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hello hello... lav mic techniques


B_Van_Deusen
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Glad I just found this thread, now I don't feel so noob and alone with having the same troubles lol.  Just got done with a small indoor office shoot having to deal with suit & tie type starchy clothes.  These office wardrobe type shoots have been my bane so far with trying to lav my TR-50's with.  I've been trying many different techniques to the point where I can stop the physical rubbing of the clothing and mic, but silencing the actual clothing rubbing itself is another story.  I have heard tips about using a spray like scotch guard or is it static guard to soften up the clothes, also dampening the areas near the mic's placement.  Have any of you done this before with success? 

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Here is what I do:

Countryman EMW with Moleskin for anyone wearing a T-Shirt or Soft Fabric in non windy conditions. 1st choice for very sweaty people or dangerous situations for gear like a Shooting range. Since microphones are cheap and can be hidden quickly first choice for reality tv

Sanken cos-11 For all other situations using either moleskin or RM-11 Rubber mount. Sanken work great with windscreens in windy situations

Countryman B6- Upside down in tie knot anytime someone is wearing a suit period best way to eliminate noisy wardrobe is hide mic in plain sight. Will Also use B6 through a button hole on shirt if shirt is very noisy.

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Hey Zack, I hate to say it, but ditch the trams and get some Sankens.  I had Trams for some years and always felt ill whenever I was faced with business suits and ties.  It's very difficult to make a tram silent in any situation other than a nice thin cotton or wool shirt.  The Sankens are much quieter!  You still have to work on some placements and nasty synthetics will still hose you, but I'd say it's at least twice as easy to set a Cos  11 than a tram...

cheers,

Brent Calkin

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Thanks all.  Going to get some sankens later down the road once I get the $, but I did just exchange the trams for some B3's in the mean time.

B3's are very underrated good sounding lavs. A little bigger than the B6 with the same advantages of water resistance and interchangeable frequency adjusting caps.

Eric

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I also feel that i get better results with the sanken Lav's. i used the trams for a while but once i started using the sanken's it has been easier for me to tackle clothing rustle.

IMO Sanken works better in exterior than the B6.

As many said it depends on the situation and it's always fun to nail it with out any clothing.

In a project I worked on, there was an interior shot and the character was the sphinx. No clothes, only attached wings! So I used the B6 at her hairline attached with a bobby-pinned as Jason said(I had to readjust it too between the takes). It worked perfect. Even on the close ups you can't see the mic.

I did a documentary that the main character was a chef. He was wearing the typical chef jacket ( http://www.chefwear.com/store/item.asp?ITEM_ID=64&DEPARTMENT_ID=5& ). For that I hide the B6 beneath the upper button and it worked fine.

For suits I hide it on the knob - tie. I was talking to an experienced mixer and told me that during pre you can ask the wardrobe for ties made with the thin cloth so you can place the mic beneath the tie.  On the wide shots you can place the mic on the upper side of the tie. The camera most probably won't see it.

I'm eager to use the ear technique and hear how it sounds.

Best regards,

Marco

 

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So I got my B3's in today, and gave them a good test.  I had my girlfriend wear one of my very noisy shirt and ties, running around the house with the B3 in the tie knot.  I must say you guy were right, what a difference with the reduction of clothing noise, not to mention a very nice sounding mic.  Only problem I have so far is I bought two of their "Viper Clips" and I can't seem to get the B3 cable into the mount without nearly destroying the cable.  Has anyone used these clips before?

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So I got my B3's in today, and gave them a good test.  I had my girlfriend wear one of my very noisy shirt and ties, running around the house with the B3 in the tie knot.  I must say you guy were right, what a difference with the reduction of clothing noise, not to mention a very nice sounding mic.  Only problem I have so far is I bought two of their "Viper Clips" and I can't seem to get the B3 cable into the mount without nearly destroying the cable.  Has anyone used these clips before?

I've got the B6s and have the same issue with the viper clip.  I carefully stretched them open a bit more.  Can't remember what I used, perhaps the straight end of a large paper clip.  You want something that is round and not too large.  I think they have the same clip for the B3 and the B6 so its probably even tighter on your B3.  Not a great design anyway IMO .

Bernie

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On recommendation from a cameraman friend of mine, I used the RM-11 Sanken rubber mount inside the tie knot the other day. Worked a treat!

I usually just have the head of the COS-11 poking out of the bottom of the knot, but obviously this doesn't work with a bit of breeze outdoors. Having the COS-11 in the tie knot with the RM-11 rubber mount was perfect.

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Well said Rob.

I think the original poster was using Sony mikes and that may not be helpfull.

My love is Trams, Sonotrims and B6's.

I do have COS 11's but rarely use them.

Totally agree with headphone listening versus the result on speakers, strange but true.

Cheers

Mike

www.mikewestgatesound.co.nz

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello again,

I made this thread almost 3 years ago and am glad to see that the topic is still pretty fresh, the last post was just over a month ago!

Anyways, since i discovered COS 11 mics they are really the only ones i use, with trams around for backup.  I experimented with B6's for a bit, but only found them very useful indoors, exposed in plain sight. But COS11 usually do the trick.  I've gotten used to them enough that i can usually tell how they will sound before placing them.  They tape on with transpore very easily to the chest or the shirt, and can easily be sandwiched between two shirts.  In situations with very hairy chests i've asked wardrobe to put an undershirt on the actor.

In a narrative situation i think its important to inspect the wardrobe and collaborate with that department before costumes have been established. Most wardrobe folk are willing to make simple changes that will really help you (and the film), as long as you don't get in their way too much.  I've also found locking off layers using topstick or other adhesive helps, as well as locking down any kind of necklace - rappers often have the heavy chains that reverberate the sound of it clicking over the notches.

Joe's sticky stuff (or resin tape) is another great tool to have around with the COS 11 (or i would imagine any lav).  You can wrap it around the mic to put under collars or in between layers, and it acts as the same kind of buffer as the RM11 but its also a strong adhesive.  I had to mic a car racing suit and i used it to lock the mic under the zipper flap, it held it away from the fabrics and kept the wind out as well.

There is a point where the wardrobe is un-micable, and then i try the hair.  A hairstylist showed me a nice trick where she took two locks of hair, used the mic cable as the third lock and braided it down a bit to keep the mic from slipping - which often happens with bobby pins.

If the hair can't work, and i've run out of tricks, i decide the lav is no good and move on.  If the boom is fine and/or they are getting a lot of coverage, then i may not even mention it or offer it as a note, but not a real problem.  If there is a real problem, then i try to let whoever can help fix it know as soon as possible before i've run out of time and you start to hear the three dreaded words "waiting on sound."

is it static guard to soften up the clothes, also dampening the areas near the mic's placement. "itis static guard, to eliminate static electricity, and a mist of waterto dampen and thus soften...with the concurrence of wardrobe. "

-never tried this but sounds like it will help

Best,

Brett

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care to share picture of the button hole technic?

No picture but here's how it's done. Bring the head of the B6 through the

unbuttoned button hole from inside the shirt. Rebutton the the shirt and pull on the B6 cable until the capsule is hidden by the button, you can tape the cable to the inside of shirt as a strain relief.

Eric

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