they actually are, until they "catch up" again."

 

(I think this'll be my last comment ABOUT THE FRC-8, as I've been writing MY OWN appraisal, and I realise that others may, of course, have their own, and entirely different, appraisals..)

 

No, IronFilm.. what I've pointed out - and shown with photos on the previous page - is that the iPad implementation ..look, here's one of those photos again..

 

                                 

 

..is that the iPad implementation has separate controls  for Trim/Gain and for Panning. The virtual knobs for those two operations are separate and distinct on the iPad: the highlighted knob under Input 5, for example, is EXCLUSIVELY for Trim/Gain so its position always accurately reflects the degree of Gain set by that (virtual) knob.

 

The iPad L/R Panning controls are directly beneath those (virtual) Gain knobs, are EXCLUSIVELY for Panning, and also always accurately reflect the immediately visible amount of Left/Right Pan set by the (virtual) horizontal slider. So - unlike on the FRC-8 Controller - those iPad controls are ALWAYS "..an accurate reflection of what they actually are" ..and without any need to "catch up" again.

 

Anyway, that's my appraisal and comparison, as promised on Page 1 of this topic - after having asked the Zoom rep why the Controller had been abandoned by Zoom, and then actually buying one to discover what it can, and cannot, do. It has no screen of its own, for example, so one has to keep referring to the small F8 screen when using Menus, etc, whereas the iPad version BECOMES A HUGE SCREEN and makes everything so much simpler to select in Menus, for example (..just like the iPhone did away with physical buttons).

 

That's my take on the FRC-8 ..the link to the seller on AliExpress is still there on the previous page, so anyone can try all of this for themselves and can say what conclusions THEY  reach.

 

Thanks for all your comments.

 

 

[IronFilm]

Of course software sliders / dials can always reflect the true values (it is software implemented), unlike physical sliders / knobs because they're not motorized. (to make them motorized would have skyrocketed the price, just like if displays were added to it that would also cause a big increase. Plus there are good reasons why you might not want motorized faders)

 

If you only use the F Control for its purposes, and are not also adjusting the values elsewhere, then you'll never run into this issue of "mismatched values". 

 

You really don't need the iPad at the same time. As the Zoom F Control already shows you so much and gives you much control over your mixer: 

 

 

 

 

But if you really want to, you can use both at the same time (you can even use a full size keyboard too! To really make your life even easier on set):

 

 

Again, I highly recommend reading the manual for it 🙂 You'll learn a lot. 

Then have another read of this thread, you'll likely understand it better and be able to do a better workflow and deliver a better product too at the end of the day. 

 

[The Immoral Mr Teas]

Thanks Iron Film for the 4 youtube/Gotham videos

 

Although I'm not a great enthusiast when it comes to tutorial vids, I'm sure to watch through them at some point (particularly if I decide to -try to- buy an FRC8 myself some time).

 

And despite the to-ing and fro-ing I've found it quite an informative thread from all sides so thanks again DHB for sharing the AliExpress link, for your updates on delivery and indeed your own user experience.

 

Jez

[IronFilm]

12 hours ago, The Immoral Mr Teas said:

And despite the to-ing and fro-ing I've found it quite an informative thread from all sides so thanks again DHB for sharing the AliExpress link, for your updates on deliver

Yes, I know firsthand that DHB has helped several people thanks to finding that aliexpress link and verifying it is as legit Zoom F Controller. 

[DHB]

You're welcome.

[DHB]

Hi - again.

 

Follow up, Summary and Coda, after a week or so’s pause, while doing other things..

 

My 'Factory Reset’ of my F8 had wiped all the settings - of course - and so I went back to First Principles, and assumed that NOTHING was set the way I wanted it - so I started completely afresh.

 

‘Factory Reset’ wiped out the Bluetooth Connectivity software in the F8, so I re-downloaded the F8 Bluetooth Add-on ‘Software Extension’ and re-installed that. That gave me back the Bluetooth connectivity for using the iPad:   https://tinyurl.com/F8Bluet00th

 

‘Factory Reset’, of course, did reset the date settings to US instead of UK, and all my other chosen settings, and crucially - though I hadn’t noticed - ‘Track 1-8 (Poly WAV)’ had become the default recording option, instead of my ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’ ..meaning that only my ISOs were being recorded, and it was by-passing the FRC-8 Faders ..thus NOTHING was recorded through the FRC-8 Faders into the L/R Mix.

 

The FRC-8 Faders now DO give a live mix, after having reset the F8 to ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’ ..and up to the maximum gain set by each input’s Trim/Gain knob.

 

In answer to Philip’s question (previous page) “How is the fader latency vs the iPad?” I can say that there’s no more latency, or lag, using the Bluetooth Zoom Controller app on an iPad (..or even iPhone!..) compared with the USB-wired FRC-8 physical Controller ..meaning NO latency at all - all adjustments, either by Bluetooth or by USB have no more lag than using the physical dials on the F8 itself ..they’re smooth and instantaneous. (There isn’t, presumably, the processing that’s involved in translating analog *audio* to digital, and un-converting it, as when using Bluetooth mics or cans. All that is transmitted and received from and to the F8 is just straight digital commands.)

 

Incidentally, nowhere, except in a small box on page 25 of the F8 Manual, does it show WHAT EXACTLY the various types of FILE FORMATS deliver in recordings.

 

And nowhere does the small box on page 25 state that Tracks 1-8 will be recorded WITHOUT any Fader adjustment, but with input Gain adjustable only via the Trim/Gain knobs ..and ONLY the (virtual) FADERS of the F8 will provide the additional L/R mix when using ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’. As the virtual faders of the F8 recorder (reached by twiddling the rotating Menu Knob until what you want is highlighted, then pressing to engage) are so awkward to enable - and then only adjustable one-by-one - they were hardly manageable on the F8 recorder itself. The FRC-8 ‘Controller’, with its all-simultaneously-usable physical  faders and Bluetooth app gave hope that a real-time fader mix was easily feasible.

 

I’m sorry that I said that the FRC-8 Controller is “..devised by some capricious, hellish, nincompoop..” ..that should, instead, be redirected at the F8’s software writer(s), who should have made the ‘Factory Reset’ default to ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’ - i.e; including  a Fader L/R Mix - instead of defaulting to just ‘Track 1-8 (Poly WAV)’ ..which is ISOs ONLY ..negating the whole purpose of the physical faders on the FRC-8 Controller !

 

I’m thinking of putting online an F8-plus-FRC-8 ‘mini bible’ about these elementary points ..and at some time I might ask for comments and maybe proof-readings.

 

My bible would say “Here’s how to record separate ISO (isolated) tracks, set by each Input’s individual Trim/Gain knob,*PLUS* a live mix with Faders: in the Main Menu choose ‘REC’, then ‘Rec to SD1’ (..or SD2 and/or Rec to both SD cards..) and set the recording format to *Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)*. (If you do want ONLY ISO (individually selected isolated) input tracks - but with NO actual live fader mix - then choose ‘Track 1-8 (Poly WAV)’ instead.)”

 

I’m old school, and for me the live mix is the *essential* recording, not the the ISOs, which I treat as backups. And - like Jeff says: “..I am still baffled how anyone could work without doing a mix, whether anyone else wants the track or not. If you have more than one source that is contributing to the scene, if you're not mixing what are you doing? Do you just keep flipping the PFL whenever that person is talking? Do you just monitor with every source (microphone) open so you know you've got something? … I said that the way I know my individual sources are working properly or clean (whether it is a boom mic, a lav or a plant) is when I bring that source into my mix, because I need it, and it sounds good!”      [https://tinyurl.com/Jeff-150s]

 

So now, with ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’ re-enabled, my FRC-8 IS tracking a mix through the physical faders on the FRC-8 hardware ‘Controller’.

 

I should have looked to see if the Factory Reset had wrecked the F8’s recording mode - it had - and I should have gone through *every* setting to correct things in the destructive wake of ‘Factory Reset’ ..that was my own fault or oversight.

 

I can now whole-heartedly recommend the FRC-8 ‘Controller’ which CAN mix on the fly, as long as ‘Track 1-8 + L/R (Poly WAV)’ is the - correctly set - recording preference ..and wholeheartedly recommend the Bluetooth app, too.

 

For now, Th-th-th-that’s All, Folks!